Lots of test results. Uncertain how to proceed

[drew]

by Dr Lynch on March 1, 2012 in MTHFR Mutations

Methylfolate is a remarkable nutrient yet it can create significant side effects. Those who have MTHFR mutations (especially the C677T MTHFR mutation) learn that methylfolate is critical to take. The issue is methylfolate can cause more harm than good if not started at the right time or tapered up slowly in amount.

There appear to be three types of responses to methylfolate:

FIRST: A person who can jump on methylfolate and feel absolutely wonderful. The only down side they experience is why didn’t they know about methylfolate before?!

SECOND: A person starts methylfolate has an amazingly incredible week where they are happy, interacting and alert. Then the second week comes and they switch to wanting to hide in a room by themselves or literally throw dishes across the room out of anger. Or they may become bed ridden from muscle aches, intense headaches or joint pain.

THIRD: A person takes a small amount of methylfolate and feels all the methylfolate side effects right out the gate.
Methylfolate Side Effects:
• irritability
• insomnia
• sore muscles
• achy joints
• acne
• rash
• severe anxiety
• palpitations
• nausea
• headaches
• migraines

I definitely fall into the 3rd group!

 

[Valentijn]

Those who have MTHFR mutations (especially the C677T MTHFR mutation) learn that methylfolate is critical to take.

He's completely wrong about that part at least. There's been studies showing that a high-veggie diet corrects for increased risk of birth defects to the same extent that supplementation does.

Is he in the business of selling supplements?

 

[drew]

So a high-veggie diet can be consumed instead of taking folate? What quantity of vegies are we talking about?

 

[drew]

Just ordered my urine sulfate strips off amazon so will test by Sunday

 

[Valentijn]

So a high-veggie diet can be consumed instead of taking folate? What quantity of vegies are we talking about?

A normal quantity, in line with the food pyramid recommendations for vegetables (which few people meet).

 

[Valentijn]

The urine sulfate strips are supposed to be the best way to check for sulfur.

No, they aren't. They are designed for use in the industrial testing of water supplies. The results are highly dependent upon the pH, which is not going to be nearly as consistent as water, and will naturally vary throughout the day.

If you know of sulfur strips intended for medical use by the manufacturer, please provide a link to the relevant product and/or research showing the validation of those strips.

 

[Valentijn]

Just ordered my urine sulfate strips off amazon so will test by Sunday

Sorry I didn't see it sooner, but Caledonia has given you bad information. Those strips are useless for testing in urine. I'd suggest canceling the order if it isn't too late.

 

[drew]

A normal quantity, in line with the food pyramid recommendations for vegetables (which few people meet).

Does eating a "normal" quantity of veggies lead to potassium depletion like supplementing with metafolin does? Isn't the potassium depletion a sign that metafolin is working in someone that is deficient in folate?

 

[drew]

So what is the most accurate, reliable source of info then?

 

[Valentijn]

Does eating a "normal" quantity of veggies lead to potassium depletion like supplementing with metafolin does?

Does metafolin result in potassium depletion? It was my understanding that it's more of a methylB12 issue, but it's not something I've looked into much. Eating vegetables should not result in potassium depletion.

Isn't the potassium depletion a sign that metafolin is working in someone that is deficient in folate?

I don't know. According to some sources, every nasty symptom is a sign that the treatment is working, but they rarely have any good sources which support that claim. If something triggers problematic symptoms, that's a good sign to stop the treatment and/or consult with an actual doctor. Doctors can easily test potassium levels, and with far more accuracy than guessing based on a huge list of potential symptoms.

So what is the most accurate, reliable source of info then?

Published research. I'd stay away from anything originating from Yasko, people who repeat Yasko's claims, or anonymous people on the internet who don't have a medical license.

 

[drew]

Does metafolin result in potassium depletion?

I get low potassium symptoms, when I take as little as 200mcg.

The only reaction I get to methylB12 is become slightly hyper but no where near like I would with even a few sips of decaf starbucks.

