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Has vitamin K-2 (mk-4 or mk7) helped you ?

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by Hanna, Apr 10, 2012.

  1. Vordhosbn

    Vordhosbn

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    Does anyone have any updates regarding the availability of Glakay online? I'm trying VRP Ultra K2, but it would be nice to compare the two.
     
  2. yukito

    yukito

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    Me2 I am interested about the glakay.
    I'm trying the peak k2 from AOR(mk-4,15mg) since one week(without the capsule), and found that it increases my need for calcium, usually I take 1g calcium ascorbate,so 100mg of elemental calcium. and with 15mg mk-4 I need like 150mg from my calcium ascorbate, the mk-4 demands too more potassium.
    If I don't give my body more calcium and potassium I begin having pain on all the body (mostly on chest and fingers),fatigue ,and having a feeling of sadness.
    I have simultaneously stopped my vitamin d supplementation since one week(I am planning to restart perhaps),after reading the thread on the bad side of the D3.
    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...nsensus-on-vitamin-d.20870/page-2#post-317624

    Has someone experienced some similar effects from the mk-4?
     
  3. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    Really?!!! I CANNOT GET OVER that you have to pay attention to brands. I mean not buying Walmart brands, sure, but I always thought K2 was K2 was K2 and that the main difference was nasty excipients vs. healthy ones. It just seems like way too much info to keep track of if you have to pay attention to manufacturer ESPECIALLY knowing they can change their formulation at any time! How depressing!

    I take NOW K2 and I never noticed a thing, BUT I doggedly take it anyway because K2 HAS BEEN PROVEN to be REQUIRED to get calcium into your bones and without it CALCIUM JUST LINES YOUR ARTERIES! Maybe I should just take natto.
     
  4. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    Really? Including Vitamin E? Specifically tendons or did you mean joints? I can't feel my tendons I don't think...
     
  5. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    I have looked at some of their sites and I fear you are right. It makes me shudder some of the things they talk about doing to their kids. Like giving them huge doses of niacin (just because THEY can tolerate it). I have ferocious allergies and just 100mg niacin makes me beet red and hurting like I have no skin for MOST of the day, and that was when I was young...now it also makes me numb (which says to me my liver can no longer handle it).
     
  6. Rand56

    Rand56 Senior Member

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    Ema

    My mom is on warfarin and when she started on it, her cardiologist wanted her to up her intake of vitamin K. His suggestion was just to eat more salad because he said lettuce has vitamin K in it. I don't believe he knows exactly how much K should be taken per the amount of warfarin anyone is on. I guess it is individual and that is why the INR is taken on each doctor visit to adjust accordingly the dosage of warfarin. Since it is a pain to try to get her to eat more salad, she just takes a supplement with vitamin K in it. Her INR readings do fluctuate on occasion but this can be expected, and when they have fluctuated, it has been minor. I know this is an old thread so this may have been discussed with your friend already, but just wanted to let you know that the cardiologist did actually require her to up her K intake.
     
  7. Rand56

    Rand56 Senior Member

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    I'm interested in trying to get this Glakay vitamin K product. Any word on what the deal is on Hemaxshop? Anyone try getting from allrealmeds that Ema suggested prior in this thread?
     
  8. Lotus97

    Lotus97 Senior Member

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    Most if not all vegetables have K1 and not K2 which is not as well absorbed as K2. At least that's what the supplement manufacturers tell me:cautious: This site has a list of foods high in vitamin K though.
    http://nutritiondata.self.com/foods-011104000000000000000-w.html?maxCount=266
    1 cup of green leaf lettuce (shredded) has around 62 mcg K1, 1 cup of romaine has 48 mcg, and 1 cup iceberg only has 17 mcg.
     
  9. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    I ended up buying a 15 mg K2 product off Amazon. It is by Complementary Prescriptions.
     
  10. Rand56

    Rand56 Senior Member

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    I have a question if anyone can answer for me, and I want to see if anyone else who started taking K2 mk-4 had similar symptoms than me starting out on it. About 5 or 6 days ago I started the mk-4, 15mg's per day. Prior to me starting this, for about 2 weeks I was taking the LEF Super K with advanced K2 complex which has 1mg of K1, 1 mg of mk-4, and 100mcg of mk-7. I stopped taking the LEF brand when I started the mk-4 15mg's per day. I have felt more sluggish and fatigued while taking this. Is this normal at first and maybe I am mobilizing too much calcium at once out of my tissues and arteries causing the extra fatigue? If so, is this something where it would be better to gradually build up on it by maybe only doing it 2 or 3 times per week, and titrate up from there? Just wanted to know if my reaction is typical and I could possibly be taking too much of it to start with? I'm also taking 4000 IU's of D3 per day.
     
