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New Protozoa: Possible Cause of ME/CFS. An Interview with Dr.Steven Fry.

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by Gamboa, Jul 2, 2012.

  1. justy

    justy Senior Member

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    Surely what he means is that we will make poor choices based on what the microbes/pathogens require to stay alive - rather than the microbes literally taking over our minds. For example it is well known that a yeat overgrowth will cause sugar and carb cravings as the yeast requires a high sugar diet to thrive. But yes i agree - maybe he overstates it - its not as if microbes have brains!

    Justy.
     
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  2. wallace

    wallace

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    Lets be balanced what K is saying doesnt compare to the wild assertions of Teitalbaum in the first edition of From Fatigued to fantatastic on the personality of cfs. Or the widespread view among some that ME is a form of chronic depression etc. I dont know if he is right but I dont know he is wrong either! This is early days in comprehending our illness
     
  3. wallace

    wallace

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    Some more from Dr K. I agree with him about high protein diets being a disaster. Also XMRV he says is a huge waste of time, agreed! He is a bit overwhelming on other issues!
     
  4. wallace

    wallace

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  5. sianrecovery

    sianrecovery Senior Member

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    My craving for sugar has never stopped tormenting me...agree Klinghart has flashes of brilliance...also think he is, to put it politely, on the make. If a psychiatrist said what is attributed to him in that quote, we would be outraged at the sterotyping involved and the assumption that if the patient rejects his treatment they are possessed by microbes.
    The brain does change - I've been in recovery for a long time, but some of the stuff from my addiction seems to now be hardwired in. Having said that, neural plasticity and regeneration are some of the surprises of brain science over the last decade, so maybe as we heal, we heal?
     
  6. wallace

    wallace

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    Sure Sian, we can heal!! A la the book of Norman -forgot his surname. Obviously connected to this is the idea that mental illness has an infectious origin, or indeed most illness......Klinghardt does do a form of family constellation psychotherapy a la Bert Heller as well.
     
  7. wallace

    wallace

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    Yep Norman Doidge the brain changes itself
     
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  8. baccarat

    baccarat Senior Member

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    The trouble with human beings, is that we think to be masters of the universe. We consider other creatures sort of irrelevance although we know very little of what's really going on around us or inside of us.

    Microbes have not a brain or intelligence as we intend it. However they have a biochemical intelligence that has allowed them to evolve successfully over time by manipulating host's behaviour. I suspect they do this by influencing brain biochemistry in the host.
    They may have even driven human evolution. In other words, we are what we are also because of their influence.
    http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2011/11/16/did-parasites-drive-human-evolution/
     
  9. sianrecovery

    sianrecovery Senior Member

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    Actually, one of the things Doc Fry speculated on during my consult was whether protomyzoa evolved alongside us and even may have had a symbiotic relationship with us in certain climates. And if they grew up with us when we had a heavily fat/meat orientated diet (I'm not convinced most of us did, but definitely in certain niches) maybe that's why he finds they thrive on fats. Maybe, maybe...
     
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  10. wallace

    wallace

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    This echoes Buhner s statement here:http://betterhealthguy.com/joomla/189buhner
    that he seeks an accommadation with the disease rather simply trying to completely eradicate it. This is not defeatism but as Buhner points out it is step outside of a military model.

    Now Fry has taken this a step further putting in focusing on the importance of dietary strategies. In the www.rawfoodsolution.com a cfs sufferer mentions mono fruit diets.

    To my mind the work of Colin Campbell,Dean Ornish and many others have proved the efficacy of Vegan low fat diets in treating heart disease. Bill Clinton is no fool!!!!

    In other words I dont think this is a magic drug out there! A magic cure all!

    When people talk about doing a parasite cleanse for a month they dont realise we need a lifetime strategy to deal with this problem via diet etc. Fry and Buhner understand this.
     
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  11. wallace

    wallace

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  12. Rand56

    Rand56 Senior Member

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    Ok I read this Fry interview. Either I'm too dumb, I'm missing something, or something just does not make logical sense to me in what he says.

