A New Decade of ME Research: The 11th Invest in ME International ME Conference 2016
Mark Berry presents the first in a series of articles on the 11th Invest in ME International ME Conference in London ...
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Let's look at the facts in light of actions by the cdc / uk shrinks re: Cfids/me

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by muffin, Jul 31, 2010.

  1. muffin

    muffin Senior Member

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    knackers323 Join Date:Sep 2009
    "Here is a theory. Lets say this UK state secret is that they know XMRV is the cause of CFS? And people like weesley have been put in place to push the psychological line to deliberately keep it hidden. It is only that a private, non government run lab stumbled across it that it has now come out.
    If this were true we should be very worried that this discovery will be buried again and we may miss our chance for answers. Is this why we are seeing the delay with the Alter paper?
    In my mind I don’t think this could be a so far fetched scenario. I can’t believe we can’t get this information released somehow.
    If there is supposedly 17 million of us worldwide with CFS, much more than say MS, then why are these other conditions so well known and having things done to help the cause, when nothing is being done for us?"
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    ->>>Muffin says: I do think there is an over-abundant amount of evidence that strongly suggests that the US CDC/CFS and the UK (Weasel, White, Sharpe, etc) are PART OF a 30 plus year conspiracy to cover-up a known virus or multiple viruses (or maybe other pathogen(s)). This would have had to start at the top of our governments, maybe in the military part (Hence, the excuse that this was covered up for "National Security" reasons, as I expect will be the case when it ALL comes out). So, Reeves (other US types), the UK Weasel (and others) were told to do everything possible to keep CFIDS/ME a psychological disorder so that no one believes it could be a very real disease and to keep us all under any radar what so ever.

    When there is something like 5,000 plus medical studies/documents on CFIDS/ME and everything surrounding the disease, the CDC/UK shrinks/virologists/researchers still refuse to admit that this is a real disease? Give me a break! They know darn well that this whole thing is not psychological but very much a real and severe physical disease. How could they not believe it? They aren’t stupid, they aren’t crazy but they are true sociopaths and may well have been told that this was of the highest National Security and to keep the “crazy, lazy label” for CFIDS/ME going to cover-up whatever the governments did, deliberately or accidently, decades ago.


    Then we have the UK document that has been sealed for 83 years? Right. That too has to be National Security and not just protecting the names of the ill, etc. As stated before, a black marker would take care of the issue of personal information. Just black out personal info and be done with it. But the UK folks didn’t do that. Instead they locked down a 40 page document (or part of a document) for a rather suspicious amount of time. I and my husband requested access to that document knowing full well that we would be denied – and we were denied with the typical bureaucratic reasons given.

    I have to wonder if this now CDC splicing of CFIDS/CFS/ME is a part of a long-standing plan that was instituted either as part of the whole plan created decades ago or in the event that a virus was indeed found and flew right into the faces of the UK and US government theories. The collusion between the UK shrinks and the US CDC idiots has been long-standing and united, regardless of the intense efforts of many groups to force CFIDS/ME to be regarded as a real disease rather than a psychological (early childhood abuse, maladaptive personality, etc) disorder(s). Regardless of the huge number of hard-core medical studies, the millions of terribly sick, the deaths attributed to CFIDS/ME, and the demands made by the patients, advocates, doctors, researchers – these UK/US sociopaths still refuse to budge.

    I don’t believe this is only about the potential for damaged egos, careers, reputations. Those issues could have been easily fixed right after the stupidity of the Incline Village cluster debacle. Research on the Defreitas virus could have been done in parallel with HIV/AIDS with both viruses benefiting hugely. Money would actually have been saved from a two front research assault on these RETROVIRUSES. But that did not happen. Instead, HIV got the billions of funding and CFIDS/ME got labeled as psychological with what tiny amounts of money going to “research” that tried to “prove” the psychological instead of the very real physical. This tactic to spend funding on HIV and not on another possibly related Retrovirus was deliberate, but not in an effort to save money. And probably the insurance companies got into the act but they would not have had THIS much impact on research for this long with this many sick and dying. That doesn’t make total sense either. Had research been started from the get-go on CFIDS/ME at about the same time as HIV/AIDS, money actually would have been saved in the medium and long –run. The immense loss of income from millions disabled would not have occurred. The amount of Social Security Disability would be much lower for US CFIDS/ME sick. The insurance companies would not have had to spend millions fighting legal battles against the CFIDS/M sick – had the government(s) of the US and UK only did the CFIDS/ME research in parallel with HIV/AIDS. None of this makes sense to me. The whole money aspect doesn’t work – not after 30 years. It just doesn’t work. That leaves us with the horrible conspiracies by our own governments in covering up something.

