Methylation Stopped working

[place]

Paul what are you taking and how much of it?

 

[paul80]

Hi, Place, i stopped everything just now except vitamins a,c,d and the minerals.

 

[Freddd]

Hi, Place, i stopped everything just now except vitamins a,c,d and the minerals.

Hi Paul,

Is stopping all the rest really what you want to do rather than figure out why things were not working? There is usually a reason things slow down or stop or worse and those can usually be corrected.

 

[paul80]

I've not giving up on it completely since it's the only thing that had some effect on me. I'm just considering how to proceed with it next time. I might try switching to the inactive form of b12 in case the methylation cycle was being overdriven.

 

[place]

Hey Paul,
I think you will still have to continue with the potassium for another month. Another person in the same situation ran into this.

 

[Susan8773]

Freddd, I have just started taking D-ribose and two weeks in seem to be feeling iller than before!! Came across your comment here and wondered would you mind explaining what you mean here a little please?

"Also, the balance between mb12-adb12-LCF can influence depression. Depression in all has been affected by SAM-e, mb12, adb12, LCF, Metafolin, zinc, vit D, D-ribose and some others."

Many thanks.

Beki

 

[richvank]

I've not giving up on it completely since it's the only thing that had some effect on me. I'm just considering how to proceed with it next time. I might try switching to the inactive form of b12 in case the methylation cycle was being overdriven.

Hi, Paul.

I think it's very possible that your methylation cycle was being overdriven. I've seen this in several others now, based on lab tests, when they were taking sizeable dosages of methylfolate together with so-called "active" forms of B12. This combination bypasses the ability of the cells to control the rate of the methionine synthase reaction. It goes too high, using up too much homocysteine, and then there is not enough homocysteine left to enter the transsulfuration pathway to support the synthesis of glutathione. The glutathione depletion worsens, and the oxidative stress increases. One major effect of this is to worsen the mitochondrial dysfunction, lowering the production of ATP. Since ATP is what is needed to power the muscles, they get weak. So this approach does improve methylation, but it does so at the expense of glutathione. What is needed is a more balanced approach, in my opinion. This is one reason I suggest using hydroxocobalamin, at least at first, instead of methylcobalamin. That will preserve the supply of homocysteine to support glutathione synthesis. This does not work for everyone, and if it doesn't, I suggest switching to methylcobalamin, but limiting the dosage to about 2 milligrams per day, and limiting the methylfolate dosage to a few hundred micrograms. Starting at low dosages and working up as tolerated is a good idea, in my opinion.

Best regards,

Rich

 

[triffid113]

Um, just a comment, but these procols MAKE SAMe...so even if you don;t take SAMe, you are making it, and that is contrary to what your antidepressant says you should do. I would never take antidepressants with methylation protocols. It can cause too much SAMe (methyls).

Look at Freddd's protocol...helists all sorts of support nutrients you need. Methyls turn on/off biochemical reactions. When reactions are turned on that were not functional in the past suddenly you need all the support nutrients for those biochemical pathways...thus taking a minimal protocol is probably not enough for most people.


Triff

 

[paul80]

Hi, Paul.

I think it's very possible that your methylation cycle was being overdriven. I've seen this in several others now, based on lab tests, when they were taking sizeable dosages of methylfolate together with so-called "active" forms of B12. This combination bypasses the ability of the cells to control the rate of the methionine synthase reaction. It goes too high, using up too much homocysteine, and then there is not enough homocysteine left to enter the transsulfuration pathway to support the synthesis of glutathione. The glutathione depletion worsens, and the oxidative stress increases. One major effect of this is to worsen the mitochondrial dysfunction, lowering the production of ATP. Since ATP is what is needed to power the muscles, they get weak. So this approach does improve methylation, but it does so at the expense of glutathione. What is needed is a more balanced approach, in my opinion. This is one reason I suggest using hydroxocobalamin, at least at first, instead of methylcobalamin. That will preserve the supply of homocysteine to support glutathione synthesis. This does not work for everyone, and if it doesn't, I suggest switching to methylcobalamin, but limiting the dosage to about 2 milligrams per day, and limiting the methylfolate dosage to a few hundred micrograms. Starting at low dosages and working up as tolerated is a good idea, in my opinion.

Best regards,

Rich

Hi Rich,

Thanks for the suggestions, I'm going to try them after i get my gut issues sorted out. I'm waiting on my results from the metametrix test, and hopefully after that i will have more success with this treatment.

I still wonder about the fact that the day the methylation treatment stopped working for me i had what i assume was a niacin flush. Never had it any other day, just that one morning. I wonder if that could be a clue as to what happened.

 

[richvank]

Hi, Paul.

I don't know. Haven't run across that response before. Hopefully your Metametrix testing will give some good information about what's going on.

Best regards,

Rich

 

[NoMoTime]

@paul80

Glad I found this thread because I'm in same exact situation as you were. I tired adding potassium, increasing methylfolate and adding biotin, alongside with a bunch of other cofactors which I'm already taking but nothing seems to help. Could you give us an update and tell us if you found what's been missing for you?

 

[paul80]

@paul80

Glad I found this thread because I'm in same exact situation as you were. I tired adding potassium, increasing methylfolate and adding biotin, alongside with a bunch of other cofactors which I'm already taking but nothing seems to help. Could you give us an update and tell us if you found what's been missing for you?

Hi, no, unfortunately i didn't find anything that worked and the methylation protocol just doesn't have the same effect any more. I'm quite a bit worse than i was back then spend most of my time lying down.

I gave up experimenting as some of the things i was trying had bad effects and i got fed up with it. Just gonna wait for a fully proven treatment.