Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Marianarchy, Apr 9, 2013.
What are the best ways to test Lithium? Is a Hair Test any good at all?
She would take 2 X 99mg pills with the supplements am/pm. Then 3-4 X 99mg with a glass of water every 45 minutes until symptoms (leg cramps) went away. Maybe 1600 mgs on the worst days. But I think she could have had more. She was always "bouncing off the bottom" with potassium. If she was experiencing potassium symptoms, I used the rationalization that a person without deficiency has an RDA between 3000-4700. So I wouldn't become to concerned if she was supplementing an extra 50%. But I think the best answer might be to take potassium until potassium symptoms go away.
I didn't have many life threatening concerns as my wife was a relatively healthy 25 year old before the CFS/ME hit. She was running 5k's etc..... So please take that into consideration.
I would say it took a few months to get through the symptomatic treatment (extra 300-400mg doses) and then 2-4 99mg along with the supplements has seemed to work.
For people with inflammatory conditions such as viruses, infections, or metal/mold/chemical toxicities, methylation can exacerbate the inflammation and also cause the toxins to be released via the transsulfuration pathway. I don't think there's really a right or wrong answer as to which order people do things whether they do methylation first or after treating other conditions or doing both treatments at the same times. The causes of CFS/ME are so wide and diverse that everyone here seems to have their own unique set of circumstances. I find that too much methylation tends to trigger my adrenal symptoms now. I also think I have large amount of inflammation now since anything that causes a herx (either probiotics or antibacterial/microbial/fungal/viral supplements) triggers a depression most likely due to inflammatory cytokines.
Um, I don't want to comment on startup. I have been supplementing my whole life so I cannot comment on that. What I want to comment on is your saying you have brain fog. I usually hear that is caused by a thyroid problem. Your TSH should be < 2.0 or else your thyroid is not normal. See here: www.lef.org/appendix/protocols/blood_testing_02.htm
Now what to do if it's > 2.0? I am no expert. I just want to say that some of the things required for your thyroid to function are tyrosine, zinc, B12, selenium, iodine, and copper. maybe others. Go to a good thyroid site if need be. But I would check it out.
I've been under 2.0 all three times I've been tested, but my test says that the normal range is 0.550-4.780. It says "TSH high-sensitivity". Is there more than one type of TSH test?
Thanks.... that's really helpful. I think I am needing those kind of doses. I get some cramping in my feet, but the bigger problem is my heart "thumping", increased heart rate and ankle swelling. NEVER had this before..... and it seems to be relieved by Potassium. I think I had better get the pills so I can measure the dosed better.
Why is it that you are able to go to a reduced dose after a few months? Is it that the methylation Cycle slows down, or what?
You might also want to make sure you're supplementing with magnesium. If you have a magnesium deficiency you might have trouble raising your potassium levels.
And magnesium deficiency causes irregular heart beat. (Potassiumdeficiency may as well, I am just chipping in that low magnesium is known for this).
Lotus I don't think there is more than one type of TSH test so your thyroid is ok. I believe it is better if it is close to 1. But at 2 you do not have cholesterol problems nor cardiac problems. Someone on a thyroid forum said when their thyroid was 1 they felt fantastic and after having a baby it is 2 and they are trying to get back to 1. I never measured my thyroid until I had a problem so I don't know what it might have been when I was healthier and I have adopted this goal (of 1) for my own. Priorly I was satisfied at 2 thinking hat was about what could be expected from a thyroid.
Anyway a 2 should not cause brain fog so that is not your thyroid. I have also had brain fog from anemia...r u anemic? No doubt there are other causes as well, I just observed on these forums that thyroid seems to be the most common cause. Good luck.
My last test I was 1.8, but are you saying that I don't need to get my T3 tested if my TSH is under 2.0? I'm sort of confused about the symptoms of thyroid, but I thought it should still be ruled out since I have adrenal issues and Lyme disease. I do have high cholesterol and high blood pressue, but I'm not sure how that's related to the thyroid. My cholesterol is probably due to medication I've been on, but I don't know what's causing the blood pressure.
Hi Lotus, The TSH is a pituitary hormone, so it doesn't always describe the condition of the thyroid. For instance, if the pituitary function is low, it may not be able to generate enough TSH to stimulate the thyroid to produce T3 and T4.
This is the reason it is good to test free T3 and free T4, along with TSH.
In my case, I've had times of very low TSH, along with low free T3 and low normal T4. These results indicate low pituitary function, hypopituitary.
There can be a combined low pituitary and low thyroid too.
I think the general theory is that with you start methylation your body uses a bunch of potassium to "heal". You start building muscle, etc.... As the "healing" subsides and you become "healthy", your potassium demand goes back to normal.
