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Methylfolate to Methylcobalamin ratio?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by SJB944, Feb 12, 2015.

  1. SJB944

    SJB944 Senior Member

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    Is there a preferred ratio between Methylfolate and Methylcobalamin? I'm currently taking 9mg of MB12, 5mg ADB12 and have recently increased Methylfolate up to 16.8mg -- 3 tablets 7 times a day. Yet still showing folate insufficiency symptoms.

    @Freddd or anyone else?

    Also wondering about paradoxical Folate deficiency symptoms, is that where it looks like an insufficiency of folate but it's really a need for more MB12?

    Appreciate any thoughts.
     
    traray likes this.
  2. minkeygirl

    minkeygirl But I Look So Good.

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    I thought you were supposed to take more mb12 than methylfolate but I don't know if there was a specific ratio.

    @PeterPositive may be able to help.
     
    Alea Ishikawa likes this.
  3. boo85

    boo85 Senior Member

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    The answer is different for everyone, but I think I read that a general rule of thumb is for 1/2 as much MF as B12.

    So my dose right now is (very tiny amounts, I know):

    50mcg methylfolate
    125mcg B12

    Of course you would adjust that to whatever dose you are taking.

    If someone here thinks this ratio should be different, let me know. :)
     
  4. PeterPositive

    PeterPositive Senior Member

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    Hi,
    there doesn't seem to be a rule because people may have very different issues with both nutrients. Some of us have difficulties transporting B12 or folate, others may have a lack of other co-factors, or other pathway blockages, different SNPs... etc...

    @SJB944 you are already taking quite a lot of B12 and methyl-folate, are you also taking the other Bs? In particular B2 (FAD) and B3 (NAD/H/P) which are necessary for the folate cycle?

    cheers
     
  5. Alea Ishikawa

    Alea Ishikawa

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    I recommend at least a 1:1 ratio. But depending on your genetics, it could be 1:2 or 1:3 (folate to B12). Your folate is outpacing your B12 right now.



    If still having issues after correcting the ratio: I think I remember reading that 800mcg methylfolate was the recommended initial dose. According to Sheclimber's My Understanding of Freddd's Protocol, the dosage might be as high as 30mg.

    I would be wary of high dosages if you have a good amount of folic acid (found in pasta, cereal, etc.), as this might result in burnt out folate receptors. Methylfolate precursors can also compete for absorption - how many green veggies are you eating within 6 hours of taking folate?

    Are you taking the ADB12 several hours away from the MB12?

    How much potassium are you taking?



    I think @stridor mentioned taking methylfolate in the buccal pouch (between teeth and gums) for better absorption. By doing so, @ahmo said they lowered the amount of folate they had to take per day. Be prepared for the effects if you try this.
     
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  6. SJB944

    SJB944 Senior Member

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    Thanks for the suggestions

    @PeterPositive Yep, taking 1/4 of a B-complex twice a day -- low dose complex sans Folic and b12. May have to increase.

    Thanks @Alea Ishikawa .some food for thought. Take about 3000-3200mg a day of potassium, spread out during the day.

    No, or very little, intake of folic acid in flours etc. Haven't explored the green veggies in and around taking the folate, so thanks will explore this further.

    The 5mg of adb12 I take with one lot of the Mb12 -- is there a competition for absorption?,

    Does anyone else find taking methylfolate sublingually in the buccal pouch makes a difference re absorption?
     
  7. PeterPositive

    PeterPositive Senior Member

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    More generally I find sublingual methylfolate more potent than the oral route. It may depend on two factors:
    1- gut/digestive issues which I have, so bypassing the gut makes it more effective
    2- speed of absorption between gut and oral mucosa, where the latter is possibly much faster.

    It may also depend on the type of methylfolate as I've tested oral Metafolin vs sublingual Quatrefolic, although in theory they should be equivalent, given the same dosage.
     
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  8. SwanRonson

    SwanRonson Senior Member

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    If I'm right, @Freddd said to take the methylfolate (oral) and b12 (sublingual) at the same time, so that the b12 has a chance to fully absorb before the folate begins absorbing. If you switch to taking the methylfolate sublingually, would you then need to wait to insert the folate after the b12 is completely dissolved/absorbed?
     
  9. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @SJB944 I've gone from 15mg folate to 5mg by switching to putting it in gum. I'm using 5mg capsules, empty about 1/3 3 times a day. MY first dose is at same time as B12. Not only is this saving me a whole lot of money, but it's easier on my liver/adrenals.:thumbsup:
     
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  10. SJB944

    SJB944 Senior Member

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    Thanks @ahmo . That sounds like a win all round! Ever since I started taking Vitamin D I've found my need for folate has escalated, so will definitely give this a go.

    Out of interest hoe much MB12 amd ADB12 are you taking with that?
     
  11. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I'd been stabilized on the 5mg (sublingual) buccal folate + 20mg (sublingual) buccal Country Life 5mg MB12. I'm using AdB12 once/week, 40mg.

    I'm no longer using the sublingual MB12. I switched to transdermal oil, initially a commercial brand, see link below. As I wrote in the more recent page of that thread, I'm now using 5mg California Extracts B12 liquid, which I mix into a small amount of body creme and rub on, AM only, same time as my first dose of folate. This has been a marvelous change. No more pink gums for most of the day, and as garyfritz calculated, 1/10 the price of the commercial oil. I don't know how this would go if you haven't already gotten some sort of stable dosage worked out.

    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/transdermal-b12-oils.33172/
     
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  12. Alea Ishikawa

    Alea Ishikawa

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    I honestly don't know. I just remember Freddd talking about taking ADB12 once/week when MB12 wasn't taken. He said his daughter was taking ADB12 daily. Post here.



    Aturtles said:
     
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