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High dose b12 and enzyme production

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS Discussion' started by Martial, Oct 24, 2014.

  1. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    Ventura, CA
    I was looking into some research but could not really find too much on it, does anyone here know if injected b12 over a longer period of time causes any issues like my body becoming dependent on needing higher doses? I don't really have too many issues with what I do now methyl b12/adeno b12 sub lingual around 7-10k mcg a day depending on how pills break with the adeno b12. I do have nerve issues from my infection and was trying to really stay on these high doses to heal any injuries that could have happened to my nerves. In the begininig before I got properly diagnosed I was also getting injections of b12 1000mcg about twice a week for a few months, thought I could have had b12 deficiency and doctors refused to check levels at hospital. One doctor actually wrote me off saying there is no way you could have b 12 deficiency with neurological involvement without anemia, medically impossible I could write a huge scientific journal and win an award if that were true. SMH

    Anyways I was going to try and see if perhaps the injections would help again and maybe start getting them at least like once a week but it makes me wonder, I have been using some form of high dose b12 for around a year now and I wonder if I take this kind of stuff long term is there chance It would create some kind of physiological dependency?

    I have the MTHFR mutation so I will need methylation supplements indefinitely anyways, just curious if that was something that could result if I took higher doses though. I really feel its the best thing to use in terms of healing any potential nerve issues and injections are much more absorbed then these sub lingual. I just don't know if I really need to do that much more based on what I already am taking in and not having pernicious anemia or low b12 intrinsic factor.
     
  2. cman89

    cman89 Senior Member

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    Hayden, Idaho
    I'm not sure about physiological dependency, but with your mutation and the need for supplementing anyway, I would give the neural repair more weight over the dependency. Remember how high of a tolerance the body has for B12, and so overdoses and overloads are uncommon, unless you theoretically were pulsing b12 constantly into your system. Also, have you tried to go any short period without the b12? I would never stop cold turkey, but i'm sure that, like anything, if you phased down the dosage, you could find results with less. The difference between a mineral/vitamin supplement and a drug like caffeine or opiods, is the supplements have a defined role in physiology, and when added appropriately can act as a key entering the proper lock, whereas the drugs are more like picking the lock, which is less than ideal and can damage.
     
  3. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    I never stopped taking it nor plan to, I am already using doses plenty high enough for healing though. My only concern is if I pushed it too high by adding shots. Because my body would be taking so much of a high dose in b12 daily that it could be less absorbed and processed through the body over longer period of time. I do not know if that is something that would really happen though, just seems theoretically something to think about. I will still do what I am now which is plenty thorough enough for now. It doesn't seem like a huge concern of mine but was just curious if this was something that could happen with methyl b12 vitamins. I have no fears of b12 toxicity though, since its water soluble it is one of the least toxic things I could ever be taking in.
     
  4. cman89

    cman89 Senior Member

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    Hayden, Idaho
    I see, so some sort of resistance to the b12? A down regulation in a way? I honestly doubt it, given the lack of toxicity of the vitamin. Now, if the liver was compromised, and could not excrete it properly, then I may be concerned, but think about how varied people's vitiman /mineral intake is via diet. the body is well set up to accommodate varying intake, and so when we fall ill, the underlying mechanisms arent entirely "malfunctioning" , so in a sense, you could have problems with metabolizing a vitamin, but still ok detox, and vise versa. For most of us, I would assume that many systems are majorly off, but once pieces are put back in place, can slowly begin functioning well again. Do you or have you considered avoiding the shots? Just using the sublingual?
     
  5. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    Northcoast NSW, Australia
  6. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    Yeah I was debating whether or not to try it out, perhaps this is exactly what I could use though. My brother actually sells vaporizers so I could just get one off of him, he works for a shop so could hook me up with the rest too. Thank god cause those things are kind of expensive, even to just maintain them. I am already ordering the b12 from the shop link he posted! Thank you so much for sharing this, saves me the trouble and cost of trying to get prescription methyl b12 shots from my doctor if I ended up going that route.

    Curious Ahmo, have you tried it yet yourself? If you have do you only use the vaporizer now and don't do sublingual methyl b12?
     
    ahmo likes this.
  7. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @Martial I'm waiting for my new order of B12 drops to arrive. Initially I chose some drops from iherb that have citric acid, but no other additives, as I could add it to my current order. If I'm happy with this, I'll either stay w/ this brand, switch to the (Canadian?) one recommended by bluewhistled, which has only B12 and water, or get serious about following up the links posted for the crystal form. I'm really excited by this possibility, both because of the possibility of better penetration, and for the reduced cost. And I'm already happy happy to have decreased my folate needs by half by taking it sublingually (from 15mg to 8mg). :D:thumbsup:
     
  8. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    Oh i see Ahmo that is awesome! So I take it you are completely replacing sublingual b12 with vapor b12 now, the crystals also sound promising but I want to try the VG Methyl b12 version first, see how I respond. Any serious differences between crystal b12? I like how it sounds like I am asking about smoking crystal b12, sounds like we are trying to smoke crystal meth hahaha. Oh also how are you taking the folate sub lingual? Any specific brand name for better absorption of the folate? The folgar version has the pills but Jarrows and some mthf 5 versions come in the powder pill caps from what I have seen.
     
  9. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    No, I haven't gotten the drops yet, should arrive this week.

    I'm using Thorne folate capsules and also some Solagar 1mg tabs I have on hand. Either seems fine, and body says just as good actual sublingual as bucal, (+ no difference in response from whether I put under tongue or in cheek). When I ask body re tabs or caps, preference is for caps, I guess less additives, so that's what I'll be going on with. I use 5 mg in lower gums early AM, 2 mg sublingual/buccal midday, and 1mg cap dumped into my PM footbath. :)

    ha, I just realized we're talking about 'crystal' 'meth' treatment.:rofl::rofl:
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2014

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