    Think it all through. How can the CDC and the UK idiots refute thousands of serious medical research documents and studies done by highly respected and regarded researchers? They can not. Why is the CDC splitting the “I’m Tired” from the “Neurological disorder” now? Possibly part of the plan from the start or part of the CYA plan if someone (in this case the WPI/NCI/CC and soon the FDA and NIH) figured out that there was indeed a virus involved. They (the CDC and NIH) killed off the Defreitas virus and any further Retrovirus research from the late 1980’s until 2008, but that cat got out of the bag and so now we see this ridiculously transparent split between the “I’m Tired” and the “Neurological Disordered”. This new split is so very transparent to anyone bothering to pay a small amount of attention. It is so damn stupid that it is insulting. But the CDC and the UK sociopaths don’t care. They now it is utterly transparent but they have that insane amount of hubris and the sociopath personalities that allow them to continue this charade – they simply don’t care what anyone else thinks or says. (See the definition and signs of a true sociopath. The discussion fits with the personalities of Reeves and Weasel and their followers).

    What I do not understand is why someone, somewhere has not come forward and told the whole truth. How could anyone stand by and watch as millions are disabled, their lives destroyed and thousands more die a terrible death and then not do or say anything to stop it or make it public? HOW? Dear God, there has to be one single person whose conscious can not take any more of this cover-up. Where is that person? How can they live with themselves knowing that their actions/inaction is the cause of 30 plus years of millions of terribly suffering sick/pained and dead? How is it possible to look at children and the very young and not respond? It’s one thing when it affects the older group of people who have had full or near full lives, but an altogether different thing when it is children and the very young who have not had a chance at any real life.

    Below is the profile of sociopaths. We know that the anti-CFIDS/ME crew are indeed sociopaths, but what about the other people who also are involved? Are they too sociopaths as well?

    I’m beyond disgusted. This isn’t just about money, egos, careers, reputations – it’s much more than those issues. There has to be a much larger and far more powerful situation and group involved in keeping CFIDS/ME research/credibility damaged and damaged for this long.
    Profile of the Sociopath (http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html)
    This website summarizes some of the common features of descriptions of the behavior of sociopaths.

    • Glibness and Superficial Charm
    • Manipulative and Conning
    They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.
    • Grandiose Sense of Self
    Feels entitled to certain things as "their right."
    • Pathological Lying
    Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.
    • Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt
    A deep seated rage, which is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.
    • Shallow Emotions
    When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.
    • Incapacity for Love
    • Need for Stimulation
    Living on the edge. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal. Promiscuity and gambling are common.
    • Callousness/Lack of Empathy
    Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.
    • Poor Behavioral Controls/Impulsive Nature
    Rage and abuse, alternating with small expressions of love and approval produce an addictive cycle for abuser and abused, as well as creating hopelessness in the victim. Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their impact on others.
    • Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency
    Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.
    • Irresponsibility/Unreliability
    Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.
    • Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity
    Promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts.
    • Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
    Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.
    • Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
    Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.
    ________________________________________
    Other Related Qualities:
    1. Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them
    2. Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them
    3. Authoritarian
    4. Secretive
    5. Paranoid
    6. Only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired
    7. Conventional appearance
    8. Goal of enslavement of their victim(s)
    9. Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life
    10. Has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love)
    11. Ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim
    12. Incapable of real human attachment to another
    13. Unable to feel remorse or guilt
    14. Extreme narcissism and grandiose
    15. May state readily that their goal is to rule the world

    (The above traits are based on the psychopathy checklists of H. Cleckley and R. Hare.)
    ________________________________________

