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9th Invest in ME International ME Conference, 2014 - Part 2: Pathogens and the Gut
Mark Berry continues his series of articles on the 9th Invest in ME International ME Conference in London, with the emphasis shifting from autoimmunity to pathogens and the gut ...
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It's all in the Gut. Why we get ME/CFS

Discussion in 'The Gut: De Meirleir & Maes; H2S; Leaky Gut' started by redo, Mar 26, 2011.

  1. Adlyfrost

    Adlyfrost

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    Sparrowhawk : Regarding supplements: Magnesium Stearate is not Magnesium at all and it is in almost every supplement. It can cause binding and autoimmune problems in the gut. Also, some supplements that claim to harbor no allergens have potato starch and rice bran or rice flour. Many of the amino acids used in chelates are from grains or soy. I was having a racing, thumping heart beat after taking a mineral only to discover it was chelated from rice.

    Recently I stopped all my supplements and while on a broth mini fast I added them back slowly to see which are the problems. Really helped. Bottomline: the least pills the better. I am going to be looking for mostly bulks and powders and fresh oils from now on. Really stinks since I have invested a small fortune in my pill form supplements. :-(
    Sparrowhawk likes this.
  2. globalpilot

    globalpilot Senior Member

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    I didn't see this before.
    Severe upper fermentation is what it sounds like - a lot of fermentation happening in the upper gut. That I didn't have to be tested for. I know I have it because of the massive amount of burping.
  3. Adlyfrost

    Adlyfrost

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    ThatBloke: Unfortunately addressing gut the alone will likely not cure CFS because of all the complications having a compromised gut causes. Not that I am disagreeing with your instinct that the gut is not the root cause of your CFS. But it is definately part of the cycle for many people and a good place to start.

    But I take your point. For example, when I am at my sickest, the gut stuff does nothing. The only thing that helps are immune-modulators. At that point I have no appetite and it is all I can do to eat an apple or a smoothie (if someone makes it for me) or some broth. And eating light for months and months like that DIDN'T get me better. Not with viral and parasitic infections. (Eating poorly did make me worse though.) Only astralagus, Equilibrant, Kutaja- (and I could have done with some good antivirals if I had had a good doctor too)- got me better. When I have just the plain old 'pain in the but' CFS- (exhaustion, PEM, mild viral symptoms, in bed alot but ambulatory,etc.), not only addressing the gut but hormones and metabolism through nutrition is essential. I have gotten to a medium functioning person this way. And I think if I went all the way with this- the bad stuff would never come back. Working on it. Keep you posted.
    Wayne and Sparrowhawk like this.
  4. Daffodil

    Daffodil Senior Member

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    not doing too well ....on antibiotics and vsl-3....constant diarrhea and now sebhorreic dermatitis on the face.
  5. Sparrowhawk

    Sparrowhawk Senior Member

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  6. Nielk

    Nielk

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    Sorry Daffodil. Could it be an allergic reaction?
  7. Daffodil

    Daffodil Senior Member

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    hi neilk. i dont know. i left a message for my doc and am waiting for response. i have read many forums where people say they got diarrhea from VSL-3 so they stopped taking it...but maybe it is temporary during die-off? no idea. 2 of the antibiotics i am on also have diarrhea as a side effect but probiotics are supposed to help with that...so not sure what it all means.

    certainly the sebhorrea is interesting....its an autoimmune reaction often linked to the gut.

    xox
    Nielk likes this.
  8. Nielk

    Nielk

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    I hope you get it resolved soon.:)
  9. Daffodil

    Daffodil Senior Member

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  10. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    for what its worth, sacchromyce bouldarri can help with diarrhoea as well as gut flora. Might be worth looking into?

    cheers!!
  11. Sparrowhawk

    Sparrowhawk Senior Member

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    Is sacchromyce bouldarri something you have used with success?

    On edit, this was pretty informative on the topic: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3296087/
  12. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    Yes i use sacchromyce bouldarri and was advised by my doc about this supp, its a non pathogenic yeast which can help with gut flora and i use it especially when on antibitocs which i have been off and on for awhile now which i think has helped me avoid candida etc. If i do ever get a gastro bug i just up the dose some for awhile, seems to work for me.
  13. Sparrowhawk

    Sparrowhawk Senior Member

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    Thanks, heapsreal, that's a good enough endorsement for me!
  14. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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  15. Sparrowhawk

    Sparrowhawk Senior Member

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    Thanks again, was just looking at that on amazon. So you take them on an empty stomach? How separated from meals?
  16. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    I just take them with my other supps just before breakfast and dinner.
    Sparrowhawk likes this.
  17. Elph68

    Elph68 Senior Member

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    Hey Sparrowhawk ... just throw my 2 cents in .... Enterococcus, streptococcus and prevotella are the most consistently overgrown bacteria in the gut of CFS patients (University of Melbourne) commercial probiotics have lost the ability to connect with epithillial cells and therefore are only transient and also contain sugars as binding agents which feed the bugs I just mentioned. Enterococcus, Strep and lactobacillus are proliffic H2S and lactic acid produces and produce an environment which reduces the good bacteria .... Enterococcus and streptococcus produce enzymes and toxins such as gelatinase, streptolysin, cytolysin, mytolysin, and hylaundranise which damage and destroy epithelial cells causing inflammation (in all the mucous membranes ... how many people started with a sore throat?) and sends the immune system into overdrive ....

    Stop the cause of the inflammation, stop the disease .... www.superbugskill.com
    globalpilot and aimossy like this.
  18. aimossy

    aimossy Senior Member

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    I had the sore throat thing elph68 at the beginning.
    recently made a mess of my gut very bad on probiotics and got the sore throat back. may have been the lactic acid thing I discovered about on here.:)
  19. Elph68

    Elph68 Senior Member

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    Hey Aimossy .... most likely viridans strep was the cause of your sore throat .... pathogenic normal flora .... can develop into cervical gland lymphodynia .... (swollen neck glands) .... I bet all your throat swabs are/were normal ....
    aimossy likes this.
  20. aimossy

    aimossy Senior Member

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    yeah Elph68 , im looking forward to all the gut bacteria research publications one day!

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