Julie Rehmeyer's 'Through the Shadowlands'
Writer Never Give Up talks about Julie Rehmeyer's new book "Through the Shadowlands: A Science Writer's Odyssey into an Illness Science Doesn't Understand" and shares an interview with Julie ...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

L-carnitine & cellular thyroid metabolism: Any conclusions?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by picante, Oct 26, 2015.

  1. picante

    picante Senior Member

    Messages:
    756
    Likes:
    853
    Helena, MT USA
    I'm starting this thread because I got a tad annoyed. ;) Reading through threads on L-carnitine, I keep running across the statement that L-carnitine can keep thyroid hormones (T3, T4) from entering cells.

    Most of the time there is no documentation given (thus the annoyance). The documentation that I have seen linked is to studies done on hyperthyroidism:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15591013 (a randomized clinical trial on iatrogenic hyperthryoidism!)
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/11502782/ (a clinical trial that looked at symptoms of hyperthyroid patients)
    From the second link:
    I'm not at all sure this applies to those of us who are hypothyroid. My understanding is that hyperthyroidism causes urinary carnitine wasting, which would lead to deficiency, ┬┐no?

    I've just gone in circles trying to get a bearing on this:
    Here on PR we have hypothyroid people doing the deadlock quartet who say they have had improvement and had to lower their thyroid dosage. This makes sense: glutathione is needed for the conversion of T4 to T3 (http://metabolichealing.com/thyroid-solutions-glutathione-t4-t3-conversion/), and methylation protocols can increase glutathione levels.

    I'm not sure it works to look at L-carnitine in isolation, in other words.

    So I'm tracking my own responses to ALCar now, which is the form I've been taking lately. I'm recording my temperatures and my perception of fatigue. FYI, I'm taking a compounded T3/T4 sublingual for a combination of thyroid problems: low T4-to-T3 conversion and TPO antibodies.

    So far, I'm not seeing any discernible difference in my body temperatures in the 30-60 minutes after taking ALCar. However, I usually take AdoB12 within 30-60 minutes of the ALCar. Once I take the AdoB12, I am seeing a temperature increase. I've been recording them for 5 days, and getting between .2 and .6 degrees Fahrenheit increase in 20-30 minutes after taking AdoB12.

    I'm not seeing any particular pattern yet with fatigue. Fatigue seems to be more affected by eating, in my case.

    Those who have posted before on L-carnitine & hypothyroidism, have you found any more clues or research?: @Sea @ahmo @SOC @South @Gondwanaland @caledonia @Freddd
     
    South, helen1 and Gondwanaland like this.
  2. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,342
    Likes:
    1,175
    Ventura, CA
    From what I have read before on it, in the amounts of supplemented form it is negligible. Especially if you take it only once a day because of the short half life. Certain foods actually have just the same effect, and others boost thyroid hormone.
     
    picante likes this.
  3. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,076
    Likes:
    1,769
    Seattle
    @picante This has been driving me crazy as well.

    First of all, different docs have different views on how to determine thyroid status. My medicaid MD says my thyroid is fine, while the naturopath I saw said my thyroid had been slowing down dramatically over the last 10 years and prescribed Nature-Throid a few years ago. Stupid me, I never took it on a regular basis, and now the doc has moved back east.

    I used to take l-carnitine regularly up until about 7-8 years ago, and found it helped considerably. It lowers lactate and is necessary for PDH function, etc. Then I stopped when I read it could 'tank' one's choline levels. In hindsight this was no doubt a mistake, after all it came from a comment w/nothing to back it up, but I was going through a panicky time after starting on methylation supps, and was grasping at straws.

    Anyway, it seems like whenever I've tried it recently, I get really cold feet, which already have a tendency to be cold. On the other hand, sometimes my feet get icy cold and I haven't taken any carnitine.

    Then I came across this study, which seems to suggest a self-regulating mechanism is involved -- carnitine excretion is increased in hyperthyroid patients, but reduced in hypothyroid.

    Am I reading that correctly?
     
  4. picante

    picante Senior Member

    Messages:
    756
    Likes:
    853
    Helena, MT USA
    I think so. Of course, I had forgotten all about my post above, and so I'm glad you tagged me. I'm still hypothyroid -- in fact, more than ever, since I haven't been tolerating thyroid hormones of any kind. That, I found out, was because my cortisol plunged over a year ago.

    AFAIK, I've been hypothyroid for 25 years, since EBV meningitis triggered my onset of ME/CFS. And that whole time, my triglycerides have been around 90 -- pretty low, in other words. I don't know that supplemental thyroid ever lowered my triglycerides, as this study seems to say.

    Are your triglycerides low? I take it you aren't on any thyroid meds now?
     
  5. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,238
    Likes:
    3,103
    This is normal on a GF diet.
     
    picante likes this.
  6. picante

    picante Senior Member

    Messages:
    756
    Likes:
    853
    Helena, MT USA
    I wasn't avoiding wheat until later in that 25 years. But do you think 90 is a normal level? I don't know much abour triglycerides.
     
  7. picante

    picante Senior Member

    Messages:
    756
    Likes:
    853
    Helena, MT USA
    What is PDH?
     
  8. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

    Messages:
    4,238
    Likes:
    3,103
    The desirable level is between 50 - 90 :thumbsup:
     
    picante likes this.
  9. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,076
    Likes:
    1,769
    Seattle
    No, they're high, and have been gradually moving higher for about 4-5 years. I had no idea of the thyroid connection until I saw this study. And am not on any thyroid meds right now. I have read as you have that there's a balance between it and the adrenals, so plan on taking some adrenal extract at the same time. Vitacost has one that actually helps me w/the 'wired but tired' thing.
     
  10. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,076
    Likes:
    1,769
    Seattle
    It stands for the pyruvate dehydrogenase complex, which has been mentioned in at least one or two of the recent studies. Carnitine is just one of many 'ingredients' that goes into helping it function normally/correctly.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyruvate_dehydrogenase_complex
     
    picante likes this.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page