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Has anyone been completely cured of CFS?

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1,446
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Phil Parker, as inventor of ‘The Phil Parker Lightning Process’ has created and taught other courses over the years.


In 2004 Mr Parker ran beginners holiday healing courses in Spain (20 hours over 5 days) through his European College of Holistic Medicine. Parker advertised those intro courses as "a powerful and magical program" and “A pathway to a new career”... and issued a certificate.
Phil Parker also claimed an ability to “step into other people’s bodies” to assess what was wrong with them.



Phil Parker’s ‘Healing course ‘Module’ 6 (2 hours) introduced the use of auras for diagnosis of a client’s problems.... astral bodies ….organs as metaphors …

In ‘module’ 8 (2 hours training) beginner healers were encouraged to explore their hapless clients past lives by using tarot/medicine cards to find out if their clients had been 'cursed' in a past life:




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http://www.healinghawk.com/prospectushealing.htm

http://web.archive.org/web/20070707050636/http://www.healinghawk.com/prospectushealing.htm



….“Phil Parker is already known to many as an inspirational teacher, therapist, healer and author. His personal healing journey began when, whilst working with his patients as an osteopath. He discovered that their bodies would suddenly tell him important bits of information about them and their past, which to his surprise turned out to be factually correct! He further developed this ability to step into other people’s bodies over the years to assist them in their healing with amazing results. After working as a healer for 20 years, Phil Parker has developed a powerful and magical program to help you unlock your natural healing abilities. If you feel drawn to these courses then you are probably ready to join.


As a child, Vicci Hands was extremely scared by hearing voices that no one else could; the fact that what these spirit voices said came true just made things worse. She was fortunate enough to come across a number of positive influences and mentors who helped understand how to harness her abilities for healing. As a result of her own experiences, she has a very down to earth approach to the subject. This, combined with her background in education, makes her a very powerful and approachable teacher’……..



……. Module 8 Using Divination.

‘This module looks at the use of divination medicine cards and tarot as a way of making predictions.


From a healing perspective, divination is useful in creating a strong connection with healing/spirit guides. It can also help you to understand the spiritual background of a client, which may be essential in helping with a problem.

If a client comes to you feeling they have been cursed, you may need additional information about their past lives in order to help them and this is where the use of tarot/medicine cards is beneficial.


Healing can also be a time of change and new beginnings- recognition of strengths, talents and a time to let go of the past. Divination can help with all these important areas.


In this module the anatomic section focuses on the digestion and urinary systems.


In the practical session for this module, the students are required to make predictions about their client, using tarot/medicine cards and then discuss the relevance of the cards they have picked and/or treat that client accordingly.”…..






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Wildcat wrote: In 20 hours on Phil Parker’s course he claims that the beginner healers would learn about spirit/healing guides, chakras, auras, dowsing, energy clearing, meridians, past lives, divination, medicine cards, tarot, meditation, creative visualisation.... and were encouraged to wander around clients past lives looking for possible 'curses'. Experienced healers were horrified at Parkers irresponsible Fast-Track intro to 'healing'.


Phil Parker also used a version of his "Are you ready?" selling line to 'hook' his healing course customers back to do/buy more courses...."If you feel drawn to these courses then you are probably ready to join".

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Re Module 8: People who do not believe in ‘curses’ consider teaching newbies to go looking for ‘curses’ as being deeply irresponsible. This is because it could be psychologically damaging to vulnerable people who can be attracted to such healing courses


People who do believe in ‘curses’ are quite clear that only highly trained experienced people (experienced occultists or official Church Exorcists) should undertake such work.


Either way, Mr Phil Parker’s 20 hour holiday ‘healing course’ would be classed as deeply irresponsible.





Selling a brief NLP coaching course (Lightning) for serious diseases (and denying responsibility for it not working, and denying responsibility for it causing relapses, by calling it 'a training') must be much, much more profitable than teaching the A to Z of healing lore to absolute beginners at breakneck speed.

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Mij

Messages
2,353
Thanks Peggy-Sue, your post is extremely good news for me. I have been diagnosed with CFS/ME, but from what I know about myself and from what you have just posted, I am now convinced that I have CFS and not ME. I will be looking into using the Lightning Process hopefully next month and will update the site as to how I get on. Thanks again

@Dster your post was written August 24, 2013

Could you update?

