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New Protozoa: Possible Cause of ME/CFS. An Interview with Dr.Steven Fry.

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by Gamboa, Jul 2, 2012.

  1. xrunner

    xrunner Senior Member

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    Personally I've always done well on a low-fat, high-carb diet. It may be a coincidence but my most significant improvement happened during a time when I couldn't take any fat at all due to food sensitivities.
    Again it may be another coincidence but the meds that have worked best for me have been those mentioned by Dr Fry, tetracyclines, metronidazole and ivermectin. And, another coincidence, I have also been doing well on enzymes.

    However with that low-fat diet, long-term one may get depleted in certain nutrients such as liposoluble vitamins. Also where are you going to get your B12 from, if you can't have any meat?
  2. sianrecovery

    sianrecovery Senior Member

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    My sense of it for myself at the minute is that its worth pursuing the proto thing, but that 15gms of fat a day long term and long term abx and no b vits would probably be unsustainable - so I plan to monitor carefully what feedback my body is giving me, and not stick rigidly to anyone's regime unless I feel its right. Unfortunately my uber flexible philosophy also gives me plenty of wriggle room to eat stuff I know is not helping the cause. Ah well. Progess not perfection I guess.
    Hanna, justy, froufox and 1 other person like this.
  3. froufox

    froufox Senior Member

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    I dont think that he says no meat at all, some people on his protocol are eating meat, its fats that are the problem so lean chicken & red meat should be fine. Theres no way I could live without 1st class proteins.

    Xrunner I am similar to u...i feel better in some ways on lowish fat, but on the other hand do tend to crave fats for energy, but...or maybe for the critters/biofilms... Recently I think that i herxed when i reduced my fat intake to 30gm (i normally eat quite a lot....100-200gm a day). I had already been taking Biaxin but had stopped herxing from that and then i herxed again when i reduced the fat. It could just be pure coincidence of course but i thought it was interesting nonetheless. I havent been tested for the protomyxzoa but have always responded well to anti-worm treatments in the past eg Ivermectin, and other stuff Ive tried, so i thought it was worth experimenting with Dr Fry's approach myself.
    merylg and sianrecovery like this.
  4. wallace

    wallace

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    I thought I read somewhere that Dr Fry wasnt keen on the michondrial idea of Myhill but can not find the reference.

    I think its interesting that Dr Klinghardt approves of Dr Fry. What they have in common is this emphasis on parasites and protozon in their protocol. Myhill in common with many other Docs doesnt have this emphasis; Personally I wish Myhill was a little less emphatic in her assertions but thats her positive personality I guess. I like humble practitioners!

    What we know now is the tip of the iceberg in terms of what we will in 20 years time.

    I believe the Fry/klinghardt approach is the more fruitful but we know this isnt an easy task!!!!

    Sian maybe you need to read some of the low fat authors: Ornish,John Robbins etc, to fortify you!!!!

    Diet wise I am trying to eat food with anti parasitic properties.
    merylg, katim and sianrecovery like this.
  5. wallace

    wallace

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  6. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    Tundras of Europa
    In my opinion, the "herxing" that people feel on a very low fat diet, could just as well be a reaction to the diet itself, rather than any die-off. I am quite sure that long term limiting diet to 15 grams daily is very unhealthy.
  7. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1 Senior Member

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    Interesting thread.

    I had a weird incident I posted about on the forums 2? mths ago i which a HUGE mass of extremely sticky stuff came out of somewhere (my sinuses?) and was suddenly in my mouth which almost choked me. I was able to stretch the sticky mass out to arm length (both arms stretched out) without it breaking.

    It was so sticky that it wouldnt wash off my hands with just water, it just wouldnt come off. It was so weird. I actually had to scrub the stuff I'd spat out of my mouth, off my hands with soap. (like if one had gotten super glue on ones hands but as far as its consistanty.. it was more like egg white but far stronger, and probably a little denser ..having also a consistancy with its density).

    The comment on Protomyxzoa above in which it says they cant get it off of their microtiter plates and it being like gelatin and sticky.. sounds like what I almost choked on that day. The most gelatinous sticky goop....a whole handful of that stuff.

    Does anyone know the colour of Protomyxza when its in a big clump? Is it a mostly clear colour (with a possible whitish tinge but mostly clear)? My goop was mostly clear colour... a colour of uncooked egg whites. Im really thinking it may of been an massive culture of this Protomyxza?
  8. wallace

    wallace

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    Interesting tania. Why not. ?