    NOTE: In the 1830's this disorder was called "moral insanity." By 1900 it was changed to "psychopathic personality." More recently it has been termed "antisocial personality disorder" in the DSM-III and DSM-IV. Some critics have complained that, in the attempt to rely only on 'objective' criteria, the DSM has broadened the concept to include too many individuals. The APD category includes people who commit illegal, immoral or self-serving acts for a variety of reasons and are not necessarily psychopaths.
    ________________________________________

    DSM-IV Definition

    Antisocial personality disorder is characterized by a lack of regard for the moral or legal standards in the local culture. There is a marked inability to get along with others or abide by societal rules. Individuals with this disorder are sometimes called psychopaths or sociopaths.

    Diagnostic Criteria (DSM-IV)

    1. Since the age of fifteen there has been a disregard for and violation of the right's of others, those right's considered normal by the local culture, as indicated by at least three of the following:
    A. Repeated acts that could lead to arrest.
    B. Conning for pleasure or profit, repeated lying, or the use of aliases.
    C. Failure to plan ahead or being impulsive.
    D. Repeated assaults on others.
    E. Reckless when it comes to their or others safety.
    F. Poor work behavior or failure to honor financial obligations.
    G. Rationalizing the pain they inflict on others.

    2. At least eighteen years in age.

    3. Evidence of a Conduct Disorder, with its onset before the age of fifteen.

    4. Symptoms not due to another mental disorder.
    ________________________________________

    Antisocial Personality Disorder Overview (Written by Derek Wood, RN, BSN, PhD Candidate)

    Antisocial Personality Disorder results in what is commonly known as a Sociopath. The criteria for this disorder require an ongoing disregard for the rights of others, since the age of 15 years. Some examples of this disregard are reckless disregard for the safety of themselves or others, failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors, deceitfulness such as repeated lying or deceit for personal profit or pleasure, and lack of remorse for actions that hurt other people in any way. Additionally, they must have evidenced a Conduct Disorder before the age of 15 years, and must be at least 18 years old to receive this diagnosis.

    People with this disorder appear to be charming at times, and make relationships, but to them, these are relationships in name only. They are ended whenever necessary or when it suits them, and the relationships are without depth or meaning, including marriages. They seem to have an innate ability to find the weakness in people, and are ready to use these weaknesses to their own ends through deceit, manipulation, or intimidation, and gain pleasure from doing so.

    They appear to be incapable of any true emotions, from love to shame to guilt. They are quick to anger, but just as quick to let it go, without holding grudges. No matter what emotion they state they have, it has no bearing on their future actions or attitudes.

    They rarely are able to have jobs that last for any length of time, as they become easily bored, instead needing constant change. They live for the moment, forgetting the past, and not planning the future, not thinking ahead what consequences their actions will have. They want immediate rewards and gratification. There currently is no form of psychotherapy that works with those with antisocial personality disorder, as those with this disorder have no desire to change themselves, which is a prerequisite. No medication is available either. The only treatment is the prevention of the disorder in the early stages, when a child first begins to show the symptoms of conduct disorder.
    ________________________________________

    [Taken in part from MW -- By Caroline Konrad -- September 1999

    THE MALIGNANT PERSONALITY:

    These people are mentally ill and extremely dangerous! The following precautions will help to protect you from the destructive acts of which they are capable.

    First, to recognize them, keep the following guidelines in mind.

    (1) They are habitual liars. They seem incapable of either knowing or telling the truth about anything.

    (2) They are egotistical to the point of narcissism. They really believe they are set apart from the rest of humanity by some special grace.

    (3) They scapegoat; they are incapable of either having the insight or willingness to accept responsibility for anything they do. Whatever the problem, it is always someone else's fault.

    (4) They are remorselessly vindictive when thwarted or exposed.

    (5) Genuine religious, moral, or other values play no part in their lives. They have no empathy for others and are capable of violence. Under older psychological terminology, they fall into the category of psychopath or sociopath, but unlike the typical psychopath, their behavior is masked by a superficial social facade. You may also find more at http://sociopathworld.com/.
     