What has been your own personal experience?
 
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1,446
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Hi Dster, you wrote:

"..... And as for the old pea and thimble trick of subtly questioning the legality of Parker's behaviour to try and bolster one's position, it's risible, and wholly see through
Pathetic"

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Wildcat writes:
But Mr Parker's advertised claims for Lightning effectiveness for Medical conditions HAVE been found to be unlawful......
twice, by the UK Advertising Standards Authority (ASA).


This is the 2013 Decision by the ASA .....
http://asa.org.uk/Rulings/Adjudications/2013/3/Phil-Parker-Group-Ltd/SHP_ADJ_210374.aspx

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SOC

Senior Member
Messages
7,849
The difference is the level of bile and abuse that LP elicits - it's a couple of orders of magnitude greater than anything that any other potential remedy receives.
What I think I've learnt from my foray into this website is:
1. There are radical and liberal sufferers of CFS/ME
2. The radicals believe themselves to be special cases, and different from the run of the mill sufferers
3. They are generally closed off and in some cases extremely abusive to anyone promulgating a non biochemical
cure/treatment, especially LP, which seems to inhabit a special place in their hearts - only they know why
4. If anyone has been cured they never had it in the first place (circular argument or what - poetic)
5. The liberals are more open to non biochemical approaches, but are probably put off trying by the vociferous minority of radicals
6. Anyone visiting this site would be put off trying LP, for which I have personal, incontrovertible evidence that it works, albeit for NHS-diagnosed CFS/ME (rather than the higher form of CFS/ME which the radicals suffer from)
7. No one in the UK is qualified to diagnose this mysterious, higher form of CFS/ME
It's been an interesting journey into the human psyche for sure - ego and envy are evident, as in all walks of life

No, that is not what's happening, that is your interpretation of what's happening based on your own personal bias. The bias is yours, not ours. We are asking for factual scientific evidence, as we do with all supposed miracle cures, and you have refused to provide any whatsoever. You are simply asking us to accept your word and then vilifying us for not doing so.

If anyone coming to this site is put off trying LP, it's because there has been no factual scientific evidence to support its use, which is a good reason to be put off, imo.

I doubt this is a liberal/conservative issue.
 
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1,446
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Please read the full document re harm from Lightning Process, which Tom Kindlon has posted on another Phoenix thread just now. I can’t work out how to copy and paste his whole post.



http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...xceptional-disease-courses.27864/#post-424684



http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3833488/

‘The National Research Center in Complementary and Alternative Medicine (NAFKAM) International Registry of Exceptional Courses of Disease (the Registry) related to the use of complementary and alternative medicine (CAM) has to date received 5 reports of exceptionally “worst” courses of disease from patients who have attributed their negative health experience to the use of CAM. The monitoring of unfavorable outcomes related to CAM treatment is seen by NAFKAM as important to ensure that treatments offered are associated with low risk of harm. This is particularly important when the conditions patients suffer from are not life threatening.

If the Registry receives 3 negative reports of patients using the same treatment for the same condition, a “warning” is submitted to the health authorities. The same is done after only one report if the condition is life threatening.

Three of the 5 patients had been diagnosed with chronic fatigue syndrome/myalgic encephalomyelitis (CFS/ME), and all of them have related their unfavorable outcomes to the treatment method called Lightning Process (LP), a 3-day training program designed by British osteopath Phil Parker.1 They had all followed the recommendation given by the LP instructors during the treatment to ignore what they sensed as their bodies' symptoms of being pushed too hard. The patients had been diagnosed with CFS/ME 10, 2, and 7 years, respectively, before attending the LP treatment. Six to 12 months after the treatment, all 3 experienced a strong relapse of their CFS/ME symptoms. One patient expressed that “to follow the advice from the LP instructor eventually became a direct risk to my health.”…..

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Snow Leopard

Hibernating
Messages
5,902
Location
South Australia
Just a friendly warning since I am not really up for moderating this thread right now (much).

