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Metaphysics - NDE, etc Its GROUNDHOG DAY all over again

Discussion in 'Alternative Therapies' started by Freddd, Oct 20, 2009.

  1. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Brenda,

    To start this I want to make clear that I have had 3 sexual partners in my life for whatever that is worth, and they were friends and copractitioners. And I've worked with perhaps a dozen women who needed what I could offer, the ability to do very deep work including releases of past life traumas in trance with them. Erotic trance, while it is descriptive of working with a certain set of energies that are often considered sexual, and entering into a shared state with a person often entered through sexual means, can often be done via other methods, as in the energies of some of the chakras. Sexual means doesn't necessarily mean physical sexual activity. That is a common misconception. There is a tantric yoga path suitable for celebates which Ramakrishna and Vivekananda were reputed to have mastered in a weekend.

    So we take the young lady I described here, physically I gave her some back rubs and massages with her guidance as she was a massage therapist and had to micro manage everything. Her challange was to learn how to relax for the back rub and be able to enter in a shared trance state.

    Sexual healing may originate in tantra and at times may be suitable but it wasn't generally what I practiced. I helped people undergo a spiritual experience of death and rebirth after releasing the blockages that prevented such. Many of them had life after life of sexual trauma which I experienced with them. They also had plenty of non sexual trauma, sadly all to often at the hands of men. Getting run through with a sword can be plenty traumatizing. The concentration camps were hell for everybody. I was able to help them open up to a shared spiritual communion and release the traumas that basically locked them into hell.

    It's a sad commentary on our society that there is so much rape and sexual abuse, and physical and emotional abuse as well. I had an abusive psychotic mother and am quite sensitive to the many issues.
     
  2. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    OK I understand, thanks for explaining. Sorry to hear you had an abusive mother. Mine too - diagnosed later as having schizophrenic episodes. She used to chase me with the bread knife and try to bang down the bathroom door where I would hide from her.
     
  3. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    My first voluntary alchemical death and rebirth

    The idea of a voluntary death seems strange to many. In no way do I mean suicide. Suicide is a dead end. It doesn't work. It is not a good thing spiritually. The voluntary spiritual death, under a variety of names, is an entirely different matter. Its purpose is to gain knowledge and be initiated in the mysteries of life and death. It may be brought about by any number of methods. It figures prominently in many varieties of shamanism, alchemy and other practices under many names.

    My first such experience was triggered by my grandfather's death. My grandfather had suffered a severe stroke 2 weeks before and had been in a light coma. It was the night of his 80th birthday. I was lying on the couch in basically meditational prayer. I started attempting an Edger Cayce type of thing, to locate the person. Suddenly, there was my grandfather. We were in a featureless grey space together. He said that he had come to say goodbye, that he had to leave tonight, that it was no longer possible to stay in his body. We conversed for a while and he said to say goodbye to others in the family. As the conversation wrapped up he reached to take my hand and I reached towards him. The closer our hands got the more milky white everything became, brighter and brighter. At the instant our hands would have touched everything went into a bright whiteout. When it cleared he was gone and in front of me was a large golden mandala, the golden flower. A voice said to me "You know that you don't have to do this, that this is strictly voluntary. You are not the one dying." I said that I understood. And that I wanted to remember. Then there was some advice. "Go for it right down the middle as far and as hard as you can. Don't hit the sides. Don't look back. Don't let anything distract you." Then, very strangely there was a drum roll and like a ski racers start, a short countdown. As I've said, these things seem to conform to whatever archetypes we each understand. With that I launched myself into the tunnel, down the center of the flower.

    My sister also had a visitation by our grandfather that night but hers did not continue after he left.