    He says that possible transmission of this protozoa could either be from mosquitos, ticks, or from water or food contamination. Then he says....

    "Younger dogs don’t have it, the older dogs have it. And so we think the same thing we will find in humans. Younger humans don’t have it, older humans do. So, that was a small study, about eight or nine dogs, one cat. Actually, we looked at one cat, one cat did not have it, the cat was two years old. But the dogs, the older dogs had it, the younger dogs didn’t."

    Excluding the fact that he is basing his assumption on such a small study, and if it is possible to acquire it thru the above listed transmissions, then why could it not be possible to find it in either younger dogs or younger humans?

    Is it because younger dogs and younger humans have stronger immune systems to help eradicate this protozoa? If it isn't that, then I don't quite understand the logic here. Anyone care to explain?
     
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  13. Hanna

    Hanna Senior Member

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    Yes, perhaps, when immune system is strong, then biofilm can't buil-up and elimination of protozoa is easier.
     
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  14. wallace

    wallace

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    I agree with Hanna.
    DrDavid jernigans page on fb is worth signing up for, this is todays post and relates to our vasular problem. Hopefully Dr Fry and others work using raw food etc etc allows to avoid surgery to deal with this. . Any thoughts anyone?




    DrDavid Jernigan
    Health tip of the day: I have used the analogy for years and it still stands strong. Killing Lyme bacteria can be liked to killing termites in the walls of your house. Just killing the termites does nothing to repair the damage in the wood. Many people have hit the Lyme bacteria with every known antibiotic, every natural anti-microbial remedy, and every Rife frequency for years in their pursuit of the quality of health they seek. The reality is that the infection may be minimal or even theoretically gone after all of the barrage of "killing" bugs, yet these infections don't just sit there doing nothing, they directly or indirectly damage tissues in the body.

    One of our recent discoveries is that it appears the Lyme bacteria can infect and damage the valves in the jugular veins and other veins that drain blood out of the head and neck. The damage remains after all the infections have be cleared out. The damaging of the valves inside of these major veins creates blood stagnation and ballooning of the vein.

    There is no good way to look at this condition and say this is a good situation. The following is a You Tube video of this condition that ultimately leads to many systemic and neurological symptoms that are generally lumped together as MS but the actual cause of the damage leading to the symptoms can be infections in the veins.

     
  15. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

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    I thought he was implying that the longer you've been around, the more likely you are to have come into contact with one of the vectors. Or perhaps that it takes time to grow to detectable levels.
     
  16. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

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    To add to the current diet revolution I would say that during the first two years of my illness I was actaully on the McDougall diet. I felt much better then. But is that just because the illness naturally gets worse over time? I don't know. After the first two years I decided to try Paleo since that is what is almost always recommended for PWC's. That conicided with the illness getting worse. Chance or not I don't know.
     
  17. Hanna

    Hanna Senior Member

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    I have been worse also on paleo cigana, and it may be linked - according to Annesse Brockley (see thread on PR) - to our very poor digestion of proteins. I have followed Dr Myhill's advice (paleo) a whole year and my health had deteriorated to the point I had to be strictly vegan for a while.
     
  18. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

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    A lot of people seem to get "taxonomy unknown" parasites from Metametrix. Don't know if this could be it. I think Dr Fry needed to develop special growth media to see it, but then I don't know how advanced the Metametrix test is...
     
  19. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

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  20. sianrecovery

    sianrecovery Senior Member

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    I did paleo for two years, and while it helped stabilise my blood sugars, overall I worsened and so did my liver function. But neither have I adopted the low fat diet. Maybe I'm just being lazy, or maybe its receiving conflicting advice and going for the lowest common denominator. I have a kidney disease, and osteoporosis, and I have a scarred liver from Hep C, so I distrust the effects of extremes. Having said that, I correspond with other patients of Dr Fry's who are certain they have seen long term improvements from low fat.
     

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