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High Dosage methylfolate users

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by zzz0r, Apr 30, 2014.

  1. zzz0r

    zzz0r Senior Member

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    There are a number of people following @Freddd 's protocol. There are also a number of people following its description and belief of paradoxical folate deffeciency.

    To put it simply, that means if someone experiences folate deffeciency symptoms when it is already receiving methylfolate needs to recognize these symptoms and rise the dosage of methylfolate.

    A person needs to keep increasing this dosage until his body reaches an equilibrium. That dosage will be the perfect for him and he might be able to lower the dosage later as the body is healing.

    By increasing the methylfolate dosage each time, someone is experiencing folate deffeciency symptoms (instead of stopping the methylfolate usage) is pushing the body to enter different layers of healing that are described by different group of symptoms as they were written down and grouped by Freddd.

    So in other words when someone is experiencing these symptoms when taking methylfolate he should consider not stopping the supplement or lower the dosage but increase it instead so it will give the chance to his body to get out of the deffeciency and move to a different layer of healing.

    This process maybe repeated,a number of times until someone reaches the perfect dosage for him. There are people that are finding adaquate dosage between 1mg to 20mg of methylfolate so there is quite a WIDE spread between different group of people.

    I am asking people that have found that this description and method of getting out of the folate deffeciency, works for their body to contact me in order to discuss these experiences, as there are not many people that support this approach (or they are scared to follow it), at least that I know of.

    However there are people that are trying this and would be very interesting to know what is the perfect dosage for each one of them. Also I would like to know if when they found the adaquate dosage for them, where able to reduce it after the body has achieved healing at the deepest layer.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2014
    melihtas, helen1, tdog333 and 2 others like this.
  2. tdog333

    tdog333 Senior Member

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    Great idea, I'm also interested in the dosage of deadlock quartet relative to the high methylfolate dose.(carnitine methylb12 adb12)

    Also any relative mutations (BHMT MTRR MTR MTHFR)
    minkeygirl likes this.
  3. juniemarie

    juniemarie Senior Member

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    keep it here on the forum so everyone can benefit from others experiences
    Sea, Snowdrop, tdog333 and 1 other person like this.
  4. zzz0r

    zzz0r Senior Member

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    So @tdog333 and @juniemarie how much methylfolate are you taking? I am currently on 4mg and still going up
  5. tdog333

    tdog333 Senior Member

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    @zzz0r I'm taking 1.8-2.4 MG, I've gone up to 5MG before but felt a bit anxious, I need to try again. I have double COMT mutations so it's hard to keep my b12 up in ratio as well. Hydroxy b12 does nothing for me.
  6. juniemarie

    juniemarie Senior Member

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    I am only at the beginning of this process. Taking 800 mcg. I did a search here on this very subject so I could see various doses people were taking. On the higher side I saw doses of 9mg, 19mg, 48mg.
  7. zzz0r

    zzz0r Senior Member

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    @tdog333 Yes anxiety is an issue with methyl donors such as methylfolate and mb12 with COMT++. Are you sure hydrob12 is not doing anything to you? I have not tried it yet as well I am just asking you.

    Some people with COMT++ are rotating b12 supplements day by day in order to avoid anxiety. What I am doing is using adenosylb12 for two days and then the third day I am using mb12 on relativly low dosage.
  8. tdog333

    tdog333 Senior Member

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    Yeah hydroxy did nothing, I got methyl trapping symptoms with it. I have +/+ MTRR BHMT and MTR also so my conversion of B12 and recycling is terrible though,
  9. zzz0r

    zzz0r Senior Member

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    How do you define methyl trapping symptoms ?
  10. helen1

    helen1 Senior Member

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    I've been on freddd's 'quartet' for 8 months, having starting at 300 mcg of methylfolate and am now up to between
    3 - 7 mg of methylfolate, depending on symptoms.

    If I'm feeling good after my first dose of the day of 2 mg, I don't take any more. If I get the heavy arms and fatigue symptoms, I take a second dose and then a third dose if needed, up to 7 mg. Most days, I need to do that. Maybe one day a week or less, I'm fine with 2 mg. I haven't figured out what the difference is on those days.

    In the last 4 months, I think this is what is allowing me to function normally for 2 - 7 hours a day, usually about 5. It took a few months to get startup going because I wasn't taking carnitine far enough from food to be effective. Once I did that, I saw improvement right away.

    The only other thing I'm doing differently that may be contributing to my improvement is regular coffee enemas. I find they improve my mood significantly and energy somewhat.

    Also taking
    1-2 mg mB12
    2-3 mg adB12
    800 mcg carnitine fumarate in 2 doses
    and a bunch of cofactors
  11. zzz0r

    zzz0r Senior Member

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    @helen1 how long have you been taking methylfolate dosages above 2mg?
  12. helen1

    helen1 Senior Member

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    @zzz0r About 5 months.
    I should add that I've tried Rich's and Freddd's protocols twice before but had not had the courage to increase my mfolate doses. I abandoned those attempts due to exhaustion and insomnia. It's only with the extra mfolate that this methylation protocol seems to be helping me.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2014
  13. place

    place Be Strong!

