Is homocysteine level a good indicator of methylation status?

[Oci]

I have just stopped it. I am having to lower my oxalate intake (coffee) and right now I don't need my B6 being diverted to insulin/glucose functions. I am already missing the methyl donors :thumbdown:

You always present such interesting ideas! Are you missing coffee because it is a methyl donor or because of the caffeine? There are lots of other sources of methyl donors!

Are you sure that coffee increases oxalates? There seems to be mixed opinion on effect of coffee on formation of kidney stones.

"right now I don't need my B6 being diverted to insulin/glucose functions" means you need B6 for oxalate management?

My thinking at the moment is that my oxalate problem is related to candida level and/or leaky gut. I sense that Susan Owens is right when she suspects that herbals can also damage the gut lining. I'd include coconut oil in this. Anyway this is probably a discussion for the oxalate thread. Sorry if you are having problems again.

 

[Gondwanaland]

You always present such interesting ideas! Are you missing coffee because it is a methyl donor or because of the caffeine? There are lots of other sources of methyl donors!

I am still eating my morning egg for choline... I thought caffeine was the methyl donor in coffee...

Are you sure that coffee increases oxalates? There seems to be mixed opinion on effect of coffee on formation of kidney stones.

Instant coffe is hi ox, but brewed is lower. Anyway I am trying to lower again my oxalate intake for a while to stabilize my new phase.

"right now I don't need my B6 being diverted to insulin/glucose functions" means you need B6 for oxalate management?

Yes, and for sleep and thyroid health.

my oxalate problem is related to candida level and/or leaky gut.

I think that candida and gut issues are a direct consequence of oxalate overload or endogenous conversion.

Sorry if you are having problems again.

I trust I am moving into a new, better phase There is always some turbulence in transitioning

 

[Oci]

I think that candida and gut issues are a direct consequence of oxalate overload or endogenous conversion.

I trust I am moving into a new, better phase There is always some turbulence in transitioning

I did the OAT test and there was no indication that I was producing oxalates endogenously. There were high markers for fungals.

Why is it that some people can eat huge amounts of oxalate-containing foods ie spinach without a problem and others cannot? I don't think it a matter of the load.

It may be a chicken and egg story re oxalates and leaky gut. Which came first?

As for B6, interesting re thyroid health. I didn't know. I do notice the improvement in sleep and now take a 50 mg P5P at bedtime as well as same in the morning. I saw on another thread, I think, that you are only taking a 1.3 mg dose of B6?! What are the dangers of me taking a high dose?

You like to take low doses of most everything I think. Probably very wise decision. I am coming to think that I should stop most of the supplements I take and concentrate on improving diet.

I am interested in hearing more of your "new, better phase".

 

[Gondwanaland]

I don't think it a matter of the load.

I think mitochondrial issues are involved, esp. activation of B2 and B6

now take a 50 mg P5P at bedtime as well as same in the morning

After taking P5P a few days in a row, I got severe eye and skin dryness that disappeared after taking B2. My sister got severe dryness and depression from her 2nd dose of 5mg of regular pyridoxine.

I think, that you are only taking a 1.3 mg dose of B6?!

I took ~6mg of P5P for about 2 weeks and now I make sure that when I open the capsule of my B complex I don't get more than 0.5mg of B6/P5P at a time.

Probably very wise decision.

My decision was to take the amounts that everybody takes, but my body forbids me that

I should stop most of the supplements I take and concentrate on improving diet.

This is my dream. I will have to eat minced meat for breakfast, because I can't get my body to function without iron in the morning

I am interested in hearing more of your "new, better phase"

Me too, it is still a mystery to me Que sera, sera

 

[Oci]

How different we all are! You have developed a great sensitivity re what your body wants and needs. With so many variables, I find that hard to do. Oftentimes I have come to the wrong conclusion - blaming one factor - which later turns out to be the wrong one.

Re oxalates: You said..."I think mitochondrial issues are involved, esp. activation of B2 and B6"
Can you please expand on this?