    I reached the end, the "root node" where all time and space and everything was one. There was massively expanded consciousness but no object, nothing to be conscious of. Franklin Merrell-Wolff wrote The Philosophy of Consciousness Without an Object about his experiences. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_Merrell-Wolff

    I descended back down the "tree" more slowly and observed the evolution of consciousness into consciousness and things to be conscious of, including a large macroconsciousness that might be called "God". It was much more towards a Buddhist view than a Christian one. I stayed in an outright "Cosmic Consciousness" or similar state for several days and slowly descended towards more normal states over several months.
     
  4. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Brenda,

    Something that I perhaps should clarify. I am heterosexual. However, I can and do work with men if they can get past their fears of opening their heart with another man. It's not sexual but they become scared that it is or, if gay, that it isn't. It's energy of certain varieties. Gender has nothing to do with it. It triggers all their fears and can make them accessable for work. I'm good at triggering a person's fears. That is one of my talents. Usually I can go straight to their fears and blockages. Strangers will often tell me their fears immediately upon meeting me for the first time and project them upon me.
     
  5. Victoria

    Victoria Senior Member

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    A Strange co-incidence....perhaps?

    Freddd,

    How very strange to hear you talk about death today.

    For those who may not know, I read the Tarot Cards & not only have the usual female intuition (supposedly, we females are more intuitive than the male population), but have also been known to "see" or "predict" incidents in the future.

    Last night (for the first time in weeks) I did a Tarot card reading which included the Death card, so last night I was wondering if it was the "end" of a situation, or an actual "death" , or whether I would hear about someone's death.

    The reading was not clear, & I felt no sense of what that particular card meant last night (whereas, other times, I can interpret the situation fairly well).

    Just as, some weeks ago, I saw that I would be in hospital. I then got a phone call the next morning (at short notice) to say I'd been scheduled for my coronary angiagram procedure 2 days later.

    Some years ago, I saw the Death card every night for a week & knew that it meant the literal meaning of the picture on the card and someone's passing. The following week, my paternal Aunt, my maternal Uncle & my sister-in-law's Father all died within a couple of days of each other.

    Reading your post this morning reminded me of the card last night.

    How curious.

    Victoria
     
  6. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Here is a post of Victoria's that I ended up with as the post to this thread ending up in the cyberspace graveyard.
     
  7. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Victoria,

    I'm also going to include a quote from you other post and address at least a portion of it here. I make no claim to any orthodoxy or originality in all this whatsoever. All interpretations are my own borrowed from whoever said it well and combined with many others. If this were a different situation I could give you a load of footnotes which could provide a reading list for the rest of your life. The idea of "orthodoxy" in alchemy is a joke in itself. The idea that it can all be written or spoken is ludicrous and that there is one "right" interpretation equally ridiculous. There are as many ways to practice alchemy as there are to skin the proverbial cat.

    I'm not familiar with the term tantric alchemist (although I feel I should be) - please fill me in. It would be much more interesting coming from you - someone who practices, rather than looking it up on the internet.



    Death! It seems so permanent with normal considerations. So one might ask. What comes after death? More consciousness. Death and life sort of alternate. In my experience more of this life comes after death, in more or less Groundhog Day style. If it doesn't then all of this and all of you are just my Bardo dream, or is it my dream in a coma after smashing my head in skiing. Can't be that. I was shot first. Can't be that either, I died in a car wreck, and ... Anyway, it's after one death or another. At some point a body reaches the actual end of it's ability to support life. I don't know of any permanent respite from life. One spends a bit of perceived duration in Eternal time, and that can be the perceived length of a fraction of a second or of billions of lifetimes, and then is reborn into life. Once reborn in life the Eternal duration was as a blink of the eye. All times and places and variations thereof exist in the same place and instant. Last year is exactly as far away as last second or next second. When one leaves the life one can be reborn into it at any other time.

