1. Patients launch $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
First Direct Evidence of Neuroinflammation - 'Encephalitis' - in ME/CFS
A small study with just nine patients has captured the attention of patients and researchers alike after reporting direct evidence of inflammation in the brain of ME/CFS patients. The finding was one of the highlights picked out by Professor Anthony Komaroff in his IACFS/ME...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

L-Carnitine Fumarate

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Branston, Feb 27, 2013.

  1. Branston

    Branston

    Messages:
    54
    Likes:
    4
    Montreal, Canada
    I keep seeing this being mentioned, but I can't find out where it fits into the Methylation Cycle and why it might be important to supplement. I have no idea whether I need this or not.
    Could someone please explain.
  2. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    It fits into the Krebs cycle (for making ATP), not the methylation cycle. Both cycles are important. Some of the more biochemical literate on the board can probably tell you more.
  3. Branston

    Branston

    Messages:
    54
    Likes:
    4
    Montreal, Canada
    Ok, thanks....t hat might be really significant for me. I have Chronic Chlamydia Pneumonia infection. CPn is an intracellular infection and cannot make it's own ATP. It steals the ATP from the cells it infects.
    Any advice re brand and dose of L-Carnitine Fumarate?
  4. arx

    arx Senior Member

    Messages:
    525
    Likes:
    134
    Hi,
    I was following Fred's protocol some months back.
    In living cells, it is required for the transport of fatty acids from the cytosol into the mitochondria during the breakdown of lipids (fats) for the generation of metabolic energy. It helps in producing ATP. It is a part of the krebs cycle and I remember about the dosage, people like me who were very sensitive to it had to start with a tiny crumb and titrate slowly. Personally, I had a lot of reaction to Acetyl L Carnitine,and I couldn't continue it. Fred takes/took/recommended the L-Carnitine Fumarate by Doctor's Best. I think Doctor's Best is the best brand when choosing carnitine. It was quite powerful for me to handle, which in a way makes it the best product around.
  5. caledonia

    caledonia

    Messages:
    2,792
    Likes:
    1,380
    Cincinnati, OH, USA
    I'm taking one of the Doctor's Best l-carnitine fumarate per day (855mg). It's given me a nice little boost in energy. Enough to be able to keep up with the dishes consistently over the past few months about 3-4 days a week, whereas previously, I could only do dishes every great once in a while.

    I believe Heartfixer suggests 1-2 per day, but one is what muscle tested strong for me, so that's what I'm sticking with.
    beaker likes this.
  6. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,539
    Likes:
    882
    Salt Lake City
    Hi Caladonia,

    I'd like to mention that there is an approximately 36 hour serum level cycle form each dose. Once a day might not maintain serum level steadily enough. Dividing the same daily dose into 2 might proviode a superior effect, especially towards the end of 24 hours. In a micro titration sometimes 3 times a day provides a much better result.
    Gloria H likes this.
  7. Jorlev

    Jorlev

    Messages:
    66
    Likes:
    18
    Just got back Carnitine Blood test:
    Carnitine Total 44 (42. - 81.0) umol / L
    Carnitine Free 31 (35-67) umol / L
    Carnitine Esters 13 (3.8 - 19.0 umol / L

    Don't know which of these is more relevant but I'm under in Free and Low in Total and Ester.
    Haven't gotten to Dr. yet with this result but started 1000mg of Acetyl-L-Carnitine (500 X 2).

    Any thoughts on my results or which brand is best (noticed Dr's Best mentioned).
    Also, any benefit in taking L-Carnitine in addition to Acetyl-L-Carnitine. I know ALC is the the active form.
    Read somewhere the ALC crosses BBB and L-Carnitine doesn't. Need in for Small Fiber Neuropathy more than
    brain neurons.
  8. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    I use Dr's Best as well. LCF is patented however, so I believe any brand should be ok.
  9. Branston

    Branston

    Messages:
    54
    Likes:
    4
    Montreal, Canada
    Thank you all..... I have ordered the Doctor's Best.
  10. Jorlev

    Jorlev

    Messages:
    66
    Likes:
    18
    Will probably go with Dr. Best as I've used that brand before and feel it is a quality co.
    Just curious if anyone knows the difference between HCL and Fumarate forms?
    Why is one better than the other?
    beaker likes this.
  11. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    I don't think you can have l-carnitine in pure HCL form, without a carrier. The available forms are either tartrate or fumarate. Fumarate is an intermediate of the Krebs cycle, so it makes sense to use that form. The acetylated form (ALCAR) is HCL and the difference is that this one penetrates the CNS.
  12. Jorlev

    Jorlev

    Messages:
    66
    Likes:
    18
    The brand I'm finishing up is Vitamin Shoppe Acetyl-L-Carnitine and on the back it says
    (as Acetyl-L-Carnitine HCl)
    Again, wondering if it's best to take a little of both types. I read that ALC is more active and as you said, does go into the CNS but I think it can also be used by the body when L-Carnitine along is needed. I have small fiber neuropathy and perhaps I don't need this going to my CNS as much as some with CFS. Just trying to determine if one, the other, or both might be best.
    beaker likes this.
  13. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    It's hard to say which form is the best. Some might need the CNS penetration, whereas others might not. Some people feel wired or depressed on ALCAR. It increases acetylcholine. Others might need the fumaric acid form to fuel their Krebs cycle. For neuropathy though, ALCAR is almost surely the best option. But there is no reason you can't combine the different forms, to get the best of both worlds.
  14. Jorlev

    Jorlev

    Messages:
    66
    Likes:
    18
    Why is ALCAR best for neuropathy? I also have MTHFR A1298C so my methylation may be compromised and that may indirectly affect Krebs. Yeah, a little of both couldn't hurt.
  15. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    ALCAR has shown some efficacy for neuropathy in clinical trials. Do a search on PubMed and you will find it.
  16. xjhuez

    xjhuez Senior Member

    Messages:
    170
    Likes:
    39
    Hmm. I tried ALCAR awhile back and had to stop because it made me anxious and irritable. Is there anyone here who successfully takes l-carnitine-fumarate who couldn't take ALCAR?
    beaker likes this.
  17. Jorlev

    Jorlev

    Messages:
    66
    Likes:
    18
    Also, can anyone recommend appropriate dosages for ALCAR and LCF.
  18. liquid sky

    liquid sky Senior Member

    Messages:
    350
    Likes:
    156
    Can someone explain the difference between L-Carnitine tartrate and L-Carnitine fumarate? I have been using the tartrate for energy production, but have not noticed any difference at all.
  19. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    I believe 500-1000mg should be enough for most. But some might need 2000mg.
  20. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,246
    Likes:
    1,349
    Tundras of Europa
    Like I said, fumaric acid is a component of the Krebs cycle. Tartrate isn't, and according to dbkita it might even mess with it, so it is something I would avoid.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page