    At the moment I am getting watery eyes for the last week plus conjuctivitis which is resolved by topical lemon juice
  9. wallace

    wallace

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    You need to read up on the literature- Robbins, Colin campbell etc
  10. sianrecovery

    sianrecovery Senior Member

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    wow, tanniust, that sounds pretty unpleasant. I've never heard a direct reference to the colour of proto, but if you go on to you tube, and type in biofilm you might get some videos that help. I will ask that question of some of his other patients.
    Thanks for tip on authors Wallace - I need some inspiration, will check them out.
    Frou frou - no, he really doesnt like red meat.
    Xrunner - I cant remember if you and I have already debated this - I have very low levels of everything, endocrine hormones etc etc - I am torn between my body is downregulating processes to impede the infection, and thinking that the infection itself has downregulated it for its own purposes. Any thoughts? When I saw Dr Fry he had some interesting ideas - not tested, as he hastened to say - that proto may have had some symbiotic function in an evolutionary sense, perhaps as a kind of antifreeze. I was intrigued, but was out of time to discuss further.
  11. sianrecovery

    sianrecovery Senior Member

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    ps I think what Fry doesnt like about Dr Myhill's ideas are her emphasis on magnesium and fats, which he sees as pro-biofilm
  12. xrunner

    xrunner Senior Member

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    I have no idea Sian. In my case, underlying chronic inflammation has an effect because I respond to some anti-inflammatories. Apart from that I don't know much about this area, sorry.
  13. wallace

    wallace

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    Just want to salute Sian courage and determination in flying out to Arizona and trying all this out! Well done!

    I am sure there is a link to the chronic illnesses that are cropping up nowadays.

    For me one of the top docs out there investigating all of this is Dr Klinghartdt and now Dr Fry etc.
    For me a lot of ME discussion seems to me to rather of the academic kind with little practical immediate application by the ME patient. I am thinking of the recent work of invest in me for example. We need to focus on what the doctors in the front line are thinking and doing rather abstract theoretical research. Dr Fry being a microbiologist obviously combines both worlds which is ideal.

    The lyme world seems more active in this regard than the ME one.
    froufox, sianrecovery and justy like this.
  14. Desdinova

    Desdinova Senior Member

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    Must not be Big MSM news yet because the Debunking crews haven't started popping out of the wood work spout off about replication studies needed and contamination.
  15. froufox

    froufox Senior Member

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    Thanks for correcting me about the meat Sian! Hmmm i wonder lean red meat is not ok? I guess he must have found that in his testing.

    Tania I am very similar to you in that my body tends to pass a lot of mucus, i mean it literally comes out of every orifice! And it can be very sticky too....sorry for the gross details ... but thats one reason why i think i have a prob with biofilms... Another reason is that Ive always tended to feel better when i have blood taken (reduction in brain fog) ....was presuming its due to hypercoagulation/biofilms in blood. Ive collected a ton of stuff on biofilms...its very interesting esp re quorum sensing and the idea that bacteria share genes in order to promote their survival...i dont know if its all been proven though.
  16. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    This is very interesting Tania. It reminds me of many dreams I had over a period of many years. I would suddenly become aware of pulling "stuff" out of my mouth. The texture seemed to change over time, and every time it happened, I felt better upon awakening. I believed something very real was happening, and that I was doing some kind of purge when I had these experiences. My understanding (and belief) is that what's going on with our physical body can affect our inner bodies, and vice versa.

    Wayne
  17. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1 Senior Member

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    I arent what id call a mucusy person at all. It only happened like that once. Like as if it had all build up unknown to me and then just all shifted from the unnoticable place it must of been in. Makes me think I probably have a heap still in that place where ever that lot came from.
    froufox likes this.
  18. froufox

    froufox Senior Member

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    Sorry Tania I had misread your message....i can definitely relate to the sticky stuff...in my case it seems to happen regularly though i dont get huge clumps of it...that only happens occasionally. At least when it comes out i interpret that as a good thing as my body is getting rid of it.
  19. CJB

    CJB Senior Member

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    This makes so much sense. I was on doxycycline for a year after being sick for about 8 years and most of the "flu" symptoms cleared up. My sensitivity to the sun reduced, etc. and I finally stopped feeling feverish.

    I don't know about y'all, but most of the ME/CFS patients I know have a terrible time with gum disease/plaque, which, of course, is a biofilm.

    I can't do carbs well, so the low fat is a big challenge.
    snowathlete likes this.
  20. Gamboa

    Gamboa Senior Member

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    Wow. The more information I get the more confused I am becoming. What should I eat, not eat? What supplement should I take, not take? I was taking lots of magnesium since that was recommended by many ME/CFS docs yet, according to Dr. Fry, this is bad.

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