    So in Tarot there are cards for all sorts of archetypes. Death. Alchemist. Lovers, Priest, Priestess etc. The Alchemist is portrayed often as a hemaphrodite, or at least as having the combined charateristics of male and female; often portrayed as a large erect phallus and feminine breasts. The Alchemist works with the living LOVE and has accomplished the Alchemical marriage (or is working to do so), the uniting within ones self of the male and female aspects and so the Alchemist, outwardly male or female, has the combined energies of male and female, can be metaphysical Priest and Priestess. A large dose of LOVE causes a death and then rebirth. The components of being, the skandhas in one terminology, come together differently in each rebirth so the person changes. This reflects changes made in the life as well as things left undone so the new life reflects that.

    The Alchemist then goes and makes intentional changes in self, for the purpose of self evolution and growth. The Alchemical marriage makes for a much larger and more complete synthesis of self. There are some who might say that the alchemical marriage itself can be repeated at larger and larger scales making a larger and larger synthesis of self and larger range of potential lives.

    After a lot of individual work is completed a certain type of cooperative work becomes needed. This leads to the Alchemical Union as illustrated metaphorically by Shiva and Shakti. During sexual union the two prepared beings cooperate in a specific way during a very prolonged act of intercourse at a specific energy etc. And in essense make a combined world set. Together they synthecize a set of worlds that is as if the ones person world set is sort of raised to the power of the others world set. They share each others beings totally. As far as I know it is rarely accomplished. It is much more than a simple union of the two world sets.

    Some sources of information appaear to combine or confuse the two things, Alchemical marriage and alchemical union.

    In the western world, the sexual nature of these practices were concealed in misleading language. People would be murdered for engaging in these practices. They were most forbidden. In the western world they are the most revealed now that they have ever been. In the east there were at least 3 main streams of tantric practice; Taoist, Hindu Yogic and Buddhist Yogic.

    They engaged in forbidden practices including oral sex. In the Taoist the seven stages of female orgasms were understood and taught. The three "medicines" were generated, a different liquid at 3 different stages of orgasm, each used for a different healing. The semen was also considered to be filled with energy and was consumed in ritual as was the combination. The altar on which alchemical sex was engaged had catch basins for these fluids. At least some of these fluids have been measured as containing relatively substantial amounts of b12, which in a vegetarian culture might cause a noticable event of energizing the consumer.

    The Yoni puja perfomed by priestesses, in which the lower gate of heaven is displayed and prayed to or meditated upon and stimulated to repeated orgasms would also involve collection of the orgasmic fluids for consumption by the congregation, in at least some versions of the ritual. Lingam puja done with a priest is much the same. It is considered important that these be done only by those highly trained in holding the correct energies and not to get distracted by what some might perceive as the sexual aspect. There are ritual forms in which a stone Lingam is anointed with milk and honey and similar with the Yoni. Alchemically it is usually done with the living priest and priestess. These ceremonies exist in many forms and variations, both open and secret. These fluids are usually considered best consumed straight from the souce at generation time unless a group is involved.
     
  8. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Victoria,

    Now continuing about my interpretation of Tantric Alchemy.

    We have the Alchemy, which is a transformation process of evolution with purification and growth. It uses many methods, some of which are tantric or tantric type methods, some of which are mentioned in the previous post. There is much meditative work, alone and with another or others. Archetypes and costumed dramas may be performed. There are many ways to take people to the edge where the false petty ego must be dropped. Goddess of death is of course one of the experiences. I spent a great 4 day group session with 16 women going through 13 "faces of the Goddess" invocations and culminating with the whole group going into the same space together in a very powerful final invocational experience into the divine feminine and the Alchemical Goddess.

    What "Tantric" means and is presents more of a problem. For many it has become synonymous with "sacred sex", for others an energy yoga similar to and even incorporating kundalini yoga. At its root it is an alchemy. Tantra includes the arts and healing. It can mean quite literally "weaving". Consider the Star Trek Next Gen show TAPISTRY. We weave the pattern of our life. In working with another person or a group of persons in an invocational circle there is a weaving together of their energies, and at a deeper level, their lives. There are techniques for walking between the worlds and other such names. In a sense we do this along the weave of the world. Each life is a weaving of many threads.

