Phoenix Rising supports the Millions Missing global day of protest
Phoenix Rising is delighted to support the demands being made in the ME/CFS community’s first-ever global day of protest …
Discuss the article on the Forums.

I can now sleep...with this curry

Discussion in 'Sleep' started by cigana, Aug 2, 2015.

  1. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

    Messages:
    970
    Likes:
    782
    UK
    As I posted previously, indian curry allows me to sleep, but only that from British indian restaurants. I tried many many recipes for home-made curry and none of them work, see the discussion here.

    I have now found how to replicate a recipe that means I now sleep until about 8am (rather than 3am, which is when I wake without this curry).

    I think the key is the emulsification, which takes a long time. This may be explained by this research on emulsified curcumin showing than nano-emulsion curcumin can suppress inflammation via NFkB and MCP-1 inhibition. I have consistently raised MCP-1.

    Here's the recipe ("spoon"=dessert spoon):

    Stage 1
    Large cooking pot.
    Lots of onions - about 20-25 medium-large.
    Handful of chopped green and red peper.
    2/3 tin of tomatoes.
    4 spoons fresh garlic and ginger puree (ground up 2/3 ginger and 1/3 garlic cloves in oil).
    1/2 small cabbage.
    1 carrot
    Handful fresh coriander
    3 spoons ground tumeric
    3-4 spoons ground coriander
    3-4 spoons ground cumin
    3-4 spoons asafoetida ("hing")
    3-4 spoons ground fenugreek seed
    3-4 spoons curry powder
    3 spoons salt
    1/2 litre of vegatable oil
    small cup of water

    Put all ingredients into the pot (+lid) in the order in which they are listed. Don't worry about mixing or chopping, everything melts down over time.

    Cook on a very low heat for about 1-1.5 hours.

    Stage 2
    Wait for it to cool, then blend very finely.
    Put blended mixture back into a large pot, and pour in about the same amount again of water.
    Bring to boil and simmer on a lowish heat for about 1-1.5 hours without lid.
    You should start to see at some point a reddish oil film forming on the top. If you start to see this take off the stove, put the lid on and wait 2 minutes. Take the lid of and see if you have a layer of reddish oil across the top of the mixture - if you do, you've finished. If not, take the lid off and put it back on the stove and keep checking every 10 minutes or so to see if you get the red film.

    Once it's done you can freeze it. Eat a decent bowl any way you like in the evening (eg. boil it up with other vegetables or meat, or eat it straight as a soup).

    I hope it helps someone!

    EDIT: I also take 500mg of Enhansa. This gives me an extra 1-2 hours sleep (the curry seems to get me more on top)
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2015
    Anju, Mary, anne_likes_red and 7 others like this.
  2. girlinthesnow

    girlinthesnow Senior Member

    Messages:
    271
    Likes:
    147
    Thanks @cigana for the recipe, I'll try this for my chronic insomnia, cheers!
     
    maryb likes this.
  3. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,367
    Likes:
    14,727
    @cigana
    Glad you managed to find the recipe that recreates the soporific effect of Indian restaurant curry.


    Just a thought, but have you tried the much more bioavailable Longvida formulation of curcumin? Now Foods do a good value for money supplement called CurcuBrain, which contains 400 mg of Longvida curcumin per capsule. I believe there are studies showing Longvida is around 60 times more absorbable than standard curcumin.

    Assuming it is the NF-κB inhibition of curcumin that is allowing you to sleep, you might also consider other NF-κB inhibitors such as the herb shwagandha (Withania somnifera), grape seed extract, or the drug sulfasalazine (a potent NF-κB inhibitor).
     
    rosie26, cigana and Mij like this.
  4. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

    Messages:
    970
    Likes:
    782
    UK
    Thanks for the link - I will certainly try CurcuBrain.
    Unfortunately ashwaganha and grape seed extract have no effect on me, though perhaps I should try higher doses close to bedtime...
     
  5. snowathlete

    snowathlete

    Messages:
    3,312
    Likes:
    14,610
    UK
    I take mesalazine for UC which is related to sulfalazine. It keeps a lid on my inflammation but I still have a lot. If I miss a dose the inflammation rises noticably.

    This led me to try curcumin which didn't work for me. But I am convinced NF-kB is worth limiting. I tried Boswellia which definitely worked for a while. I stopped taking it but plan to try again to confirm if it works or not. Boswellia is cheap and worth trying, just be aware that it is not water soluble so you need capsules with lose powder not tablets or compacted capsules (else they won't do anything but come out how you put them in!)
     
