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KPU & Mercury and other Heavy Metal Chelation

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Sushi, Jan 13, 2010.

  1. danny

    danny

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    Hi all, I'm new, just found this thread via google. More on my story later, I think I have HPU/Pyroluria

    Interesting hunch you have, and it could be related to zinc which is why the KPU protocol might help.

    Take a look at theses
    http://www.drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/Hyperventilation
    http://www.drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/Carbonic_anhydrase_studies_in_red_blood_cells

    Bascially, Dr Myhill says many CFS patients (me included) get the sensation they are not getting enough oxygen to their body.

    "Many patients, particularly asthma patients, but also CFS patients, have a sensation that they are not getting enough oxygen to their tissues. Their response to this is to breathe more deeply. However blood cannot become more than 100% saturated with oxygen. All that happens is that more carbon dioxide is washed out of the blood. This makes oxygen cling more fiercely to haemoglobin in red blood cells and therefore oxygen delivery to the tissues is made worse!"

    Heres why the yoga might help:

    "For those patients who do not have a chronic fatigue syndrome, physical exercise is extremely helpful. Take up some sort of physical activity, such as running, swimming or cycling on a daily basis to reduce your hyperventilation"

    And now onto the zinc part:

    "Hyperventilation is a difficult diagnosis to make clinically and that is why having an objective test of hyperventilation is so useful. People who hyperventilate deplete their levels of red cell carbonic anhydrase and the ratio between the activity and the protein gives us a good indication of whether or not hyperventilation is a problem.
    Hyperventilation is also difficult to treat and so this test tells us how much effort we have to put in to correcting this. Essentially, there is a two-pronged approach - firstly biochemical and secondly physical:
    Biochemically, red cell carbonic anhydrase is a zinc dependent enzyme and will be depleted simply by zinc deficiency. "

    Regards,
    Daniel
  2. sela

    sela Senior Member

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    marin co, ca
    could there be any relation between what you are talking about and breathlessness? i am doing the kpu protocol and among other things i am getting breathless.
  3. slayadragon

    slayadragon Senior Member

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    twitpic.com/photos/SlayaDragon
    I failed that test that Myhill describes, so apparently I have the hyperventilating problem.

    I know that I have KPU. I was tested by Pfeiffer a long time ago, and I got a big detox reaction when I started taking high-dose zinc.

    Apart from making an effort to breathe less (which sounds just dumb) and taking more zinc (which I'm doing), I wonder how to address this problem.

    Thanks, Lisa
  4. richvank

    richvank Senior Member

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    Hi, Lisa.

    In my opinion, one reason the carbonic anhydrase activity can be low in CFS, while the concentration of this enzyme is normal, other than zinc deficiency, is that less carbon dioxide is being produced because of the mito dysfunction. I don't believe that the hyperventilation explanation fits in most cases of CFS. In four published studies, low carbon dioxide partial pressure in the exhaled gas was found in CFS (called hypocapnia), and the standard medical explanation for this is hyperventilation. However, this assumes that there is a normal rate of production of CO2 by the mitos, which is not true when the mitos are dysfunctional, as in CFS. In the only published study in which ventilation was actually measured in CFS, it was found to be normal. Many PWCs report that they have to remind themselves to breathe, i.e. that they have hypoventilation rather than hyperventilation. This makes sense in terms of low CO2 production, because the respiratory center in the brainstem governs the rate and depth of breathing in order to keep the CO2 concentration in the normal range. If it doesn't sense enough CO2, it will shallow and slow the breathing.

    It's true that zinc is needed for carbonic anhydrase, and this can be a cause of low activity of this enzyme. It's also true that carbonic anhydrase is important to the production of stomach acid. So I think that zinc deficiency can be a cause of the low stomach acid production found in many or most cases of CFS. Other indicators of low zinc are low alkaline phosphatase on a standard blood metabolic panel, and white spots on the fingernails.

    Best regards,

    Rich
  5. slayadragon

    slayadragon Senior Member

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    twitpic.com/photos/SlayaDragon
    This is really helpful info, Rich.

    This little foray into civilization as the weather has gotten bad indeed has wiped out my mitochondria. Very disappointing and back to better air for the winter again.

    When I am in a bad place, my body pretty much categorically refuses to draw in any more breath than absolutely necessary to sustain life. I always have thought that this was a defense mechanism against breathing in any more toxin than I had to, but maybe this is my being fanciful.

    I will try the exercise again when I get to a better location to see if I test the same.

    I get such a big detox reaction from taking zinc that I tend to believe that I'm low in zinc. But that doesn't mean that it's responsible for my results on this test.

    Thanks much for your comments.

    Best, Lisa
  6. kday

    kday Senior Member

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    I had to use ultra-high dose B12 shots with methylation protocol to feel benefits. It works well for me, and makes me detox a lot, but it's no cure.

    I tested positive for pyroluria and I am going to start treatment soon. Sorry if this has already been covered in this thread, but can you continue methylation supplements (or atleast B12 shots) while doing KPU treatment?

    Do you think it takes higher doses of supplements to push methylation detox for those with pyroluria?

    I'll keep the thread updated with my journey and progress. I have chronic Lyme and CFIDS.