 

[drew]

If I were to test sulfate via Quest Diagnostics and it shows that I have normal levels, can we then conclude that sulfate is not an issue for me?

Are there other ways to clear up the detox pathways without taking methylfolate?

 

[Valentijn]

If I were to test sulfate via Quest Diagnostics and it shows that I have normal levels, can we then conclude that sulfate is not an issue for me?

No idea. Best to ask a doctor about that.

Are there other ways to clear up the detox pathways without taking methylfolate?

Are there "detox pathways" which need clearing up?

 

[drew]

@Valentijn

My NutrEval results show high mercury and α-Ketophenylacetic Acid levels.

Sulfate is a methylation issue and doctors have no idea about methylation

 

[drew]

I get body odor and bad breath if I eat moderate amount of broccoli (and perhaps a 1-2 small cloves of garlic a day) but it's not a garlic smell that I emit, it's a sulfur smell. Does that have to do with the CBS gene or more indicative that my detox pathways are bad? Would the Heartfixer protocol address this?

Could using a sauna help with detoxing or would this be counterproductive since my ability to detox is compromised?

 

[caledonia]

@Valentijn

My NutrEval results show high mercury and α-Ketophenylacetic Acid levels.

High mercury on the Nutreval means a there is a current source of mercury, as it shows what's in the blood, not what's stored in your body. Most likely from your fillings.

 

[caledonia]

I get body odor and bad breath if I eat moderate amount of broccoli (and perhaps a 1-2 small cloves of garlic a day) but it's not a garlic smell that I emit, it's a sulfur smell. Does that have to do with the CBS gene or more indicative that my detox pathways are bad? Would the Heartfixer protocol address this?

That just sounds kind of normal to me, especially if you've been eating garlic. It sort of comes out your pores.

Could using a sauna help with detoxing or would this be counterproductive since my ability to detox is compromised?

If you have adrenal fatigue and/or don't do well it the heat or humidity, it would be best to avoid sauna. Otherwise, it could be a good thing to do, assuming you're replacing the electrolytes and water sweated out.

 

[drew]

@caledonia

High mercury on the Nutreval means a there is a current source of mercury, as it shows what's in the blood, not what's stored in your body. Most likely from your fillings.

Can you explain the difference and what the significance is? I was eating a lot of high mercury foods without knowing it so that may have been the reason for the high mercury.

If my detox pathways are not working properly, couldn't using a sauna have negative consequences?

 

[caledonia]

@caledonia


Can you explain the difference and what the significance is? I was eating a lot of high mercury foods without knowing it so that may have been the reason for the high mercury.

If my detox pathways are not working properly, couldn't using a sauna have negative consequences?

In that case, I would think the high mercury foods could also contribute. But the fillings are considered to be the largest source of mercury exposure, so I wouldn't rule those out either.

So, after you intake mercury from the environment (food, fillings, air, etc.) it goes into your bloodstream. Some of it will get detoxed out depending on your detox capacity. If your body is unable to totally detox it out, it will store the rest in your tissues, especially in the fat. Note that your brain is mostly made up of fat - that is one area of mercury storage, and where the neurological problems come from.

So a blood test, which is what the Nutreval uses, will show what's still circulating in the blood, and not what is in the tissues. Therefore, it would show a current exposure.

Is sauna safe if, for example, your liver is not detoxing well? Actually, it should be ok because it's eliminated via the sweat glands, and bypasses the liver. I would still suggest caution though, and working up gradually, taking all the precautions for replacing water and electrolytes, avoiding if you don't do well in heat and humidity, etc.

ps. Mercury impairs your ability to detox. So maybe you had a natural genetic tendency towards poor detox, but the presence of mercury makes this worse. Then, of course, as you get exposed to more mercury, you have less and less ability to detox it - it's a vicious downward spiral.

 

[drew]

@caledonia

How do I determine how well I am able to detox? How can I improve my ability to detox?