    Helen, cigana and rosie26 like this.
  6. rosie26

    rosie26 Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes:
    5,133
    Glad you sleeping better now @cigana. Thanks for the recipe.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2015
  7. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

    Messages:
    970
    Likes:
    782
    UK
    Thanks. Boswellia doesn't help me unfortunately.
    Which type of curcumin did you try? I've tried many brands, and only one of them works - the others do nothing, so I think the form is very important.
     
    snowathlete likes this.
  8. maryb

    maryb iherb code TAK122

    Messages:
    3,511
    Likes:
    3,096
    UK
    If I give you my address can you send me some:)
     
  9. snowathlete

    snowathlete

    Messages:
    3,312
    Likes:
    14,610
    UK
    it was a Now brand, a powder in capsules.
     
  10. Thinktank

    Thinktank Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,239
    Likes:
    1,396
    Europe + Asia
    Great find @cigana, i will definitely try your recipe as i've not tried the whole turmeric root yet.

    Sometimes i take 500mg Curcumin. (meriva from Thorne is bound to PC for better absorption) whenever i wake up at night, it usually sends me back to sleep within 20 minutes. Besides that it is a great anti-inflammatory for my IBD.
    The downside is it makes me really cranky next day so i can't take too much of it. :(
     
    cigana likes this.
  11. girlinthesnow

    girlinthesnow Senior Member

    Messages:
    271
    Likes:
    147
    Certainly I will send you some, curry by post! :)
     
    maryb likes this.
  12. Seanko

    Seanko Senior Member

    Messages:
    119
    Likes:
    94
    Swindon, UK
    @cigana

    If it makes you sleep & feel better, do not worry about the science! :p

    PS Hot spices help release endorphins...
     
  13. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem All Good Things Must Come to an End

    Messages:
    4,665
    Likes:
    5,481
    Would you measure how much your desert spoon holds? I think they might vary.

    I'm glad we do not have to chop all of those onions!
     
  14. cigana

    cigana Senior Member

    Messages:
    970
    Likes:
    782
    UK
    I use a semi-heaped spoon, so it's around 15-20ml.
     
    Little Bluestem likes this.
  15. anne_likes_red

    anne_likes_red Senior Member

    Messages:
    940
    Likes:
    577
    Unless you don't read the instructions properly....:bang-head:
    I'll never get that hour back! ;)

    Will report on sleep in due course. Thx @cigana. :thumbsup:
     
    Little Bluestem likes this.
  16. anne_likes_red

    anne_likes_red Senior Member

    Messages:
    940
    Likes:
    577
    Updating. Didn't help me on the nights I tried it.

    I've resumed sleeping later anyway, to a more respectable 6am after waking for a few weeks at 4am. I'm fairly sure (tho not 100%) this is unrelated to the short term increase in Indian spices.

    Hope it continues to help you cigana! :D
     
  17. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,367
    Likes:
    14,727
    @cigana
    Have you considered that the reason you get a good night's sleep from turmeric-containing curry is because turmeric is a natural antihistamine? Antihistamines can help induce sleep.
     
    JaimeS, PatJ and Gondwanaland like this.
  18. Richard7

    Richard7 Senior Member

    Messages:
    536
    Likes:
    956
    Australia
    would your 20 -25 onions be 4-5 kilos or 8.8-10 lbs?

    I know in Australia a dessert spoon is 25mls and internationally its 20mls, so I assume you are saying 60-80mls of hing, or about a quater to a third of a cup, is that right.

    I'm, I hope obviously, asking because I am interested, though I expect I will start with a small batch.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2015
  19. IreneF

    IreneF Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,552
    Likes:
    2,560
    San Francisco
    That's a lot of onions. I don't have a pot that big. Are you talking about regular yellow onions?
     
  20. Richard7

    Richard7 Senior Member

    Messages:
    536
    Likes:
    956
    Australia
    Hi,

    were you other attempts with the same ingredients?

    Another idea for why this might work might be the anti microbial effects of the spices, particularly the asafoetida and the tumeric, it could be feeding some parts of your microbiome with all of that fibre while suppressing other parts.

    I went looking for info on asafoetida on wikipedia and came up with

    GARG, S. K., BANERJEA, A. C., VERMA, J. and ABRAHAM, M. J. (1980), EFFECT OF VARIOUS TREATMENTS OF PULSES ON IN VITRO GAS PRODUCTION BY SELECTED INTESTINAL CLOSTRIDIA. Journal of Food Science, 45: 1601–1602. doi: 10.1111/j.1365-2621.1980.tb07571.x

    Studies were performed to find out the effect of different treatments of pulses, like cooking, fermentation, incorporation of spices like raw garlic, and ginger powder on in vitro gas production by selected intestinal Clostridia. All treatments had profound influence on gas production; the amount of gas was reduced between 30–60%. Maximum reduction was noticed at 1.0% concentration of spices. Lag phase of growth was prolonged considerably, suggestive of temporary suppression of gas production. C. perfringens produced the highest amount of gas in all control samples and all treatments had maximum inhibitory effects on this organism.

    I don't have access to the journal, but if a well emulsified supplement did not have the same effect as the curry this might be a place to look for an answer.

    by the by, they emulsified the tumeric with castor oil. I wouldn't try that at home.
     
    cigana likes this.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page