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Lightning Process to be Evaluated in Research Study on Children

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by Jenny, Mar 4, 2010.

  1. Dx Revision Watch

    Dx Revision Watch dxrevisionwatch.com

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    Available until tomorrow, 6 December:


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00w77k3/Power_to_Persuade_The_Story_of_NLP/

    BBC iPlayer

    BBC Radio 4, 11:00AM Mon, 29 Nov 2010



    Power to Persuade: The Story of NLP

    Available until: 11:32AM Mon, 6 Dec 2010

    Thousands claim NLP has changed their lives, but what exactly is it and is there any scientific evidence that it works?

    NLP - Neuro-Linguistic Programming - is a psychological approach originally developed in 1970s California by John Grinder and Richard Bandler. It was radically different from mainstream therapies of the time, offering its users fast results instead of the years of commitment required for psychoanalysis.

    Today NLP has found its way into all walks of life, spawning numerous practitioners and schools and offering many different ways to improve, from curing phobias or depression to becoming a better teacher, athlete or manager. Its most prolific gurus are multi-millionaires and, in the case of Paul McKenna, household names.

    But for all its commercial success and numerous devotees, NLP is seen by its critics as just another pseudo-science without robust evidence to support its claims. So does NLP genuinely help with powerful behavioural change, or can its achievements be explained by the placebo effect?

    William Little, journalist and author of The Psychic Tourist, finds out for himself what it's like to experience NLP techniques, meets those who have used it to change their lives and interviews its co-founder Richard Bandler, the charismatic exponent of so-called "persuasion engineering".
  2. lancelot

    lancelot Senior Member

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    southern california
    In the Lightning process, does anyone know how many times you have to chant "I don't have ME/CFS" before you don't have it anymore? does this only work for kids or does it also work for adults who can chant it many many more times? :rolleyes:
  3. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member

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    I listened to it. It was interesting to me that NLP hasn't come out so well in research or at least that was the impression given including by the NLP inventor complaining that the research wasn't the best way to look at the issue (I can't remember the details of what he said but if he was complaining it reinforced the idea that it hadn't come out so well in research).

    I thought it might work a bit more than some therapies but be a bit OTT for some people e.g. a lot of people don't need to be NLPed/hypnotized to deal with some situations and if you hypnotize/NLP/LP people with ME/CFS not to listen to their bodies, it's dangerous.
  4. Bob

    Bob

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    lancelot, I think that's LP, in a nutshell, isn't it!
    When you take away the PR and the spin, leaving just the fundamentals, then that's exactly how LP works.
    So why haven't the medical profession and the government worked that out yet?!?!?
  5. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    Phil Parker, Ed Stafford, Walking the Amazon and raising money for the ME Association and the ME Tissue Bank.


    Ed Stafford is the man who walked the Amazon.


    One of the causes he raised money for was the ME Association, the money to go to the Brain and Tissue Bank to investigate the causes of ME.


    Ed’s mother is Vice chair and Trustee of the MEA – and Lightning Process Entrepeneur Phil Parker is Ed’s mate (so Phil says). The mate who helped Ed with ‘managing’ his mind in the last 4 months of his walk down the Amazon. Now Ed Stafford thoroughly recommends Phil Parkers two day course called Peak Performance which he did in early November this year.


    Does Ed Stafford actually KNOW how contentious Phil Parker and his Lightning is? Does he know that Parker says ME is an adrenaline loop and claims to train it away? He is hardly likely to know that the MEA has officially condemned the Crawley/Parker Lightning Trial of children as unethical?

    How long has Ed Stafford known Phil Parker?



    Do you remember how that journalist Vikki Rimmer (Phil Parkers former PR for Lighting Process) appeared and reported on and managed the media coverage of Ed Stafford's journey? Vikki Rimmer handled Ed Stafford’s PR and media coverage.


    Does Ed's mother Barbara Stafford , MEA Vice Chair and Trustee, know anything about this - and are the MEA aware of Phil Parkers connection with Ed Stafford?


    Did Ed Stafford actually know Parker before he set off up the Amazon or was the connection made later via Phil Parkers former PR woman Vikki Rimmer (while Ed was in the Amazon)?


    I suspect that Ed probably doesn't actually know much about ME or how much opposition there is to Phil Parker and his Lightning Process.




