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methylation results, but still stuck

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by vortex, Mar 3, 2013.

  1. vortex

    vortex Senior Member

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    got glutathione up but not neurotransmitters

    I have been doing methyfolate, methyl b-12 for months but also for the last few years I have been taking undenatured whey protein for glutathione boosting as I did an organic acid test and showed low glutathione, it has taken me years and detox herx hell to get up to the full dose, I literally had to start at 1/50th of the dose of whey.
    Anway, I did another organic acid urine test and presto my glutathione is up now. yay !
    However it showed my neurotransmitters still on the low side.

    My energy is still on the low side and my mood is a little
    depressed with motivation and enjoyment.

    I am single copy of mthfr 677

    I am thinking about slowing titrating up the methylfolate to deplin levels to try to boost bh4 through recycling so I can get my neurotransmitters up.

    Anybody slowly increase their methylfolate after reaching a plateau ?
     
  2. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Vortex,

    The N=10 trial I participated in with 9 others would suggest that it is becasue of the undenatured whey that is preventing feeling better and improvement. Making adjustments after quitting whey might get better results.
     
  3. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    I am curious about how good a job the mfolate and C do in raising BH4 levels if you have MTHFR 1298 (do you?). My father died of no detectable level of BH4 which put him into kidney failure and dialysis killed him (dialysis patients die of heart disease, usually within 1 year). He was MTHFR 1298 CC (homozygous) and CBS +/- on 2 CBS genes, whereas I am MTHFR 1298AC (hetero) and CBS +/+ and CBS +/-. I am considering taking a BH4 test, but they are $300 and I can't run to trying one protocol, testing, trying another, retesting, etc. It takes repeat testing to tell anything worthwhile...I am COMT +/+ and COMT +/+ so I can't feel the BH4 deficiency as well as someone else might.
     
  4. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    Oh yes, I wanted to ask what test (what lab, url please?) you took to determine your gultathione levels? That is one thing I've never measured. Thanks
     
  5. dbkita

    dbkita Senior Member

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    triffid113:

    Glutathione RBC tests from something like Genova Diagnostics were one of the most dependable according to Rich Vank.

    vortex: Urine tests for neurotransmitters are notoriously useless (unless you have serotonin overload due to SSRIs). However, I don't doubt you have mood and depression issues as you say. My point is to go by how you feel. The actual neurotransmitter tests are tragically non-correlative as they measure peripheral values which is a tiny fraction of what is going on the CNS. Heck for a while I had neurotransmitter urine tests telling me I had normal GABA even though all the time I was suffering from a rare autoimmune disease that destroys the glutamic acid decarboylase enzymes in my CNS and my pancreas. Not to sound harsh but a doctor who draws conclusions about peripheral measurements of neurotransmitters to estimate CNS levels (except in rare totally out of range scenarios) is not someone I would think highly of.

    That being said I can tell you that raising my own glutathione levels did not help me with mood or energy, though it did reduce the my allergic and chemical sensitivities. What is your homocysteine level like? Are your electrolytes ok? How much of the methylation protocol are you doing and what amounts?
     
    Dreambirdie likes this.
  6. vortex

    vortex Senior Member

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    I quit the whey last month, but still haven't improved, prob declined if anything.
     
  7. vortex

    vortex Senior Member

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    I took the urine oat test organic acid. it shows pyroglutamic levels which correlate with glutathione, i was going to take plasma glutathione test but havent gotten to it.

    Has anyone gradually increased their methylfolate and broke through a plateau ?
     
  8. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Vortex,

    After gjutathione I had to take both some sizable MeCbl and AdoCbl several times and also equally sizable Metafolin doses several times before it began receeding and the Metafolin, MeCbl, and AdoCbl all went through mild startup all over again. I had to get that CNS penetration.
     
  9. vortex

    vortex Senior Member

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    Thanks Fredd ! Are you doing mecbl and adocbl injections ?

    I am doing 5mg mecbl injections every other day and I am feeling better from that.

    I wonder if I can talk my doc into writing a prescription for methyl and adenosylcobalamin injections ? I wonder if the compounding pharmacy has ever done that ?

    I am at about 1.5mg methylfolate per day. But thinking about adding an extra pill of 400mcg every day to slowly increase the amount and just see what happens.
     
  10. invisiblejungle

    invisiblejungle Senior Member

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    I would be cautious in automatically correlating pyroglutamic acid levels with glutathione. My NutrEval showed pyroglutamic acid at 24, right in the middle of the green range. Even my whole blood glutathione was high. However, my methylation panel showed that I have low reduced glutathione and a definite methylation issue.
     
    vortex likes this.
  11. vortex

    vortex Senior Member

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    Update, So I have experimented a lot with various doses and even went off of methylfolate for a couple of months because it didn't seem to be helping much. I had some persistent potassium issues, I can judge my potassium levels by flexing my calf muscle and seeing if it cramps. Anyway, after I took a break. I went back on it and I am strangely able to up my dose to much higher doses without any issues or reactions or need for potassium. Which I can't figure out why. I can go up to 5 mg. and feel really nice, and can feel the neurotransmitter levels coming up with a sense of well being and calmness and any anxiety is gone. I am probably going to run another organic acid test just to see what it shows, but I can tell I feel much better.


    .
     
    juniemarie likes this.

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