    I would venture an estimate that 99% of Tantric alchemy has nothing at all to do with sex. Sex is a tool for entering altered states of consciousness alone or with another person or persons. It's something that may be done in various rituals. There are a very few things for which it is essential. For those doing alchemical union I know of no alternative but that doesnt mean there isnt one, just my ignorance of it. I have a long term alchemical partner with whom I am deeply engaged in long term alchemy that does involve sex. It took a long time to work up to that and where we are now. There are other people whom I teach various things starting with basic meditation and awareness and some theory. They may be a couple who want to engage in the sexual aspects of alchemy. We work with a lot of different books from many traditions. There is no one set of books that includes all the desired things. A sound theoretical basis is essential. Then there are a few that come to me for healing work. The period I work with a person might be as short as an afternoon or more than a decade. Some people come for one piece of information or a single experience. Others take years to work through things. Those coming to me are usually at the end of their choices and desperate and crying out for help. They often have had experiences they dont understand. They know of nobody else or have found them all lacking.

    I was at a resort in California and a massage therapist was giving me a massage one time. I had terribly sore muscles for years with the CFS/FMS and had lots of massages. He had a canvas with a painted symbol on the wall. He asked me it was familiar to me as he asked everybody. It was. He told me how he had seen it, in a tantric sex induced mystical experience and asked everybody about it. I was the only person who had recognized it. He asked if I could explain some things to him and I agreed that I could and would. We made an appointment for 2 days later to meet up. I started meditating about an hour before he arrived. By the time he got there I was having a similar experience of the white light streaming through me as to the time with the bear. I find that I go to whatever level of being, experience and knowledge that the person Im working with needs. I dont know how or why it works like that, but it does. Its not me. Im merely open to the possibility. It seemed to be some higher being working through me. I was clearly in a state of Buddha consciousness. He showed up and was caught up in the consciousness with me at once and recognized its nature. The symbol in question was clearly visible sitting glowing in space before us. He had his audience, a very high level one which was completely unexpected, and I could not explain how or why. He received the answer that the symbol indicated his completion of an alchemy he had been working on for some lifetimes. He was asked if he was willing to take the next step and he was. He was given a download of the required information and energy; perhaps shakitipat would be a description, for him to make his start on the next level. After a couple of hours the session wound down and we had a cup of tea.

    Most all my experiences come to me through a series of coincidences, some very improbable seeming. While I was at that same resort in California, a period of 2 weeks with my wife and an alchemical friend of ours, I had that experience already described, a similar audience delivered to a guy in the hot tub whose daughter, who was running around with my daughter, I had helped through something the previous year at that same resort when my wife had an asthma attack, the only one of her life and had an NDE in the parking lot looking for me and I was running around looking for her because I could feel something was happening, as I had been in the hot tub late with that other man. All three of us had a recurrence rebirth event walking into the dining room and sitting down for dinner and being reborn into a different 3 way world entirely and I had a recurrence event within that being told that this was the third time I was recurring here and that I had a death just up ahead and a problem to solve. This was 9 months before I found the mb12.
     
  9. Victoria

    Victoria Senior Member

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    Freddd,

    thankyou so much for taking the time to write all this down for me. I'm going to print it out at work (easier than home) & take it home & re-read it a few times over the weekend to take it all in.

    Your sentence on coincidences, suggests that you have these things happening to you many times.

    As I grow older I have this sense of people coming into my life for a specific reason.

    A little girl I cared for, was deeply troubled by her Mother's death 2 years previously, and after 3 years in my care, deep discussions on death & what it meant, and where her Mother might have "disappeared" to, seemed to bring her a sense of finality & acceptence. She was able to move on after I requested her Father allow her (& her brother) to see their Mother's grave. Her parents lived apart at the time of her Mother's death & the children had been staying with their Father for the weekend. She was only 4 at the time & had kissed her Mother, said goodbye on the Friday night & of course, her Mother had "disappeared without an trace" that weekend. She & her 2 year old brother weren't allowed to go to the Funeral (being supposedly too young at the time).