    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




    Ed’s mother Barbara Stafford is Vice Chair of the ME Association, and Trustee:
    http://www.charity-commission.gov.u...tyNumber=801279&SubsidiaryNumber=0&TID=892341






    Raising money for ME biomedical research:

    http://www.walkingtheamazon.com/charity/

    The ME Association

    There are 1/4 million ME sufferers in the UK . At best ME can be described as presenting flu-like symptoms. At worst people are bed bound, unable to wash or feed themselves or comb their hair. For a long time now it has been recognised by The World Health Organisation as a physical illness, often resulting from a viral infection but its causes are not yet known. Ed’s mother Ba is Vice Chairman of The ME Association and feels passionate about medical research With funding the ME Association is working towards the setting up of a brain and tissue bank to investigate the causes. Donate Now >>




    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~






    Phil Parker’s Blog

    http://philparkerblog.blogspot.com/2010_09_01_archive.html

    Monday, 20 September 2010
    Back from the Do lectures, involving a 7 1/2 hr bike trip to Cardigan through the awesome scenery of the Brecon Beacons; wild welsh whiskey with the brilliant Ed Stafford- Amazonian explorer, laughter and sartorial elegance with designing genius Steve Edge and tea with Tim Berners-Lee. Met so many extraordinary people... more to follow...
    Posted by Phil Parker at 07:50











    http://www.edstafford.org/peak-performance-and-uk-sport

    Peak Performance and UK Sport

    by Ed on 10. Nov, 2010 in Expeditions, Speaking Events, Walking the Amazon
    I’m sitting in the Fairmont Hotel in St Andrews sipping a pint of Coke and catching my breath before I fly back to London to continue an amazing week.

    Monday and Tuesday were inspiring days where I attended a two day course called Peak Performance given by my mate Phil Parker. Phil was the NLP guru that helped me manage my mind whilst I was struggling in the Amazon after walking for two years and with still four months to go. I’d lost perspective and was in quite a dark place but a few handy tips from Phil gave me all the tools I needed to stay positive.
    Phil’s just started this course that is aimed at successful people who want to achieve their absolute best. Harnessing everything that they’ve got going for them and managing any destructive behaviour they might have. The course was phenomenal and I will use the training in so many aspects of my life




    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~









    The Do Lectures, Wales September 2010
    http://www.dolectures.com/speakers/

    Speakers
    Phil Parker
    Inventing a new word to change our behaviour. How good could you be? Phil, believes you are a genius. And that you have amazing untapped skills. And he knows how to make you believe that too.

    Ed Stafford
    Explorer & Adventurer. Ed Stafford spent 2 and a half years walking the entire length of the Amazon river in South America from source to sea. He is the first man ever to walk it.






    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~






    Vikki Rimmer
    http://www.presscontact.co.uk/




    Vikki Rimmer did media relations for Ed Stafford Walking the Amazon from the beginning, whilst being Publicist for Phil Parkers Lighting Process:
    http://uk.linkedin.com/in/vikkirimmer
    Media Relations
    Walking The Amazon/ Ed Stafford
    (Public Relations and Communications industry)
    June 2004 — Present (6 years 7 months)

    Publicist
    The Phil Parker Lightning Process
    (Health, Wellness and Fitness industry)
    February 2008 — February 2009 (1 year 1 month)
    PR and publicist for the Lightning Process an innovative training program which has helped thousands recover their health






    Vikki Rimmer, who claims she cured her ME by Lightning here writes about LP in the magazine Positive Health (2008):


    The Lightning Process Treatment for ME
    by Vikki Rimmer

    http://www.positivehealth.com/articles/cfs-me/2470


    ‘….a training programme, based on the concepts of Osteopathy, NLP and Hypnotherapy is having positive results at a clinic in North London. The Phil Parker Lightning Process (LP) was developed by Osteopath Phil Parker seven years ago after many years of working with ME and CFS sufferers.

    Parker says: “The Phil Parker Lightning Process is the result of my research over the last decade into why, when problems occur in people’s lives, some of them hit a wall and get stuck and others seem to be able to deal with the difficulties in a different way and move forward.”



    Understanding the Mind/Body Link
    The research undertaken by Phil Parker looked at how the brain and body become trapped in a number of damaging unconscious responses, which blight health and stunt lives. Applying a powerful combination of techniques uniquely developed using the philosophies and research of NLP, Osteopathy, Self Hypnosis and Life Coaching, Parker began to achieve significant results with clients by training them to successfully replace old unhelpful responses and start to regain their health, their sense of self and their future.


    How Does It Work?
    Using the LP’s technique of combining particular body movements and postures with a set of precisely targeted questions. many people have got their health back into balance, quickly and successfully, recovering from real illnesses that had troubled them for years.