  2. usedtobeperkytina

    usedtobeperkytina Senior Member

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    Clay, Alabama
    Sorry, my comment is that this is Saturday and I am having a good day so I am just browsing briefly so I can actually do some work on my house. Maybe later I can take the time to read your post thoroughly. I was a little long. (Not a criticism, mine are long sometimes too)

    Tina
     
  3. Levi

    Levi Senior Member

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    You can't HANDLE the facts . . .

    (using my best Jack Nicholson impersonation) the whole conspiracy theory terrain is so ripe for picking that its ironic. You could not make this stuff up. For instance, everyone here is sitting on pins and needles waiting for the release of an embargoed paper authored by none other than Dr. Shyh-Ching Lo. If you google him, you will come up with a ton of conspiracy theory sites like this one:

    http://www.rense.com/general18/mcc.htm

    Is it true that Dr. Lo hails from past military bio-warfare programs? Experiments on prison inmates? I don't know. But the purported connection makes me wonder a bit about the Lo/Alter paper's potential to be the saving grace for the world CFS/ME community. Are we all REALLY expecting the NIH to come to the rescue here?

    As for shrinks like Wessely and Reeves, if they are in fact hired guns taking direction from the higher echelons of government(s), that would explain why they are churning out massive quantities of published work that is of such poor quality. They obviously don't care about their reputations as scientific researchers. Thus, the reports they produce dripping with so much confirmation bias "fill the bill", so to speak.
     
  4. paddygirl

    paddygirl Senior Member

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    My first comment Muffin is that it explains my ex husbands behavior - and I'm only half joking!

    But seriously, I'm nodding away while reading. It is a lot to take in, which is maybe why not many comments yet.

    I'm in bed since 1pm today after work, can get no peace with pain and fevers and I'm not up to much analyses.

    I only heard of the CDC and the whole Cfids outrage last October 9/10th, when a headline in the London Independent caught my eye. Before that I was one of the many walking wounded. Struggling to work and live and half taking on board the psychological nonsense. While I regularly update several people on the latest xmrv news, I am a newbie compared to so many on this site in terms of research, and certainly recall.

    Yes, it stinks to heaven. I often think of how Judy Mikovits sees it. I saw recently (I think it was Cort reporting on it) that some people think she was intemperate in her autism/epidemic comments, but she is a scientist, always looking for proof, the black and white of proof. And up until that point, intelligent measured supposition. I'm sure her swift education in the politics of Cfids has fuelled her outrage, and to a degree, walked her into her detractors trap. The shining truth goes against many peoples agendas.

    As I get older, I'm amazed at how so many groups see humans as a 'herd' to fit into their company balance sheets. This could be private or gov. I saw a scary post the other day, can't remember who, about all the covered up botched experiments that used vulnerable powerless groups (poor pregnant women, poor black men) to their own ends in medical 'experiments' Modern day Nazism.
    Just better hidden, with a stamp of approval and a discreet blind eye from government.

    What hasn't helped us is the 'invisibility' of this illness. I rarely go to the doctor, just for prescriptions and then I have to sidestep the usual 'will you try Lyrica/Cymbalta/Lunesta' pitch.

    Plus I struggle into work each day, sitting down when I can or just moving to stop falling down.
    Friends and family, while believing me to a degree, probably think its my job or life stress thats causing it. So many of us are under the radar, will the true figure ever be known.

    So yes Muffin, not many posts means many agree, and it takes some digesting.

    Paddy x
     
  5. Cloud

    Cloud Guest

    I have read some of the info on Dr Lo's past involvement in military bio-warfare programs. I think it was the stuff about the engineered micoplasma.....not sure, been a while.

    Muffin, I don't think your perspective is nut-job at all. Knowing our history makes it really difficult to discount the idea of a cover up on some level. It's a long stretch to explain this charade as just ignorance or egos. I thought those ideas would have been thrown out after the NIH/FDA study hold. Seems apparent to me that they know something they want to have kept out of mainstream.
     
  6. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    Hi Muffin,

    I almost posted something on another thread that related to your argument, but I decided it was the wrong thread - this isn't.