    But they had never had any sort of believable explanation given to them. They had no closure with this distressing event in their young lives. I was able to explain things to her in a language she could understand. But much more importantly, she no longer had the horrific nightmares which had plagued her for the 2 years previous to my entering their lives.

    I also went out with a rather troubled man about 20 years ago, who, through our relationship & discussions, was finally healed & able to move on. It seemed rather an abrupt parting at the time, but it appeared as though my relationshiop with him was totally about resolution of his emotional issues from the past, & when this was accomplished, he was "released".

    It seems to me that although many of us are unaware of the significance of the sequence of events & people in our lives, they are in fact, very important & have deeper meanings.

    Victoria
     
  10. jenbooks

    jenbooks Guest

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    I am reading Nobelist Kary Mullis' autobiography. He invented the PCR technique. He details many mystical experiences. It's a good read.
     
  11. R**

    R** Senior Member

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    My sister was sick for years, bedridden, severe dysautonomias, narcolepsy, RSD, CFS I suspect (no "legal" diagnosis), high viral antibodies, not tested for lyme. This was about 15 years ago. She gave up on doctors at some point. NDE from an annurism.

    She is functional today. It took a few years after the experience. She developed "gifts" like being able to see into her body (medical intuitive) and use that to visualize healing. She used medical books to see what she was seeing and the bodies healing natural healing response to whatever she saw. She became very gifted energetically. More.

    She also focused on scar tissue and knotted areas, lymph with trigger point work, massage. Spiritual perspective shifted dramatically.

    She had injuries that healed faster than the doctor expected once she was functioning again.. example (ice skating and fell back on her head.. imagine showed damage.. energy work.. image showed very fast healing that surprised doctors)

    She did not address pathogens or her gut or anything other than her energy work and trigger point focus on scars and lymph, knots.. she said she could work the scars out. Balancing ANS. She saw her illness as an imbalance of her ANS.

    I have not read the thread, so dont know how this fits in with the conversation.

    Oh.. also worked alot on her neck, brainstem area. Massage, heat cold therapy, energy.

    You people are too smart for me. I have no clue what you are talking about or if you are taking NDE seriously? I bring this up time and time and people blow it off and it is this experience that saved my sisters life. It is amazing, true, and, yes, unbelievable. Cant say the NDE saved her, but some shift did.
     
    kurt likes this.
  12. Victoria

    Victoria Senior Member

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    I take NDE's very seriously indeed, R**, & certainly believe you.
    But I admit Freddd is the expert in this area.
    Victoria
     
  13. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi R**,

    I've experienced huge shifts following an NDE, both in myself and in other people. Going on alchemical theory, it's when changes a person has made in themselves become part of their basic selves as opposed to an overlay of change during a life. During the NDE a basic part of the experiences is usually getting a good hard look at oneself in the LIGHT that illuminates everything. Whether a person remembers it consciously or not is a different matter from whether they are changed.
     
  14. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Victoria,


    Your sentence on coincidences, suggests that you have these things happening to you many times.

    I do. Though at some times in my life there have been clusters of events such as some of my vacations or at times trips to conferences. I'm not really all that accessable much of the time so when I travel I'm much more available so I seem to run into people who just happen to need something I can offer. I have had people sit down next to me at shopping malls, airplanes, swimming pools and such and before you know it we are deep into things doing serious alchemical work. These are usually by necessity some of the short occurances but somehow always long enough.

    I also went out with a rather troubled man about 20 years ago, who, through our relationship & discussions, was finally healed & able to move on. It seemed rather an abrupt parting at the time, but it appeared as though my relationshiop with him was totally about resolution of his emotional issues from the past, & when this was accomplished, he was "released".

