1. Patients launch $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
Can You Come for a Visit? My ME/CFS Says No
My daughter and son-in-law just had a baby last week. We are thrilled. But we won't be able to see the baby or hold her any time soon. We won't be able to take over little gifts or help out with housework or babysitting.
Discuss the article on the Forums.

In Brief: The Cardiovascular System and ME

Discussion in 'Phoenix Rising Articles' started by Firestormm, Oct 25, 2013.

  1. Phoenix Rising Team

    Phoenix Rising Team

    Messages:
    650
    Likes:
    1,011
    View the Post on the Blog

    View the Post on the Blog
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 27, 2013
    MeSci, Tito, Firestormm and 5 others like this.
  2. voner

    voner Senior Member

    Messages:
    230
    Likes:
    141
    Andrew, thank you for this clear, and very well-written article. The subject matter is not easy to simplify, but you did! Your description and interpretation of the new research paper on AV shunts and fibromyalgia is just so well done.

    The big question for me has how the autonomic system (And the anomalously high density of sympathetic nerve fibers on the AV Shunts) fits in with these cardiovascular deficiencies that have been demonstrated by Dr. Julie Newton and the recent AV shunt paper.... Guess that's next up for you.

    Thanks again. You are doing us a great service.
    aimossy and Legendrew like this.
  3. Snowdrop

    Snowdrop Senior Member

    Messages:
    430
    Likes:
    619
    Toronto
    Andrew
    Thank you for the work you did researching and writing this article. It was clearly written and informative. Mine was a gradual onset ME with Fibro and POTS.

    I have a thought with no invested interest in the idea but is it possible that an infectious agent brings about this dysfunction of the CVS?

    Regardless, interesting stuff.
    SD
    aimossy and Legendrew like this.
  4. Legendrew

    Legendrew Content team

    Messages:
    535
    Likes:
    689
    UK
    Yep, the nervous system is up next. I admit I haven't started it yet so might start sometime this weekend. Glad you enjoyed the article anyway!

    It's certainly possible that an infectious agent triggers everything of, i'm of the opinion that anythink capable of eliciting a strong immune response can trigger of the syndrome, the true question is then what it triggers and the steps from there to symptom perpetuation. I think the autoimmune hypothesis is a promising avenue to answer this question but certainly it appears that the cardiovascular system is very important in the disease pathology.
    aimossy likes this.
  5. Chris

    Chris Senior Member

    Messages:
    578
    Likes:
    176
    Victoria, BC
    Andrew, thanks for a clear and bang up-to-date overview. I am glad that you too are excited by the work Julia Newton is doing, and look forward to the next piece on the ANS. I have been following Julia's advice on "Home orthostatic training in chronic fatigue syndrome" for about 10 weeks now, and can report that there has been a quite marked improvement in my Orthostatic Intolerance--I shall continue indefinitely, boring though it is.

    Have you investigated the fairly recent discovery of the role of dark green leafy vegetables in generating NO in the mouth through bugs in our saliva? Seems it may account for some of the good effects reported by those who push a diet heavily slanted in this direction--like Terry Wahls for MS, and Joel Fuhrman for autoimmune diseases ( see "Fat, Sick and nearly Dead", a fun DVD, and his book "Eat to Live."

    I look forward to your next piece. Chris
    aimossy and Legendrew like this.
  6. SOC

    SOC Moderator and Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,286
    Likes:
    6,275
    USA
    Can you share a link to Newton's OI training plan?
    aimossy likes this.
  7. Chris

    Chris Senior Member

    Messages:
    578
    Likes:
    176
    Victoria, BC
    Sorry, links are beyond me, but if you type Sutcliffe K, and that title into PubMed, it will come up--I deliberately gave the exact, though abbreviated, title--the last word I quoted, "syndrome, " is followed by "-a randomized, placebo-controlled feasibility study." Julia is listed last among the authors. There is now quite a bibliography of studies on this simple therapy, most of it focused on neurocardiogenic syncope. It really seems to help! I am now 80, so change comes slow...
    If you try it, be very careful--if you have any tendency to faint, make sure you have a friend and/or what they call a "drop zone" around you--just in case--i.e. cushions, etc--no hard objects. I have never fainted in my life, so was not too concerned about that danger. But also don't try for too long first time--build up time slowly. And be careful moving out of the position--I find my legs a bit numb and dead for a few moments. Best not to plan on driving for a couple of hours too--there will be some hypoperfusion of the brain for a while. Chris
    aimossy likes this.
  8. SOC

    SOC Moderator and Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,286
    Likes:
    6,275
    USA
    Yikes! Sounds like the cure is worse than the malady. ;) Seriously, though, thanks for the info, I'll definitely look it up.

    BTW, links are easy once you know how. Highlight any text in your post that you want to make a link. In the blue box at the top of your post there's a chain icon. Click on it and copy in the web address. Clink Insert and it's done. The result will look like this: Home Orthostatic Training in CFS
    aimossy and rosie26 like this.
  9. Chris

    Chris Senior Member

    Messages:
    578
    Likes:
    176
    Victoria, BC
    Hi, SOC--let us know how it goes if you decide to give it a try. I might have added that it has also helped a bit with my dry eyes, and the essay further reported that participants who kept at it also reported some improvement in fatigue levels... just to motivate you. When I started, 12 mins or so was my limit. Now I can usually last 30 or so. And waiting to check out at the food store is no longer a problem for me. I shall soon try a visit to the local art gallery, which I have not visited for 3-4 years. Chris
    aimossy and SOC like this.
  10. PearlGirl26

    PearlGirl26 Living with CFS for years, recently diagnosed.

    Messages:
    47
    Likes:
    36
    CA
    This is a great article. I'm wondering does anyone know if CPET testing has also been performed on Fibromyalgia patients as well? A lower ATHR would explain the build up in lactic acid and provide evidence for a disability claim.
    aimossy likes this.
  11. Simon

    Simon

    Messages:
    1,336
    Likes:
    4,202
    Monmouth, UK
    Great article, thanks, Andrew - very clear. For some reason the description of the heart at the centre of a figure of 8, connecting lungs and body works brilliantly for me, I've never seen that before. And I had no idea that the epithelium played such an important role in regulation of the sytem.
    SOC, Legendrew and aimossy like this.
  12. S.A.

    S.A.

    Messages:
    37
    Likes:
    44
    Missouri
    Great article! I appreciate the detail and links!
    Legendrew likes this.
  13. aimossy

    aimossy Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,972
    Likes:
    2,398
    NZ
    These articles are really helping me make sense of things. I get excited when a new one comes.
    I'm learning a large amount from them and the links are very helpful!
    Thanks heaps Andrew.
    PearlGirl26, Legendrew and Firestormm like this.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page