    I still don't believe in a conspiracy, but the evidence is slowly mounting. There is no doubt that the UK govt. is hiding something, but until a whistleblower comes forward there can be no real evidence. The lack of a whistleblower, as I have said before, is (inconclusive) evidence that the conspiracy idea is wrong.

    However, it is easy to give detail to proposed conspiracies. There are numerous scenarios that might be true, and little evidence to prove or disprove any. One possibility that has been raised many times is that this is an escaped virus from a bioweapons program. If this is true, my guess is that it was either an accidental development that then escaped, or something they thought was innocuous and tested it on an unsuspecting public, but it then got out of control. Does anyone know what year the US or UK governments agreed to ban biological weapons development?

    An even more whacked out theory (just to show you how far this can go, and again this is without a shred of evidence and relies on fear and suspicion) is that it is all about population control. The biggest threat to international security is rampant population growth. Maybe they saw a natural virus, and decided they wanted it spread around the world. After enough people were infected, they will release a treatment that is very expensive. The third world will not be able to afford it and so while those in the West will finally be treated, much of the worlds population will be on its road to eradication. I really don't believe this theory for one important reason: this will collapse the world econdomy. It would only be tried if some government had the hubris to believe it could control the virus and that it could survive (or even thrive if it sells the "cure") the economic woes. Of course, if they thought they could and then changed their mind, then it was too late - you can't get this genie back into the bottle.

    Conspiracy theoreis are easy to cook up. Evidence, or better yet proof, is hard to find. There is little doubt that the UK government is hiding something. I think we should be pushing to have a panel of experts with impeccable integrity review the evidence (with full clearance) and then report that there is nothing to hide - or that indeed there is a real problem, if that is the case. As a result, such a panel would have to be international and beyond the reach of any one (or two) governments.

    As for the personalities of the psychosomatic disciples refered to, it would be very hard to prove any of it. However, I would like to add that certain personality types are likely to be drawn to certain positions, and the authoritarian aspect seems to be important to these people.

    bye
    Alex
     
  7. Tammie

    Tammie Senior Member

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    I posted on a different thread not too long ago that touched on this topic......have to get offline now so I can't find it, but will try to do so soon......to just say a little more now, though, I am normally not at all into conspiracy theories, but in this case, I simply cannot believe that it is all about money or egos or whatever.....there has to be something else going on/being covered up
     
  8. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    It's ALWAYS as far as i, know been split. They have always said at CDC site that ME and CFS were different illnesses. There are two other pages other than the one i saw recently which point to them being separate or come out and clearly say it, which have been about for years (umm not sure they are still there now but they were last i looked). So this split isnt a sudden right now thing. Only thing different is that those who were too tired and sick to see it, are now noticing it.

    A whole confusion thing or something to mislead the public.. i do strongly believe has been done on purpose (why else would the CDC not have information on a serious neurological disease such as ME?). One can only think conspiracy due to that. (Has anyone got an answer from the CDC why they dont have info at their site on ME?).

    So yeah... in my mind .. ME IS purposely trying to be covered up, the evidence of this is clearly there for all to see.. The big question is Why try to hide ME?????

    This illness HAS been around for a LONG TIME.. There was appparently an outbreak of it with 600 affected, not far from where i live back in the 1950s. There has been MANY outbreaks of it before the 1980s. (so is government somehow responsible for it???? it appears to be an illness which has always been around).

    Alex.. the population control theory makes no sense at all for me. Why would a government want to use an illness which causes mostly disability and hence high health care costs... rather than more cleanly kills. it would make more sense to use an illness such as AIDS as population control.. where ones can still work till they are close to the end.
     
  9. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    just finished round up ready corn and organic potatos

    What is most disturbing to me is what the mechanics that allow this kind of cover up to happen, and perpetuate for so many years without somebody whistleblowing or putting a stop to this. So is it the CDC, and other powerful government agencies(outside of the normal voting process) running the world when it comes to the health? Or is it coorporations(health insurers), that pull strings inside the CDC?

    And, why they would want to let this disease ravage the world without coming up with some treament or vaccine for all these years? That is really horrific. not to develope treatments and cures and allow millions to suffer for 25 years or more.