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    I just currently bumped it up to 2.4mg this week. I did not realize people were taking such high doses. I thought most would take high doses of MB12?

    What does of MB12 are you taking?
  14. juniemarie

    juniemarie Senior Member

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    @place I take 1 mg mB12
  15. place

    place Be Strong!

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    hummm…. I'm between 8-10mg mb12 but I have a hard time keeping them for more than 30 minutes. And sometimes I accidentaly (spell checker?) start to chew on them without noticing.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2014
  16. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    Looks like I'm going to top the list!

    I stopped being :nervous: and started raising my doses for real mid-December. Prior to this I'd been getting recurrent blood blisters in my mouth in addition to my general level of unwellness. Freddd suggested this was epithelial issue, indicating the need for more folate. Also I was again having big hair loss. So I dropped my reservations and started as he recommended, increasing folate 100-200mcg every 1-2 days. I increased when I saw acne outbreak on face, pimples along occiput, hair loss in my brush. Early on I found that on the occasions I felt weird, histamine overloaded after increasing folate, I could take a B12 immediately, and the negative symptoms would go away. This did not always lead to an increase in B12 the following day. I rely on self-testing for all my dosages.

    Dec. 23 I was on 1.4mg folate, 5 mg B12, 5 mg AdB12. Not sure of the LCF dose; mostly it's been 500mg. T3 (thyroid) 40mcg.

    Today I'm on 21.75mg folate ; 28mg MB12; 5 mg AdB12; 30mcg T3, 500 LCF.
    I take folate/B12 in 3 divided doses, LCF AM and midday.

    I had gone up to 10mg AdB12 over that time, but since I started Theoharides' Neuroprotek a week ago, have decreased AdB12, LCF and thyroid, as well as a number of other things.

    V interesting for me to note last night, my sx have moved down my body. "A dermatome is an area of skin that is mainly supplied by a single spinal nerve." Here's a really cool image: http://www.instamedic.co.uk/dermatomes/
    I'm more familiar w/ standard representations, like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dermatomes

    So according to the 3D image, the outbreak of symptoms that indicate I need to raise my folate has moved from the V areas on head down to T2-3, altho hair loss still accompanies these pimples This is consistent w/ healing happening at the level of nerves, even tho the symptoms are skin/epithelial.

    Fred was, or was nearly, wheelchair-bound. He healed. I'm healing. My brain is so much healthier, I'm calm, I no longer have any sort of insomnia, for the first time in my life. After looking at the dermatome chart last night I reflected on how I was 2 years ago. Then I was hesitant to start on the rebounder because my balance was so poor. I was tremulous, a nervous wreck, unstable, weak, off-the-charts reactive to noise, smell, heat, the most minimal sorts of stress, my thermostat was totally off w/ over-heating. No more.:)
    Also, brain fog essentially gone, tho I atribute this a lot to detx as well. No pain in arms, I can type all I want. I can Think!

    Day after tomorrow I'll be taking a walk outside (!) and will then see how I do. I've been so immersed in detox that it's been a v long time since I've taken my standard walk. cheers, ahmo
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2014
    Bessie, juniemarie, Victronix and 2 others like this.
  17. place

    place Be Strong!

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    Ahmo- Holy guacamole! I was where you were in December before I kind of decided to push it a bit. I was on a holding pattern for a while while I delt with another medical issue, beleive it or not, unrelated to this illness.

    Most of my issues now are fatigue, brain fog, attention and sinuses that make me feel ill. Oh and lately I have been feeling more pain.

    I think I am going to push it more. Today was a bad day = (
  18. helen1

    helen1 Senior Member

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    @ahmo, I didn't realize hair loss could be caused by folate deficiency. I've definitely had that discouraging symptom.

    I"m going to try your strategy of increasing B12 if symptoms persist after increasing folate, and keep increasing generally. Wow you're taking a lot!
  19. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @helen1 Before understood this whole thing, before I could foucs enough to read Fredd's posts, I had hair loss from both B12 and folate when I took them independent of each other. I lost about half my hair, thinking I was detoxxing!!! Again, just as Fred has pointed out. Now I can have no hair loss in AM and a brush full in PM, or vice versa. It happens really quickly. And the increased folate stops it for 1-2 days, now it's been up to a week. that's something I didn't include in the post above. I'm no longer increasing every day or two, it's slowed down.
  20. helen1

    helen1 Senior Member

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    @ahmo
    Amazing. Will add B12 to my pockets full of folate supps for when I'm out and about. I'd love to have my hair grow back!
    Laurel6123 likes this.

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