  11. Asklipia

    Asklipia Senior Member

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    At first I was very sluggish, in a nice way, wanting deep sleep even in the day.
    I enjoyed that because I suspected it was a sign of nervous repair.

    However if it comes with a kind of hangover/bad liver feeling, better take 15 mg only a couple of times a week. Moving on to three times a week etc as you feel.
    D3 : I took that too (5000 IU or sometimes 10000 IU a day), but now I am not convinced at all it was a good idea, even though my levels were lowish-fine and stayed that way.

    I now would not supplement D3 but would try to sunbathe in some way, even with a tanning lamp.
    Nowadays I just take a couple of K2 15 mg a week and sunbathe twice a week minimum.
    K2 is supposed to deplete you of vitamin D, but it did not happen at all for me. Adding B2 though was extremely beneficial after a couple of years on K2, which make me think that K2 might have depleted B2.
     
  12. Rand56

    Rand56 Senior Member

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    Thanks Asklipia. I'll back off on it. I don't necessarily have a hangover or bad liver feeling from it, but I'll back off nonetheless. I'll work my way up on it.
     
  13. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    I am preparing to start taking Vitamin K2. It is NOW brand and says simply that it is “Vitamin K2 (as Menaquinone)”. It does not say whether it is MK-4 or MK-7. Since the dose is 100 mcg., I am assuming that it is MK-7.

    Asklipia, earlier in this thread you gave advice on taking K2. You are taking MK-4, so I am not sure whether that advice applied to just MK-4 or both forms of K2.

    Do I need to avoid taking vitamins C & E with the MK-7?
    Do I need to take vitamins A, D and B2, animal fat and manganese with MK-7?
    What is the Russian way of getting vitamin D from sun exposure?
    Is MK-7 likely to cause unpleasant reactions? Do I need to split the dose?

    Is “natural flavors” a fake folate?
     
  14. Asklipia

    Asklipia Senior Member

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    I have not taken MK-7. The NOW brand sells K2 as MK-7 in another supplement and yours is not labeled as MK-4 or Mk-7. It could well be something else. Unless you ask them, there is no way to know.

    I do not take vitamin E. If I did I would not take it at the same time as vitamin K.
    I do not know. I never took vitamin A. I do not take vitamin D, having found out it is best to take it from the sun. I do take animal fat and manganese but I am in no way able to tell you what you should do! I post here to inform others of what worked/did not work for me. I am sorry but I definitely cannot give you advice!
    When it is too cold, you stand bare chested in the sun against a wall in a wind- protected place.
    No idea, I never took it, having after some research decided it wasn't a good idea.

    YES
    Good luck and be well
    Asklipia
     
    Little Bluestem likes this.
  15. FunkOdyssey

    FunkOdyssey Senior Member

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    I think some of the adverse effects people experience on high doses of K are not a sign of healing but simply a side effect. There is no combination of natural food sources which could exceed 1-2mg of MK-4 daily. Why wouldn't pharmacological doses cause side effects?

    Here's the official list from Eisai in Japan, the manufacturers of Glakay:
    http://www.eisai.jp/medical/products/di/EPI/GLA_SC_EPI.pdf

    Adverse reactions were reported in 302 of 6,321 patients (4.78%). (at the end of the reexamination period)
    5% > ≥0.1% <0.1% Incidence unknown
    Gastrointestinal
    Stomach discomfort, abdominal pain, diarrhea, nausea, stomatitis, anorexia, dyspepsia and constipation
    Thirst, glossitis and vomiting
    Hypersensitivity
    Rash and pruritus Redness
    Psychoneurologic
    headache Dizziness, light-headedness and numbness
    Cardiovascular
    Increase in blood pressure and palpitations
    Hepatic
    Elevation of AST (GOT), ALT (GPT) and γ-GTP, etc.
    Urinary
    Elevation of BUN, etc. Urinary frequency
    Others
    Edema Eye abnormalities and arthralgia Malaise
     