    Crazy stuff.

    I'm not going to drive myself crazy about it, and just watch for awhile and see what comes out. This is going to be interesting.
     
  10. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    HI taniaust1,

    The population control theory, while I agree is almost certainly not true, is plausible because it would involve the chance detection of a previously unknown virus. Thus it can spread without detection, as long as they can keep the virus unknown. They would then reduce costs to the West by denying its physical basis (psychosomatic), and preventing us from getting benefits as much as possible (we're not really sick, just think we are). As for treatments, first recommend no tests (e.g. in the UK) and then recommend only treatments which don't work, so that most patients wont even ask for them (CBT/GET). This would reduce costs. The broader economic issues are why I think it doesn't fly, as the more the virus spreads the more productivity will decline, and no country can afford that. It would take a villain right out of a Bond movie to think that this scenario could achieve its goals, I doubt it would ever happen in the real world. The reason I mentioned the theory is that it is possbile to come up with a very large number of theories, each more bizzare then the preceding theory. This is to highlight the need for real evidence. I also want to reiterate that we really need some untouchable independent review of the UK coverup, with full access to all documents.

    Bye
    Alex
     
  11. muffin

    muffin Senior Member

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    Not An X-Files Fan

    Many years ago when I was first terribly sick and the Internet was still pretty new, I fell upon several conspiracy theories on CFIDS. Because I was just too sick to bother with that sort of thing and was looking for help on vitamins, minerals, doctors, etc. I just dismissed the conspiracy stuff as out-there crazy. I figured that the government could not get away with a huge, long conspiracy because, 1) people are not always the brightest in the government and mess up, 2) People open their mouths and leak stuff, 3) This sort of conspiracy was just too huge and involved too many organizations and people and that could not work, and 4) NOT MY Government!.

    But after reading Osler's Web, watching for 16 years the game-playing done by the CDC and the UK governments, and then the rest of the "I can't believe they said/did that" stuff, I really could only conclude that someone(s) for whatever reason(s) are trying to hide something(s). What, I really don't know.

    I don't talk about conspiracy theories and biological warfare, etc. in public because that would make us CFIDS/ME sick look crazy and we just don't need that. And I don't know if it is biological warfare or a lab experiment that got out - could be some other situation that none of us have thought of yet. But you have to admit, when you write up all the actions and words by the CDC and the UK shrinks you can but only conclude that something really is amiss and they really can not believe this is purely psychological and dismiss us rather crudely. Even those with the mental disorders get better funding and more respect for their disease(s), so how come not us IF they really do believe we have a personality/mental disorder?

    Put all the pieces together that we know about and something very wrong emerges. Really, that's what I was trying to say.

    What I can't explain is if this disease does go back over 100 years (more or less) why then would the CDC and UK governments be doing all of these things to us? I can't answer that one as it falls out of the "THEY are up to no good" theory.

    I put the info on sociopath personalities in there to show what type of person would be capable of doing harm to others without any guilt, remorse, sympathy, empathy, etc. And, it was a shot at Reeves and Weasel and their followers. They tagged us with horrible, demeaning and insulting personality disorders, well, I tossed that ball back into their court - except that I do believe that Reeves, Weasel and their followers are true sociopaths.

    Note to Reeves, the Weasel and followers: Don't like what I put out into public? Come get me! I want that public attention. But of course they do know that as well.

    Anyway, as I have stated too many times, I spent many years in college/grad school getting degrees in government-related areas and then killed myself supporting the Federal government as a contractor (and paying off all those loans and credit cards for that education). It's really not easy for me to turn on my own government (or part of my government) and blame them for something so terrible. I'm too obnoxiously American and really do believe that my government is the best in the world (far and away from perfect, but the best). But put the pieces that we know about together and what picture do you see? One that I don't care for but also one I can not explain away.
     
  12. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    what can we do about it?
     
  13. muffin

    muffin Senior Member

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    What can we do about it?