I don't know how many others have been able to reduce potassium intake after becoming healthy.
Lotus, you should do a complete thyroid panel if you have symptoms: TSH, FREE T4, FREE T3, Reverse T3, and the two thyroid antibodies. And supposedly the thyroid antibodies may need to be tested twice because of false negatives or something (I think if you have Hashi it may show antibodies and then not, off and on??). idk that much about the thyroid...it has never been on the radar of my family and I feel disgusted to be having problems with it, like it wasn't supposed to be my fate.
After I did the panel and found no problem not detected by TSH, I just am cheap and use TSH. The thing is that I suspect TSH is a better measure than people think IF you use the right range (<2.0). But I can't swear to that. I think possibly, tentatively, that we women have trouble absorbing copper and zinc after menopause because the substance needed to do it, metallothionein, seems to be affected (increased) by hormones. I have recently read a study that showed that copper, zinc, and chromium are best absorbed in the picolinate form (2 other forms measured did not raise blood or other levels of these minerals). So I switched to that form and maybe in a month or so I'll know if it will help me. The thing is that now that I am taking thyroid glandulars idk if supplying the nutrients the thyroid needs to work will help me or if my thyroid will just get lazy and say fagettaboutit. It was my allergies that pushed me into thyroid problems though this winter. I am wondering if I should move south before another winter...
idk anything about adrenal problems except that I get those during hayfever season. Zinc helps me tremendously with that. But my allergies are so bad that eventually if the allergy season last long enough, I will develop adrenal problems (no aldosterone, low blood pressure).
For high blood pressure I take: 500mg potassium (every day, no let up unless my kidneys are out (UTI or real thyroid issue as it lowers GFR)), 1g olive leaf extract (it is an ace inhibitor and I can feel it relaxing my blood vessles...science says it lowers bp 11 points), some amount (depends on you) of DHEA, and cal-mag citrate supplements (I currently use Nutricology because I can get both the cal and mag in citrate form with that brand and I take 4-6/day...I think the daily dose may be 4(?) but if I managed to eat a lot of salt that day I will certainly take 6 if not more...but only 2 at a time to prevent bowel problems. I think the calcium helps me excrete the salt...I am extremely salt sensitive. Today I was at my sister's house and I ate some hot sauce on an avocado. I liked it a lot and proceeded to eat several tablespoons of hot sauce plain. After I got home I got REAL thirsty and realised - sh*T! That was LOADED with salt! In defence of blood pressure I am up late taking my cal-mag citrate pills every so often trying to get rid of some salt...
Life extension has quite a bit about lowering cholesterol on their website www.lef.org. I think (1) is to take omega-3. So far this is the first time mine ever came high and my throid was low. So until I get a reading lik ethyroid ok but still high cholesterol, I am not doing anything but fix my thyroid. I want to measure TSH to see how I'm doing but I don't have a feel for how fast TSH responds to dietary changes. Anyone know that?
Well sorry I couldn't be more helpful.
Oh, also, estrogen raises BH4. And I get estrogen from DHEA. DHEA lowers TNF-alpha. I am CBS +/+ and CBS +/- (two mutations on CBS) and that dysregulates blood sugar (I have read indicators that it is a G6PDCH or whatever issue). The DHEA makes testosterone that regulates my CBS gene better and that is why I think DHEA is saving me from diabetes.
I keep seeing Dr. Yasko's recommendation for pycnogenol (pine bark extract), and I'm not sure it's a good idea for us CFS/ME folks. Whilst it has many potential benefits, it's a potential Th2 stimulant. In most of us, whether due to heavy metal toxicity, candida, parasites, etc., we are probably Th2 dominant. So, it's counterintuitive to take pycnogenol. However, grape seed extract is a Th1 stimulant. It's also a potent antifungal (but it also wipes out good bacteria, so I stay away from it). I can only assume that the focus on autism means that not all supplements are useful to us. With that said, there will naturally be similarities. My lithium, for instance, was almost undetectable in the DDI toxic elements hair test. Together with reducing excitotoxicity, I think for many of us, this will prove to be useful step.
Funky cut & pasting above. That post is Not by aquariusgirl.
It was your post from pg. 1, in which you helpfully provided a quote Amy Yasko. So, my post was a reply to a quote upon a quote (-:
It could be the folic acid that does that. It is not the same as the methylfolate and can actually block methylfolate for some people. It would make me depressed. The pernicious anemia is where you have to start or it can kill you.
My doc said that the interpretation has changed recently, that the preferred range is now under 2.0, the lower half of the "normal" TSH range, that patients do better.
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