I want/need to reconsider some of the supps that I have been taking. One step at a time!

 

[Gondwanaland]

I find that hard to do. Oftentimes I have come to the wrong conclusion - blaming one factor - which later turns out to be the wrong one.

This happens to me all the time

Re oxalates: You said..."I think mitochondrial issues are involved, esp. activation of B2 and B6"
Can you please expand on this?

This paper talks about B6 being activated by FMN. http://hmg.oxfordjournals.org/content/24/19/5500.abstract

In mammals, diet is the only source
of B6 vitamers, being mainly present in meat, cereals (we know these are hi ox)
and vegetables (2). Phosphorylated B6 vitamers must be hydrolyzed to PM,
PL and PN in order to be absorbed by the intestine. They are
then internalized by the liver (2), where they are interconverted
by a pathway that relies on the action of PN (PM) 5′-phosphate
oxidase (PNPOx), a flavin mononucleotide-dependent enzyme
that catalyzes the oxidation of PNP or PMP to PLP, and PL kinase
(PLK), an adenosine triphosphate-dependent enzyme that cata-
lyzes the phosphorylation of PN, PM and PL to PNP, PMP and
PLP, respectively

 

[Gondwanaland]

so, @Oci how is your lymphocyte count?

 

[Oci]

I have no idea!!! I have not had a CBC in a long time. I did have 2 nasty chest colds this past winter and rarely get a cold.
My doctor does not seem to be ordering routine tests unless some indication to do so. I am in Canada and health care budget is out of sight and so I think doctors are being monitored re what they order and why.

 

[Gondwanaland]

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/73/3/613.full.pdf+html
Am J Clin Nutr. 2001 Mar;73(3):613-21.
Determinants of plasma total homocysteine concentration in the Framingham Offspring cohort.
Jacques PF1, Bostom AG, Wilson PW, Rich S, Rosenberg IH, Selhub J.
Author information

Abstract
BACKGROUND:
Established determinants of fasting total homocysteine (tHcy) concentration include folate and vitamin B-12 status, serum creatinine concentration, and renal function.

OBJECTIVE:
Our objective was to examine the relation between known and suspected determinants of fasting plasma tHcy in a population-based cohort.

DESIGN:
We examined the relations between fasting plasma tHcy concentrations and nutritional and other health factors in 1960 men and women, aged 28-82 y, from the fifth examination cycle of the Framingham Offspring Study between 1991 and 1994, before the implementation of folic acid fortification.

RESULTS:
Geometric mean tHcy was 11% higher in men than in women and 23% higher in persons aged > or = 65 y than in persons aged < 45 y (P < 0.001). tHcy was associated with plasma folate, vitamin B-12, and pyridoxal phosphate (P for trend < 0.001). Dietary folate, vitamin B-6, and riboflavin were associated with tHcy among non-supplement users (P for trend < 0.01). The tHcy concentrations of persons who used vitamin B supplements were 18% lower than those of persons who did not (P < 0.001). tHcy was positively associated with alcohol intake (P for trend = 0.004), caffeine intake (P for trend < 0.001), serum creatinine (P for trend < 0.001), number of cigarettes smoked (P for trend < 0.001), and antihypertensive medication use (P < 0.001).

CONCLUSIONS:
Our study confirmed, in a population-based setting, the importance of the known determinants of fasting tHcy and suggested that other dietary and lifestyle factors, including vitamin B-6, riboflavin, alcohol, and caffeine intakes as well as smoking and hypertension, influence circulating tHcy concentrations.
(...)
Riboflavin is a cofactor for methylenete-
trahydrofolate reductase, an enzyme involved in the remethylation
of homocysteine to methionine (16). Vitamin B-6 plays a role in
homocysteine transsulfuration and catabolism, but the relation
between vitamin B-6 status and fasting tHcy concentrations has
received little attention. An inverse association was reported
between circulating tHcy concentrations and protein intake (17),
and positive associations were found between homocysteine and
consumption of alcohol (18) and coffee (17, 19).