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Healthy food makes me worse...?

Discussion in 'Gastrointestinal and Urinary' started by MartinDH, Nov 29, 2017.

  1. MartinDH

    MartinDH Senior Member

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    Hi PR-folks...

    I don't know if it sounds ridiculous, but... I have a feeling that veggies and fruits make me worse. I feel better when eating junk food. Does that make any sense (I think it does not)??? Anyone with similar experiences?
     
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  2. Tammy

    Tammy Senior Member

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    When I started eating pretty clean I felt worse at first. My guess is that the body is getting the proper nutrition to be able to flush/clean out the crap and during the process of cleaning out all the crap it can make you feel worse.
     
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  3. MartinDH

    MartinDH Senior Member

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    I don't think so because before I got ill I ate much healthier than I do now (and had no problems with veggies and fruits)
     
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  4. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

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    Hey Martin- Fruits and veggies often have a lot of soluble fiber in them. Soluble fiber can feed bad bacteria in the gut, causing them to overgrow, causing more die off and worsening symptoms. Do you think it might be the soluble fiber?

    Jim
     
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  5. MartinDH

    MartinDH Senior Member

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    Hey Jim! I have already thought about that, yes. I think then with falling ill there might be a shift in the gut bacteria or SIBO...

    But what I have noticed in addition to the probs with digestion is that junk food gives me much more energy than healthy food. I think that's due to a lack of bacteria that metabolise carbs (the already mentioned switch)... and junk food is rich in starch that is absorbed in the small intestine... Does that make any sense?
     
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  6. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

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    That's my feeling as well.:)

    That does have a ring of truth to it. It could be that the high fat and protein content of the junk food is working with your mito's preference to burn fat and aminos (protein) instead of glucose. That's the switch of the CDR.

    The starches in the junk food I think are high glycemic and therefore absorbed very quickly in the small intestine and don't feed the bad bacteria very well. Is that basically what you are saying?

    Jim
     
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  7. MartinDH

    MartinDH Senior Member

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    Exactly. The problem is that after a while of eating junk food and avoiding fibres there will be a die off of the "good" bacteria in the gut... and that could lead to inflammation. And I would become a really fat guy :) double-edged sword...
     
  8. lnester7

    lnester7 Seven

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    Yes I do too. I have to take digestive enzymes for real food. Also, I developed a lot of food allergies / sensitivities with time on CFS. So I have to do organic and I could not do like juicing for example, I get Diarrhea. So I am introducing foods slowly and do not eat the same family every 4 days to see if you have problems (see rotation diet).
     
  9. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

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    You are exactly right, a low fiber diet long term will kill off good bacteria too. I went on a low starch, high fat, moderate protein diet and took anti-microbial herbs for 6-7 months just to lower the amount of bad bacteria before I added starches and soluble fibers back into my diet.

    So I didn't feed the bad bacteria with them. A few weeks ago, I started adding prebiotics (soluble fiber) back into my diet and I feel a big improvement from it. I don't know if that would have been the case before I did 6-7 months of diet and anti-microbial herbs to lower the bad bacteria in my gut.

    The "specific carbohydrate diet" is the diet I followed. Although, knowing what I know now, I would have added small amounts of white rice and white potatoes. To make the diet easier to stay on because they are very quickly absorbed into the bloodstream from the small intestine.

    Soluble fiber and prebitoics I think are the best way to increase good bacteria in the gut but timing could be very important to not feed the bad bacteria and worsen the problem.

    Jim
     
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  10. rebar

    rebar Senior Member

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    Gut Biome, the good the bad and the ugly. Different types of bacteria digest different foods. They compete for space by displacing contenders. Completely different groups digest big Macs from those that work on broccoli.
    When altering the biome by food choice negative symptoms can increase. This is what happen to me as I changed to a vegan diet. Two months later I've improved. You can follow and direct its course using Ubiome and referring to Ken Lassesen's site. As an example I was having a significant problem with depression, more like rapid onset of deep despair. I found out I was very high in groups associated with mood disorders, they relied on meat, thus the change to a plant based diet. Several of my ME/CFS symptoms have improved.
    PW/ME/CFS have remarkably similar biome profiles, Important groups associated with healthy people are nearly nonexistent, it's what takes their place/space that can influence our individual differences in symptoms.
     
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  11. Learner1

    Learner1 Professional Patient

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    Digestive enzymes are your friend. :hug:
     
  12. MartinDH

    MartinDH Senior Member

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    They stopped working.
     
  13. unicorn7

    unicorn7

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    Yes, I had this too. Fruit and vegetables were horrible. Vegetables are ok now (after a lot of treatment for SIBO and dysbiosis) and I can eat two pieces of fruit. More is apparently not even that healthy, lots of fructose.
     
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  14. Kenshin

    Kenshin

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    Yeah I seem to have more problems with fruit and veg, I think its the fibre, and with fruit the acidity and sugars.

    Junk food is more processed ie, crudeley pre digested... Also contains more calories per gram, so its denser energy.

    I find it best to eat healthy high caloric food, dairy and eggs etc if you tolerate them.
    Stuff like Pizza is healthy imo if made with natural/quality ingredients.
     
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  15. geraldt52

    geraldt52 Senior Member

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    That is exactly my experience, and it has only gotten worse over the course of 33 years. I mostly eat meat, rice, and potatoes, in all their many forms, and avoid wheat, eggs, milk, and sugar. Digestive enzymes, and probiotics make me horribly ill. I fought it and fought it, and now I just accept this limitation like the rest of them and live with it.
     
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  16. Matthew Jones

    Matthew Jones Senior Member

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    All I can say is if I cook steamed vegetables, which I do regularly, if I don't quite cook them enough so that they are still a little bit hard then I feel completely exhausted shortly after eating them, even during the meal itself. I have no idea why but it is very noticeable and has happened multiple times. I make sure I cook them until they are a bit squishy. Maybe that will help. Doesn't explain the fruit though!
     
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  17. TenuousGrip

    TenuousGrip Senior Member

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    Ever looked into Swedish Bitters ?
     
  18. Murph

    Murph :)

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    I'm like this. At one point I started eating salads for lunch every day. I don't love salads but I thought I was doing the right thing....

    it fucked me up badly. Not oly did my fatigue get worse but suddenly I couldn't stomach *any* fibre without problems.

    My theory is I have dybsiosis. It's like a field with some crops and some weeds. Fibre acts like a fertiliser, and the weeds grow faster than the crops. If I eat too much fibre we crowd out the good bacteria.

    edit: I have made good progress with a probiotic called ultrabiotic 60, which is high in rhamnosus. I now eat veg every day, although I'm careful not to eat too much...
     
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  19. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    @rebar have you had any luck in introducing the missing good bacteria and getting them to stay there?
     
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  20. MartinDH

    MartinDH Senior Member

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    Not yet. Did that help you?
     

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