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Multivitamin with methylfolate?

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by Lala, Apr 26, 2012.

  1. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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    I can not find any multivitamin with methylfolate. Can someone give me advice? It is also hard to find B complex with methylfolate, I only found Douglas labs, which are discontinued on iherb.
  2. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

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    These are the two I know about and have taken or still take: Pure Encapsulations Multi t/d and Thorne Basic Nutrients III. I prefer the former as it has more methylfolate. It is also cheaper on a per diem basis.
  3. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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    Thank you for your help, nanonug. Unfortunatelly, I am in Europe and Pure Encaps. does not send their products here.

    The second one claims it has:
    Folate (500 mcg as Calcium Folinate and 500 mcg as L-5-Methyltetrahydrofolate from L-5-Methyltetrahydrofolic Acid, Glucosamine Salt) 1 mg.

    Does it matter there is Calcium Folinate? Does not calcium folinate interefere with metylfolate?
  4. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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  5. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

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    It is probably a good idea to fill in your profile with your location as there are answers to these and many other questions that have a geographical dependency.

    Well, it depends. Do you have the common C677T or A1298C MTHFR mutations?

    Thorne also has this Methyl-Guard Plus that might interest you.
  6. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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    Thank you, Valentijn, your choice looks excellent, though it is quite pricey.

    Nanonug, I do not know, if I have any mutation as I have never been tested, but apparently I am doing better with B complex with metafolin than with B complex with folic acid. Thanx for the Methyl- Guard, I just ordered Thorne 5-MTHF 5mg to see whether it will make any difference, so next step could be Methyl-Guard.
  7. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

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    Note that this high level of methylfolate is more for neurotransmitter support (such as in dealing with symptoms of depression), via increased tetrahydrobiopterin recycling. Is this what you are looking for?
  8. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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    Yes, I suffer from depression and anxiety and I think I could have some MTHFR mutation as well due to my bad experience with high dose B complex...so do you think the dose is too high to start with?
  9. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

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    It's difficult to say for sure.

    I also take the same 5mg of methylfolate on a daily basis to prevent problems due to potentially reduced levels of tetrahydrobiopterin. It helps not only with neurotransmitters but with the prevention of extreme oxidative and nitrosative stresses caused by elevated levels of peroxynitrite. What I don't do is take a lot of methylcobalamin at the same time. Otherwise, much of that methylfolate will end up being used in the methylation cycle, instead of recycling dihydrobiopterin (BH2) back into tetrahydrobiopterin (BH4).


    I guess it would be prudent to get yourself tested for MTHFR mutations. 23andme would provide you with that info and much more.
  10. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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  11. August59

    August59 Daughters High School Graduation

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    The old Douglas Labs was discountinued and replaced with a new Ultra Preventative X and it does have methylfolate and also methylcobalmin. It is a little expensive, but I took my time and caught it on Amazon.com at the lowest price. It is also one of those that says take 6 a day, but I usually take 4 a day plus some other singular minerals. I'm looking for a B-Complex without any folic acid.
    Googsta likes this.
  12. August59

    August59 Daughters High School Graduation

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    This is a good buy as they have reformulated for version 2. This version is a little high in choline and some people wanted the lithium taken out, but not sure what was decided. The people at the forum www.imminst.org have this multivitamin custome made by Revgenetics. It does not go overboard with 4200% RDA of something, but instead use high absorbable forms of nutrients in most cases.
  13. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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    I recently bought this one: http://www.swansonvitamins.com/SWU533/ItemDetail

    Ultra preventative multivitamin looks great except that it contains NAC, too...not sure, why they put it in.
  14. August59

    August59 Daughters High School Graduation

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    The new Vimmortal 2.0 may not contain NAC, but I think they are opting for folininc acid, instead of methylfolate, bummer!!
  15. garcia

    garcia Aristocrat Extraordinaire

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  16. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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    Calcium folinate can block methylfolate, so that is bad.

    Ultra Preventative X from Douglas labs contains NAC as well, moreover I found only once source for Europe: http://www.healthpalace.ca, which someone recommended on the forum. It costs 111 CAD including postage, so the price seems to me extreme. No vendors on amazon.

    Vimmortal with folinic acid is bad as well not talking about their price.

    So it looks like there is no single usable multivitamin to buy..
  17. cureminded

    cureminded

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  18. jasrich

    jasrich

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    I am heterozygous for both so are you implying that the Thorne V is not appropriate for people with these mutations because we will not be able to benefit from the methylfolate due to the calcium folinate? I'm confused, also as to why Rich is considering it for his protocol, if this is an issue.
  19. richvank

    richvank Senior Member

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    Hi, jasrich and all.

    Calcium folinate (a form of folinic acid) is useable by most PWMEs, and folinic acid is part of the simplified methylation protocol. It's true that Freddd has found that folinic acid is detrimental in his case. I suspect that he has a mutation in his MTHFS enzyme (not to be confused with MTHFR). MTHFS is the enzyme that normally catalyzes the only reaction in the body that can convert folinic acid into another form (methenyl tetrahydrofolate) which in turn can be converted to other forms. If this enzyme is mutated so that its reaction is slow, folinic acid can build up if supplemented, and that inhibits the SHMT reaction, blocking the formation of methylfolate. I think this is a rare mutation.

    It's true that folinic acid competes for absorption and transport into cells with methylfolate. However, it also offers advantages in that in most people it is able to support other folate reactions, while methylfolate cannot do so until it reacts with homocysteine to produce tetrahydrofolate. This is the reaction that is partially blocked in ME/CFS, and it takes some months to get it up to normal operation with this protocol.

    Some of the important folate reactions involved producing substances used in making new RNA and DNA, which is necessary for the production of new cells. This is particularly important for blood cells and cells lining the intestine, which have relatively short lifetimes and need to be replaced.

    Best regards,

    Rich
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  20. jasrich

    jasrich

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    Hi Rich, thanks for the comprehensive reply/explanation. I had read the whole debate between you and Fredd about whether folinic acid is detrimental, but I had not put it together that calcium folinate is folinic acid - new to all of this bio-chemistry. So this is that same debate and your position is that it shouldn't be a problem for most of us, but it is for Fredd and people like him with a particular mutation. Got it. So should we be taking extra methylfolate than what we are getting in the Thorne?

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