    I've had many relationships "end" when a specific trauma or whatever was released and the person changes. For me at least, I usually know in advance that is going to occur, before I ever even meet the person. It's very clear that the person is going to be there for a specific reason and they stay until that reason is fullfilled and then very suddently, they are off in a different direction. Most are not going to stay for the long term to actually study and learn alchemy. That is not why they come. They are there for a specific limited reason. Mostly they are not conscious of this. Most stay until that reason is released. This can happen in one rebirth cycle and may take place in a couple of hours or a couple of years.

    I have to be able to go deeply into a person, to open my heart to them fully, without any "ownership". It's very different from what society teaches about how relationships are supposed to be. I have friends and fellow practioners with whom relationships last for decades. There are others there for a much shorter time, sometimes thinking they are going to be a student or whatever they have to tell themselves to do it.

    But they had never had any sort of believable explanation given to them. They had no closure with this distressing event in their young lives. I was able to explain things to her in a language she could understand. But much more importantly, she no longer had the horrific nightmares which had plagued her for the 2 years previous to my entering their lives.

    I've had people come to me sufferring from nightmares that resulted form past recurrance deaths and truely horrific experiences. Therapists insisting that the experiences never happened puts them into a defensive mode making them hold on tighter to the reality of experience instead of releasing the trauma. So a person talking about being raped and tortured to death in a recurrance isn't believed.

    We see the similar situation with Freud coming up with the theory that the girls and women claiming sexual abuse at the hands of their fathers must all be making it up since 1/3 of the men of 1900 Vienna couldn't possibly be abusing their daughters thereby defining the women as neurotic instead of accurately reporting what happened to them.
     
  15. R**

    R** Senior Member

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    alchemical theory

    Freddd.. what is alchemical theory?
     
  16. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi R**,

    Here is what I said in mentioning alchemical theory.

    I've experienced huge shifts following an NDE, both in myself and in other people. Going on alchemical theory, it's when changes a person has made in themselves become part of their basic selves as opposed to an overlay of change during a life. During the NDE a basic part of the experiences is usually getting a good hard look at oneself in the LIGHT that illuminates everything. Whether a person remembers it consciously or not is a different matter from whether they are changed.

    First, let me say that my language response is of course shaped by the archetypes that make sense to me. I'm a systems analyst. I see things as systems, including systems of thought. So in looking at b12 there are protocols based on certain underlying theory such as "pernicious anemia is the main manifestation of b12 deficiency and 1mg of cyanob12 per month is plenty to take care of that and all other b12 deficiency problems." Another theory is that "A combination of both active b12s given daily in multi mg doses is more effective at healing hundreds of symptoms". How effective protocols based on each theory is at healing a person or many persons can be compared. The treatment varies based on the theory used. The effects vary based on the treatment. Some theories produce protocols that work better or at least differently than other theories.

    So one theory looks at an NDE as a product of a breaking down neurological system when a body is close to death. Another theory looks at an NDE as a repeatable experience that causes a predictable growth and change within a person when paired with a rebirth experience that can happen at any time in a persons life, over and over again.

    On another front, one theory looks at orgasm as an almost accidental brief thing and that they are all the same and a product of "dirty" and shameful activity. Another theory looks at them as a pathway to the divine, a form of divine prayer, that there are at least 7 clearly definable and teachable forms of orgasm and that orgasms can continue for hours and produce ecstatic mystical and divine states of consciousness.

    Which theoretical basis a person uses can certainly influence their experiences. Since the one set of experiences is teachable, whether the theory is further correct or not in it's statement of prayerful, divine and mystical is a matter for further study. If nobody could ever learn the seven states and how to allow them to go on for hours, it would be a matter of faith. Since many have learned the 7 states and how to have them continue for hours, then the nature of that state is a matter of experienced opinion as opposed to having to take it on faith alone. Theories can be tested.

    Since alchemical theories about the nature of NDEs, orgasms, human existance, recurrance, reincarnation etc can be experienced and tested people can go by their own experiences rather than somebody's theoretical without experience say so. They may or may not be correct. However, theory says they can be taught, demonstrated and experienced.