    yukito, cph13 and Asklipia like this.
  16. Phil

    Phil

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    Hey, I cannot believe everyone seems to want to get the Glakay K2 product. I understand MK4 vs MK7 and I'm betting on MK4 at present, but Glakay - Nooooooooooooooo!
    Here's the ingredients that come with the Glakay K2:
    Source is a Glakay document: http://www.eisai.jp/medical/products/di/EPI/GLA_SC_EPI.pdf
    Composition
    Each soft orange capsule contains 15 mg of menatetrenone.
    It also contains L-aspartic acid, FD&C Yellow No.6 (Sun-set Yellow - FCF), carnauba wax, hydrogenated oil, tita-nium oxide, gelatin, D-sorbitol solution, concentrated glycerin, ethyl parahydroxybenzoate, propyl parahydroxy-benzoate, propylene glycol esters of fatty acid and glyceryl monooleate as inactive ingredients.
    That's about the worst lineup of "inactive ingredients" I've seen in a supplement ever.
    I've just ordered the Thorne K2, they are a company tries to minimize those "extra" ingredients.
     
  17. tamasaburo

    tamasaburo

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    I have had very strong, strange effects from both MK-7 and MK-4, which I'm struggling to understand. I first tried a tiny dose of MK-7 and it made me feel great, but hyper and unable to sleep. Then I switched to a tiny (I mean, like 10 mcg) dose of MK-4, and it had the same positive effects, but less excitability.

    Unfortunately, I noticed after taking it for about a week that my blood pressure (normally low-normal) was way up, I was having weird heart palpitations, and I was getting an increase in floaters and flashes in my eye. My heart checked out normal, but my eye turned out to have a retinal hole with fluid that had to be lasered, and I'm still worried about it. Though the doctors doubt it was anything I took, I totally suspect the MK for if not causing, then at least exacerbating the eye problem, because one of the positive effects I had previously noticed was a brightening of colors in addition to enhanced mood. I think it increased the pressure in my eye.

    Anyway, it's sad I can't take K2 because it seemed to have a lot of good effects on my mood and energy, but it also had these scary, dangerous side effects that can't be ignored and which I'm still recovering from, even at tiny, tiny doses (also makes no sense because I've eaten plenty of cheese, pepperoni, grass fed butter, and even, years ago, natto, with no remarkable effects). I wish I could understand what was going on with me and K2. Any ideas?

    Thanks so much.
     
  18. vortex

    vortex

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    I have been taking mk-4 for a couple of weeks, I really havent noticed much improvement, but have somewhat irregularly and have noticed that if I skip a day or dont take it frequently, I have a huge crash in energy. It is weird as it doesnt give me energy per se, but if I dont take it, I really crash. Not sure why, anybody have this experience ? I did notice the studies show that it boosts testosterone, perhaps my testosterone levels plummet if I stop taking it and that is why my energy crashes ??
     
  19. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    If you practice start low, go slow, the small improvements can be virtually unnoticible. It is more noticible when you stop.
     
  20. 24FMK4

    24FMK4

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    omg, people... I have searched a million pages and cannot for the life of me come close to figuring out what is the ideal ratio for K2 to D3. Virtually no one mentioned what ratios they took. all I know is someone here took 15mg MK-4 with 4000IU D3 and felt very fatigued. And someone else here says they took D3 5000-10000 (did not mention K2 amounts in that post) and inexplicably decided that sunlight is the only viable source of D for them. A lot of people mention a vague sense that one or the other increased the need for the other, but no numbers were given. Or numbers were always only given for one or the other, not for both.

    Please if anyone is still reading this, TELL ME HOW MUCH VITAMIN D YOU TOOK VS HOW MUCH K2.

    This is really important for me especially as I am borderline Vitamin D deficient and K2 nearly gave me a heart attack. In my experience, I have a hard time figuring it out as well... calcium ratio is also a factor, so it is complicated. Sometimes I think the K2 to D ratio is too low and sometimes I think too high. I am really confused. I have not had much if any success thus far. K2 seems to give me bad breath and grainy teeth, while D makes my teeth smooth. Surely it is in the ratios. Too much calcium causes a lot of negative symptoms, and I'm talking like 20% DV. That is because I ate too much gouda cheese trying to obtain K2. It is winter now so I cannot obtain D from the sun, so that info is useless until 5 months from now. A 100mcg MK-4 to 1000IU ratio seems possibly okay, but sometimes it made me feel terrible. It worked for some people, so PLEASE post ratios if it worked for you. Especially if you got your Vitamin D levels checked before and after.

    I started a new blog to help me figure out ratios: http://health-experiments.tumblr.com/post/69396240895/experiment-1-day-1-vitamin-k2-vitamin-d3-and

    Thanks. This is an interesting discussion!
     

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