    The Process is specifically tailored to an individual’s needs and abilities, and the trainee is supported and assisted by an experienced trainer throughout the seminar and afterwards as required.

    The three-days training programme teaches, step by step, how to influence key body systems such as the immunological, neurological and musculo-skeletal system. Ex-England Rugby player Austin Healey has spoken of the joy he felt after his wife resolved five years of her debilitating fight with the illness which literally lays sufferers’ lives to waste. Austin says: “We’d been searching for five years to find a cure for my wife Louise’s ME. We found the Lightning Process delivered that cure. Louise is now completely recovered and our future is brilliant again.”





    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~






    And she’s won an award:

    Vikki Rimmer

    http://www.journalism.co.uk/news-ev...team-freelancer-of-the-year-2009/s14/a537642/

    PR freelancer Vikki Rimmer has won the Xchangeteam Freelancer of the Year Award.

    Rimmer won the award for her work on Ed Stafford and his attempt to be the first person to walk the length of the Amazon. Stafford undertook the bid in order to raise awareness about climate change.

    The awards ceremony took place last night at the Design Council in Covent Garden.

    Eleven finalists had been shortlisted in the editorial category, the highest number since the awards began in 2003



    Judge Suzanne Peck said she chose Vikki specifically “for her innovative and tenacious approach to securing publicity and funding for her client”.
  6. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    Reposted with live link (I hope)




    Looks like Phil Parker has convinced some of his Twitter friends that ME is a “perceived limitation” that needs to be “broken through”, and we mustn’t be “passive” about it:




    Phil Parker’s Twitterings:
    http://twitter.com/philparkerLP

    Don't be passive about perceived limitations; watch @philparkerLP 's video for tools to break through: http://ow.ly/2XlRd
  7. lancelot

    lancelot Senior Member

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    southern california
    Why hasn't the medical profession and the government worked that out yet? You have to remember that this is in the UK where the government run media and government/psycho run healthcare sees ME/CFS as only a psychological disease. the UK government and its healthcare welcomes CBT, GET, LP, Mickel therapy, Reverse therapy, Gupta Amygdala retraining and any other vodoo treatments for CFS/ME. I have no hope for the UK until the US finally uncovers the cause of CFS/ME. Then, how can the UK accept the truth without looking like assholes for decades of their junk psycho treatments and hurting hundreds of thousands of patients. How can the UK accept that? No, they must deny deny DENY to save face!!
  8. Bob

    Bob

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    I'm very sorry to say that this is the conclusion I have come to myself recently.
    I've been ill for about 6 or 7 years now, and for the past 3 to 4 years I've been doing my little bit to campaign for a better deal for ME patients, while watching so many other individuals and organisations in our community do an immense amount of work campaigning for our community. We've had MP's, members of the House of Lords, patient groups and organisations, scientists and charities speak up for us.
    And then the latest UK research funding figures came out for 2009/10, and I realised that the progress we have made can only be explained by walking on a treadmill that's going in the opposite direction faster than we are walking.
    I'm feeling quite defeated at the moment, in terms of UK government policy, research and services for ME.
    And then to know that this LP research on children is being carried out right now, as we continue to protest, with unknown damage being done to the children, makes me very sad.
    The only thing that gives me some reason to carry on being politically active is to think where we might have been if the ME community had been doing nothing... In which case Wessely may well have got his way entirely.
    I apologise to everyone for being so negative and for feeling so defeated, but I think I'm being realistic in pointing out that we seem to have achieved nothing!
    It was the latest MRC funding figures that got to me, and this LP research as well. Together, they have both made me feel that our community is very disenfranchised right now, and politically very impotent.
    If anyone wants to give me a moral boost here, and tell me I'm wrong, then you'd be very welcome. Maybe I'm missing something.
    I'm very tempted to do nothing, forget it all, and wait for the XMRV truth to unfold.
    I think the UK ME community needs to have a big discussion about where we are, where we are heading, what we want, where we want to be heading, and how we can go about getting there. And I think we need to combine our resources to get to where we want to be. The ME community seems to be somewhat fragmented and uncoordinated.
    Anyway... apologies again for being so negative... I think this is a discussion for another thread... So I think I'll start a fresh thread on the subject.