    So theory and experience based on that theory can be used as a guide to interpretation. So when I speak of alchemical theory I mean a composite of understanding based on many underlying experiences and extended beyond the mere limits of those experiences and incorporating the expereinces of many others in the same fields.

    I've had people come to me sufferring from nightmares that resulted form past recurrance deaths and truely horrific experiences. Therapists insisting that the experiences never happened puts them into a defensive mode making them hold on tighter to the reality of experience instead of releasing the trauma. So a person talking about being raped and tortured to death in a recurrance isn't believed.

    Alchemical recurrance theory would say that the person really had such an experience on a different version of this timeline, this lifetime, and is traumatized by it as opposed to the person making up or imagining the experience and being traumatized by the imagining or dreaming of the experience. It also would say that the source of the belief in such experience really doesn't matter as the trauma is real no matter the cause of the trauma.
     
  17. ariel

    ariel

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    I'm finding this discussion absolutely fascinating, as well as a little bewildering.
    I haven't had a NDE but I do feel that over the last few months I am able to access information from higher planes more easily. I have no idea what to attribute that to though!

    Freddd would you be able to explain a little more about B12 and how that helps or disrupts metaphysical experiences?
     
  18. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Ariel,

    Freddd would you be able to explain a little more about B12 and how that helps or disrupts metaphysical experiences

    I'm afraid I can't be any where as near definite as your question. My experiences are merely suggestive of possible connections in some way. Some of it may appear contradictory.

    B12 deficiencies can cause:
    1. Sleep disorders
    2. Prolonged hypnogogic state
    3. Sleep paralysis
    4. Night terrors
    5. Sensory hallucinations including touch, auditory, olffactory and visual
    6. Altered consciousness as b12 decreases
    7. Altered moods as b12 decreases
    8. Altered personality as b12 decreases
    9. A pronounced experience of altered consciousness, mood and personality upon return of b12 and carnitine.
    10. Changes in deficiency hallucinations as b12 and carnitine increases
    11. In a vegetarian society (chronic b12 deficiency) a taboo tantric meal including beef and fish could cause a noticable neurological effect as b12, carnitine, omega3 oils increase 3 hours after the meal. During ritual practice these could be brought to an interpretation of spiritual experience, espcially when mixed with energy work and entering of altered states of consciousness also inducing spritual and mystical experiences.
    12. I have come across websites claiming that mb12 increases "connection", in a Tantric sense, between people.
    13. Certain research indicates that some of the sexual practices may result in b12 exchanges between people.
    14. Intercourse without condoms is documented to allow reduce depression in the woman by absorbtion of testosterone, and maybe other substances, vaginally. Perhaps b12 can also be absorbed that way, similarly to sublingual. The mucousal tissues are similar.
    15. Semen fluid is documented to contain relatively high levels of b12. Traditioanly it is also said to contain "energies" that will change a persons energy.
    16. Comparable tissue fluids in the woman may also contain b12 but this has not been documented that I can find. Those fluids are considered "medicines" and of a healing nature in certain tantric type systems. They are considered to contain "energies". Consumption of even a small amount of b12 in a person desparately deficient causes energetic reactions.
    17. B12 deficiency can cause unbalanced hypersensitive responses with mixed hyposensitivity. B12 restores a more balanaced sensitivity.
    Whether all this adds up to the active b12s having a metaphysical effect or not I can't really say.
     
  19. _Kim_

    _Kim_ Guest

    Um...I don't think I could hold that under my tongue for 45 minutes.
     
  20. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Salt Lake City

    Hi Kim,

    That does present some logistical problems. Alchemical sex is typically continued for hours and hours. Two hours is a real quicky.

    I had wanted to add the consciousness changing characteristics of all these items have been known for thousands of years and forbidden for just about as long. Today known consciousness changing items are still forbidden even if not the same ones.
     

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