    Excuse me if some or all of these questions were already answered. I can't read 9 pages of posts at the moment.
  7. karynwolfe

    karynwolfe

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    Pardon me if this has been discussed in this thread before, but... How does one go about getting tested for heavy metal toxicity? Do I just go to my doctor and ask for some type of panel, or will she have to refer me to a specialist who will know more about it?

    Thank you
  8. ariel

    ariel

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    I'm about to start a metal detox as I'm finally strong enough.
    I was reading about Diatomaceous Earth Earth. Has anyone here heard of it? It sounds like it could be similar to this 'microsilica' ?? that I read people on here were trying out. Food grade DE is super cheap. Full of silica, kills any parasites, and is able to detox metals from the gut.


    Edited to add:
    Oops. ignore this. just found some info on all this on another thread.
  9. sela

    sela Senior Member

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    marin co, ca
    kday, are you still doing kpu? interested in how you are doing and if you found a solution.
  10. nanciswell

    nanciswell

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    I did not read the whole thread.. so excuse if this has already been discussed here. I am adding on that I find with taking the supplements suggested for pyroluria protocal lead my body to dump oxalates. Oxalates can build up in our body to cause a miriad of problems. As one lowers the amount , dumping can occur where oxalates in storage come out and cause a temporary worsening of symptoms.

    I started taking biotin two months ago and was feeling very well.. with my fatigue of 35 years seemingly gone. I had been taking 15 mg daily for around 6 months and it was not until I upped the dose to 40mg that the fatigue went away. After about two weeks I had a couple of days where I felt worse taking the biotin. It gave me all the symptoms of candida. I was worried I had gotten sensitive to the biotin. I waited two days before retrying and have since been on it again at high doses for the past month with no problems.

    This same thing happened when I started to take p5p. I had started to get fatigue again after 7 weeks of having no fatigue as long as I took the high doses of biotin.. and thought of pyroluria..So I added in p5p { the regular form of b6 made me ill maybe due to my being a super responder to foods and chemicals. } I got immediate energy from the p5p. On certain occasions I will have what again appears to have been an oxalate dump with a sudden increase in candida . Taking more biotin can help get me over this quickly.. Other people who are watching their oxalate levels also find taking biotin and/or p5p can lead to these dumps .

    nanci
  11. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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    nanci, how do you know you're dumping oxolates and not other toxins, metals.. since HPU is supposed to help with detox in general?
  12. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Kday,

    As a response to b12 it is more likely low potassium level, often mistaken for "detox". Also there are often other rapidly induced deficiencies unless you are taking the whole load of basics and essentials at least.
  13. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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    Rich

    A propos of yr comments on zinc: any idea why a person would be low on alk phos on a standard blood panel, but have high zinc on a UTM/UEE ...urine test from Doctor's Data?

    On the DDI test, zinc was in the 97th percentile.
    Test done in the past couple of weeks.

    here are a couple of readings for alk phos:
    38 (42-141) 8/25/10
    50 (35-115) 2/22/11

    Thanks
  14. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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    So, my sketchy impression is that there is some overlap here between KPU & oxolates. The oxolate folks talk about taking B6, and biotin as well. I respond well to both.
    I have just run an OAT, but it's mostly greek to me....I can't tell if it points to oxolates or KPU.
    So now, I wonder which condition I'm dealing with.
    ETA: I do have calcium oxolate crystals in my urine ....so I guess that's a clue.
    can't believe i may have to adapt to a gf, cf, sf, low histamine, low-oxolate diet...Seriously?
  15. richvank

    richvank Senior Member

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    Hi, Aquarius.

    My guess is that zinc is being excreted bigtime in the urine, so that the blood and the cells are low in it. HPU could do that, because it binds to zinc and carries it out. A blood test for zinc would tell whether it is low in the blood.

    Best regards,

    Rich
  16. taroki

    taroki Senior Member

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    Ontario, Canada
    bump ....

    I was wondering where I can purchase KPU minerals (do I need the other supplement also? forgot the name) and do they ship to Canada? I am pretty certain I have kryptopyrroluria which is causing my pyroluria symptoms and low testosterone issue. And supplementing with Zinc and B6 makes me feel better. Currently taking Precision ZMA but would like to fix the underlying cause of the issue (and I am still low in testosterone). I have MTHFR mutations, mercury, and most likely Lyme.

    Is it this product?
    http://retailbiopure.me/CORE-240-Capsules.html
  17. Violeta

    Violeta Senior Member

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    KPU sure sounds similar to porphyria. I will look more into it myself, but does it cause porphyrin buildup? In porphyria, that causes pain. I wonder if it is triggered by the same things.

    With respect to Rich VanK's post about low CO2 being low because of mito problems, I would like to post some possible tie ins.

    One huge trigger for porphyria is stress, I don't know about with KPU. I've found, though that the stress is rather a chronic thing.

    Stress, and adrenal hormones causing metabolic syndrome
    http://www.functionalps.com/blog/2012/07/16/aldosterone-sodium-deficiency-and-insulin-resistance/
    Glucose restriction to inside the cells reduces production of CO2.

    Glucose is just a bunch of carbon, oxygen, and hydrogen atoms.

    http://www.elmhurst.edu/~chm/vchembook/543glucose.html
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2013

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