    New thread started:
    http://forums.aboutmecfs.org/showth...d-by-our-political-system&p=142217#post142217
  9. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member

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    Good point

    Well one good thing is a steady amount of money is being raised privately for research in the UK ever year - that wasn't happening 20 years ago. Patients in the UK perhaps haven't really seen this translate to great things yet. However, like with XMRV, there could be a big breakthrough. And it all helps in the propaganda wars. One thing that could change things is if tests could get to the level that they were good markers for ME/CFS. So that even CBT, GET or LP trials would be required to use them - I read a Lupus CBT trial a while back where they used various markers but as I recall basically all they found was changes on the questionnaires. The hype of these treatments could fall flat then.

    It is risky to put all of one's eggs in one basket, I think.
  10. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    The ME Association are now asking ME sufferers to vote for Ed Stafford as National Geographic' "Adventurer of the Year".

    Despite the fact that Ed is doing a form of Product Placement for Phil Parker and his products.
  11. Min

    Min Senior Member

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    disgusting
  12. Bob

    Bob

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    My guess is that Ed is just uninformed about the issues surrounding LP for ME patients... Like most people seem to be.
    Did you say earlier, Wildcat, that Ed was raising money for a good ME cause, that isn't related to LP?
  13. Bob

    Bob

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    Thanks for the thoughtful feedback Dolphin,
    I think I'm looking towards the USA for research breakthroughs now... I can't see anything significant happening in the UK.
    As other people have pointed out to me, at least the XMRV research has sparked a renewed interest in ME as a biological illness in the USA, even if XMRV leads nowhere.
  14. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    Originally Posted by Wildcat
    The ME Association are now asking ME sufferers to vote for Ed Stafford as National Geographic' "Adventurer of the Year". Despite the fact that Ed is doing a form of Product Placement for Phil Parker and his products."


    Bob wrote:
    "My guess is that Ed is just uninformed about the issues surrounding LP for ME patients... Like most people seem to be. Did you say earlier, Wildcat, that Ed was raising money for a good ME cause, that isn't related to LP?"



    It looks like doesn't know, but his mother, Barbara Stafford, is an MEA Trustee, in fact Vice Chair of the MEA - so she should have put Ed in the picture, especially as the MEA has made an offical condemnation of the LP Trial on children.


    One of the good causes that people are donating to via Eds site is The ME Association - for ME bioresearch.
    To assume that the good will balance out the harm would, in my view, be short sighted.


    That Ed is now endorsing Phil Parkers Trainings puts the MEA in a position of accepting money for bioresearch with very long strings attached. I have put up a lot of links and evidence on the matter earlier in this thread. The MEA is burying its head in the sand. The MEA is asking its members and others on the Facebook to vote for Ed in the National Geographic Adventurer of the Year vote. But many ME sufferers and their families are not aware of Ed Staffords connection with Phil Parker and his endorsement of Phil's trainings.


    What a mess. But the message from the MEA on its Facebook is - "So what?"

    I really think the time for being easy going and open minded about the NLP exploiters of ME sufferers is over. Being philosphical about the exploiters does not help the sufferers in dire straights - Parkers damage to the ME community does not even stop at the patients who have been damaged by Lightning.

    He has badly misrepresented our disease in the media for many years; friends and relations think we should do Lighting to recover. Why would our doctors, DWP/DLA/ESA asessors, MPs, Ministers think taht mE is a disabling disease if they read about the Lighting 'cures' in the papers every other week?


    It has been pointed out that it may be assumed by parents that Eds endorsement of Parkers trainings has something to do with the MEA by extension, and that maybe the SMILE trail would bemore attractive to parents.

    Don't underestimate Mr Parkers nose for publicity. Seven years ago hardly anyone had heared of him, now he claims that famous people make their way to his door for his trainings and NLP. Parker used the letters ME to get his name into the national papers and on national TV; his busines ambitions are not small - thats why he markets Lightning as a Brand, and Trademarked and Licenced it from the beginning.
  15. Dx Revision Watch

    Dx Revision Watch dxrevisionwatch.com

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    Ed's sister is an ME patient.

    Ed's mother is a trustee of the ME Association.
  16. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    “Phil has an amazing toolbox of skills and the experience to help you get the best out of yourself, whatever your challenge. I’ve found every ‘peak performer’ needs a great coach, for me, Phil’s unique approach makes him the coach.”
    Ed Stafford, Amazon Explorer



    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




    Phil Parker's Lightning business has already gained so much from celebrity endorsements.

    Many people who do Lightning, and parents of children who do Lighting (I doubt if they understand what it involves in order to give informed consent) state that it was reading that Esther Rantzen’s daughter or Austin Healy's wife had done Lighting that encouraged them to try it.