    Darn good question. All I can think of is to scream, carry on, email, and keep hammering the media.
    And we wait for those FDA and NIH studies to come out and "prove" yet again, that XMRV really exists and that the other arms of the US Federal health orgs did find it even if the CDC did not find it. Maybe those positive studies will help us. Maybe those studies will hit the media and get out into the public and terrify the public that there is a very deadly and highly contagious Retrovirus out there and it has been covered up for 30 years by the CDC. PRAY this happens. We need this info OUT into the public so that the public starts screaming and demanding something be done.

    Ideas on better advocacy for us are welcomed. We must fight for ourselves. Ideas?
     
  14. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    hi Muffin, when you say this was known about nearly 30 yrs ago, what are you refering too?
     
  15. twopenneth

    twopenneth

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    Maybe chemtrailing experiments on humans is the reason people are ill with theses neurological diseases. The report also reveals details of the DICE trials in south Dorset between 1971 and 1975. These involved US and UK military scientists spraying into the air massive quantities of serratia marcescens bacteria, with an anthrax simulant and phenol.

    Similar bacteria were released in 'The Sabotage Trials' between 1952 and 1964. These were tests to determine the vulnerability of large government buildings and public transport to attack. In 1956 bacteria were released on the London Underground at lunchtime along the Northern Line between Colliers Wood and Tooting Broadway. The results show that the organism dispersed about 10 miles. Similar tests were conducted in tunnels running under government buildings in Whitehall.

    Cough Splutter Choke: This is that special relationship that the UK Health leaders and the CDC in the USA have.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2002/apr/21/uk.medicalscience. What was the published outcome of these experiments! Is this even legal? Maybe someone can find out!


    http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&rlz=... baker independent&spell=1&fp=b880e0c34638eae


    I suspect this thread intro very much sums up the problems. I'd go further and say that many top health CEOs are psychopaths.
     
  16. twopenneth

    twopenneth

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  17. Sandman

    Sandman

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    Here's what baffles me. There are approximately 15,000 people that work at the CDC. Take whatever infection rate of M.E. you wish to use. I used a slightly higher 2.54% that I read somewhere. That comes out to about 381 persons infected with M.E. at the CDC. If you use the 10% rate of severely infected/affected people that I have seen quoted many times that still equates to 38 or so severely sick people at the CDC. Would none of these 38 people come forth or try to get some kind of surpressed information out to the public? I guess if none of these hypothetical 38 were in positions of true power it would be possible to sweep them under the carpet. But I have to believe in my heart that there is at least one person at the CDC who has tried to fight this bizarre coverup! It is so obvious that it is a mass coverup! I work in healthcare and over the past 10-15 years I have had a few Docs tell me behind closed doors that something very rotten with this mass illness is going on. I just think most Docs are up to their ears in alligators with the health care situation and don't have much time to investigate what's really going on here. I certainly hope someone breaks this ring of silence very soon!
     
  18. Daisymay

    Daisymay Senior Member

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    Well Muffin, I thing your assessment is spot on.

    Sandman, that is an interesting point, it may never have crossed the minds of these CDC people that they too could be infected.

    And I agree I find it strange the way that this whole thing has been contained, the way that so many medics in the US and UK have gone along with this whole thing when there is SO much biomedical evidence which these people are well aware of, how can they live with themselves, must be a lot more sociopaths around than you'd think!

    The 3-7% of people at the CDC who may be XMRV positive will be blissfully unaware of it, just like everyone else in the general population who are infected. And anyway many of these CDC people will be unaware of what has been going on with CDC CFS research and may well believe the CDC findings, it's hard to know how many of people at the CDC are sociopathic types who are in on all of this and how many are kosher researchers.
     
  19. V99

    V99

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    As a CDC employee, if you suddenly said that you had CFS you can imaging the reaction. FIrst off they would poke fun at you, look at you strangely, next you would be moved to an insignificant department, unless you were already in one, they may even attempt to wear you down. Eventually you would leave. I bet there are quiet a few people there who's family members have CFS. They will either not believe in it, or they would keep it quiet. Careers are probably damaged through association.

    I think the containment is of the investigation, not necessarily the cause. Stop things before they begin and you can keep it quiet for years.
     
  20. Galena1

    Galena1

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    Apologies for being obtuse but......precisely what/which document is beng buried?
     

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