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Is twisting the wrists while sleeping some kind of symptom?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Gondwanaland, Feb 28, 2015.

  1. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    DH and I have benn sleeping on our wrists, literally.

    I know that sleeping with the arms stretched out above the head means arsenic toxicity (I already knew it from reading homeopathic materia medica, Cutler's books and later witnessed a real life case).

    So I have been wondering if when someone starts twisting the wrists during sleep to the point of waking up in pain from having too much weight on the wrists, and pain in the hands as well, could be from some detox or a new toxicity event.

    A quick search brought up antimony related with arthritic pain in the hands.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2015
  2. garyfritz

    garyfritz Senior Member

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    I can't say if it's a symptom of something. But in my 20s and 30s I used to sleep with my wrists curled in towards my body, and I ended up with a lot of carpal-tunnel-type pain in my wrists. I trained myself not to sleep that way any more, and I haven't slept like that in decades. So it might be a symptom of something, or it might be a habit you can change.
     
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  3. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    It just saterted suddenly for DH and I at the same time, and I will find out what it is causing it :cautious:
     
  4. garyfritz

    garyfritz Senior Member

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    Hm. Starting suddenly doesn't sound like a habit. Starting at the same time for both of you is highly suspicious -- I'd have to agree it does sound like some kind of environmental trigger. I wouldn't expect it to be a detox symptom unless both of you entered into detox at the same time for some reason.
     
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  5. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I have been giving him some of my supps :rolleyes:
    But I didn't add new supps lately. I am looking into environmental triggers :thumbsup:
     
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  6. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    I have long slept with my wrists tucked in, like @garyfritz said. But it was never a real problem until my small joints (fingers, wrists, feet, ankles) have been under attack the last 2 years (got sick 6 years ago), probably from mast cells as near as I can figure. The very first symptom of this new stage was when my feet hurt when walking down the stairs in the morning. I probably have always had a Connective Tissue Disorder.

    I sometimes use a splint-style wrist brace when sleeping, and sometimes that paradoxically makes it worse. I always use that brace on my bad right wrist anymore when at the computer, it always helps then.
     
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  7. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    This is different, while sleeping on the side we are partially supporting the body's weight on one wrist with either the hand palm or back (more painful) against the mattress. Really strange :confused:.
     
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  8. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    Hmmm, I recently opened new bottles of supplements, will have to investigate that.
     
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  9. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    Suspect #1: the new bottle of fish oil.

    DH and I skipped it yesterday and didn't curled our wrists this past night. The pain is still there though :ill:
     
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  10. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    Well, you have one subject for the control group and one for the experimental group :)
     
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  11. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    :lol::thumbsup:
     
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  12. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    The silymarin is the culprit. Two different types (capsules and drops) have the same effect on DH and me.
     
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  13. aaron_c

    aaron_c Senior Member

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    @Gondwanaland

    Do you have ideas about why the silymarin does this?
     
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  14. Critterina

    Critterina Senior Member

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    We curl in like @garyfritz. My doctor said it was genetic, neurological, and is often associated with night terrors. Both my mom and I have slept this way all our lives. I even put one curled up wrist under the other and push them up against my chin for more torque. Go figure. This was way before any supplements or the illness that brought me here.
     
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  15. Critterina

    Critterina Senior Member

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    Hi @Gondwanaland,

    Like so many times, I'm intrigued by the side comments people make. I also, when not curling my wrists, sleep with at least one shoulder folded up, head on front lower head of tricep, in a way that many people can't even contort themselves to. I've tested for arsenic and none shows (serum, urine). How did you confirm the connection? I thought I closed that As toxicity possibility, and attributed it to the COL5A mutations, but maybe I'm wrong.
     
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  16. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    Silymarin interacts with iron, reduces iron levels, I don't know if it will increase or reduce iron circulation, and this causes the hand curling.
    I am no doctor, but I think those symptoms are from mineral imbalances. Just a few days ago I read that magnesium is the missing mineral in night terrors (sorry I forget where I read that).
    I couldn't picture the description, but it doesn't match As. I recommend some reading of homeopathic materia medica to find out more about your specific position - I suggest to google for "homeopathy sleep position" and something more descriptive of your position.

    I have a long story about how I confirmed the As sleeping position...

    The 1st time I read it was on Cutler's books, and he certainly researched thru homeopathic materia medica.

    Then a friend of mine told me she always sleeps with the arms above her head, and she does have a lot of other As behavioral symptoms (poor judgement, hurting herself).

    Last year after taking methylfolate I slept like that for a couple of months during winter. More recently I read or watched a video of Ben Lynch stating that As is the 1st metal detoxed by Mfolate.

    Also last year my parents' neighbors put a swimmingpool in the yard with a wooden deck. I had just read in Cutler's book that one source of As is wood treated with arsenic. So I told my parents they had to change the place of their vegetable garden because the earth would be contamined by the neighbor's wooden deck. Another neighbour who is agronomist confirmed what I said.

    Now it gets interesting and sinister:
    The owner of the swimmingpool was pregnant and after the baby was born she had undiagnosed adrenal fatigue/postpartum depression. She could never get up in the morning, and my mother would never see her outdoors with the baby.

    Then one day she told my mother she had seen a doctor because she was waking up with numb arms, and was doing tests for blood coagulation. Just one thing she never asked herself was why all of a sudden she was sleeping with her arms above her head... And the husband came and showed a picture of the baby on his cell phone: "look at the baby girl, she sleeps with the arms above her head just like her mom!" So one could wrongly say it is genetic to sleep with the arms above the head just like your dr. said, Crit.

    At this time the baby was less than 1 month old, and my parents were building a big wall to replace the wire fence close to the wooden deck, and my parents told them the wall was because of the poison of their deck. They weren't impressed. Now guess what is the profession of the woman... she is a chemist, and is not afraid of chemicals...

    Then the agronomist came by to visit my mother, and we told her about the neighbor's and the baby's symptoms, and she confirmed that those were As symptoms.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2015
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  17. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    wow. I sure hope the neighbor gets the message. really horrifying story. but, as usual, excellent sleuthing.:nerd:
     
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  18. Critterina

    Critterina Senior Member

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    Well, I don't know what to make of this. I don't know how you confirm As without testing it. Saying someone confirmed it doesn't do it for me. As is recognized by the state of California to be elevated in many foods, particularly rice products, and I don't use that or other products with that labeling. I am not short of magnesium. I've never had night terrors, but I do often sleep with the curled wrists. It doesn't add up.
     
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  19. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    @Critterina I don't think you have arsenic. The wrists thing hubby and I experienced from Milk Thislte could be transport of iron, manganese, lack of copper or even high circulating oxalates since MT is high in them. I never paid attention to what foods we were eating when DH complained of sleeping with the hands tucked in and hurting like @Sherlock reported.
    It could well be my latest nemesis, the oxalates :bulb::devil::rolleyes:
     
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  20. Critterina

    Critterina Senior Member

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    I agree. The arsenic test was 6 with a reference range of 0 to 81. Probably not a problem.

    My dad and brother had oxalate kidney stones, and so although mine have never been analyzed, I figure that oxalates are probably best avoided for me, too. I remember my dad avoiding spinach and cashews in particular, in the 1960s, but in the internet age, we can find more and more requirements for tweaking our diet.
     
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