    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




    Phil Parkers latest version of his Peak Performance (P4) website:

    http://p4training.com/Home/

    Before P4 there was just training...
    Phil Parker Peak Performance (P4)


    This is a completely new approach for business success and optimising performance. It has been developed by peak perfomance expert Phil Parker to enhance success and ensure consistency in top performers. This powerful programme trains professionals in perfecting performance, excelling in competitive conditions and handling high pressure environments.

    "Peak Performance is not a luxury- it's a necessity and it isn't something you just have, it is something anyone can learn." Phil Parker, Designer of P4



    “Phil has an amazing toolbox of skills and the experience to help you get the best out of yourself, whatever your challenge. I’ve found every ‘peak performer’ needs a great coach, for me, Phil’s unique approach makes him the coach.”
    Ed Stafford, Amazon Explorer




    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



    The Phil Parker Group online Store
    http://store.philparker.org/c/Home/

    Our Best Selling Titles
    Lightning Process
    Phil Parker
  17. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    http://www.edstafford.org/peak-performance-and-uk-sport

    Peak Performance and UK Sport

    by Ed on 10. Nov, 2010 in Expeditions, Speaking Events, Walking the Amazon

    “I’m sitting in the Fairmont Hotel in St Andrews sipping a pint of Coke and catching my breath before I fly back to London to continue an amazing week.

    Monday and Tuesday were inspiring days where I attended a two day course called Peak Performance given by my mate Phil Parker. Phil was the NLP guru that helped me manage my mind whilst I was struggling in the Amazon after walking for two years and with still four months to go. I’d lost perspective and was in quite a dark place but a few handy tips from Phil gave me all the tools I needed to stay positive.

    Phil’s just started this course that is aimed at successful people who want to achieve their absolute best. Harnessing everything that they’ve got going for them and managing any destructive behaviour they might have. The course was phenomenal and I will use the training in so many aspects of my life.”


    .
  18. Wildcat

    Wildcat Senior Member

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    Ed Stafford now describes himself professionally as 'Explorer, Writer , Motivational Speaker'.


    I wonder for how many years in his public numerous speaking engagements Ed will be crediting Phil Parker with motivating him to finish his Amazon walk???


    .
  19. Enid

    Enid Senior Member

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    But the "lightning process" -yes I tried and tested (intuitively) most of it. No good whatsoever if bedbound unable to swallow in a twilight world - unable to converse just manage to find the loo etc. It is not a cure - simply an aid for those well enough to move on. Such miracle claims detract from finding the REAL underlying viral cause.
    .
  20. Bob

    Bob

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    For clarity, Ed is not promoting LP, in any way, as far as I am aware.

    Personally, I don't care what Phil Parker does when it isn't related to people with ME. So if Ed found Phil Parker's 'Peak Performance' NLP stuff useful as a motivational tool, then that's fine by me.

    Actually, if LP was promoted purely as a motivation tool for people with ME, rather than a cure, therapy or treatment, then I don't think I'd have too much of a problem with it. It's only the misrepresentation of the nature of LP and the associated misrepresentation of the nature of ME that I have a problem with.

    I think we must be very careful to separate the issues before publicly attacking Ed, and using words like "disgusting" in relation to him.
    As long as Ed is promoting Phil Parker's courses as a motivational tool for adults without ME, then I think that's not an issue for us.

    And it doesn't automatically make Ed a bad person if he is involved with Phil Parker, LP or NLP.
    If Ed starts promoting LP as a therapy for ME, then obviously, I would think it was misguided, and it would be good for us to point out to him the issues, in case he doesn't know about them.

    Wildcat, you seem to be assuming that everyone working for MEA would be aware of all the issues surrounding LP. That's not necessarily the case. In their minds, the LP study on children might be a problem whereas the use of LP on willing adults might not be an issue for them at all. I don't know what MEA's stance on the normal LP course for ME patients is, as opposed to the study on children. I don't follow their work closely.

    I just thought I'd point these things out before people say things about Ed without thinking through, and separating, all of the issues. Basically, I think that if there are issues with what Ed is doing, then people should contact Ed personally, rather than being negative about him on a public forum... He's not a politician or a scientist, and he doesn't pretend to represent the ME community... He's just an individual who has raised some money for an ME charity. And he isn't promoting LP as a therapy for ME, as far as I know, so he isn't interfering with our community, like some celebrities do.

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