Please tone down certain aspects of this discussion, specifically questions about whether certain people do (or do not) have a diagnosis of CFS or ME.

At the same time, I suggest that it is probably not wise to debate second hand anecdotes about improvement or recovery. If you wish to state your personal experiences, then that is fine (and obviously this shouldn't lead to debate about whether those experiences are real or not).

Lastly, please refrain from accusing others of posting bile, or other insults. If there are particular inflammatory posts, then report them individually.

Thank you.
 

Snow Leopard

Hibernating
Messages
5,902
Location
South Australia
@Dster, we are all entitled to our opinions. On this forum, we are entitled to our opinions so long as we are not deliberately attacking or baiting others. Unfortunately there is a tendency to dig up comments made by people we don't like that puts those people in a bad light. A practise that I don't personally agree with, but it is something hard to control on the internet.

Many of us on this forum have tried all sorts of treatments and methods that we hoped would lead to improvement or recovery. Many of us are vocal about what did not work for us and are often sceptical about claims about treatments. The more bold the claim, the more sceptical we are. Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence. It might not be fully rational, but the more secretive the treatment, the more sceptical we often are. What do I mean by secretive? This includes a lack of data being published for example. Claims about supplements are often guilty of this for example.

Various supplements, diets etc don't work for most of us either, but if we are less sceptical of these, it is when a plausible and detailed scientific story can be told.

Many are also very sceptical about anecdotes in general. Personal experiences are one thing, but anecdotes are another. Second hand experiences are much less valuable than sharing our own personal experiences.

All I can say is perhaps rather than spending your energy debating and defending an anecdote, you could actually try the treatment you are defending.
 
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Messages
88
Location
Dutchy
Lastly, please refrain from accusing others of posting bile, or other insults. If there are particular inflammatory posts, then report them individually.

Thank you.

;)

question; if you found something (or rather my mother did from a book about ME) that seems to do the trick but that's imho too "out there" to just bluntly put on a message board, what would you do?
 
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MeSci

ME/CFS since 1995; activity level 6?
Messages
8,231
Location
Cornwall, UK
;)

question; if you found something (or rather my mother did from a book about ME) that seems to do the trick but that's imho too "out there" to just bluntly put on a message board, what would you do?

I don't think that anything is too 'out there' unless you are talking about something like 'therapeutic rape' or eating babies!

I did a quick Google search (don't usually use that monster but I needed translations) and it looks like the same kind of psychoquackery as CBT, Lightning Process et al., treating ME as a psychiatric condition. Which of course it is not.
 
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60
@Dster your post was written August 24, 2013

Could you update?

What has been your own personal experience?
I went on the lightning process at the end of January this year. Since then I have been going to the gym three times a week, playing golf once per week and doing HIIT at home 1-2 times a week. I have lost fat and gained muscle. I feel phenomenal. I go to the gym at 7, work out for an hour, shower and go to work. I can't believe it's me - LP has transformed my life - my energy levels are higher than when I was a student - I'm now 51 years old. If you have the money go do it - if you haven't, buy the books. I'm not an LP troll, just someone who has direct and indirect proof that the process works - as I've reported before a colleague did the process first and she was cured too
 
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60
I was never defending an anecdote - the woman in question was my direct report and I was closely involved in her day to day struggle with ME - equally I have been privileged to share in her cure and her utter joy at regaining her life - she was transformed and remains transformed by LP - I urge anyone reading this to give it a try
 

Raindrop

Senior Member
Messages
129
Location
USA
I went on the lightning process at the end of January this year. Since then I have been going to the gym three times a week, playing golf once per week and doing HIIT at home 1-2 times a week. I have lost fat and gained muscle. I feel phenomenal. I go to the gym at 7, work out for an hour, shower and go to work. I can't believe it's me - LP has transformed my life - my energy levels are higher than when I was a student - I'm now 51 years old. If you have the money go do it - if you haven't, buy the books. I'm not an LP troll, just someone who has direct and indirect proof that the process works - as I've reported before a colleague did the process first and she was cured too

Dster,
Fascinated! Can you tell me how long you were ill and what Illnesses you believe you have had.
Also severity level and level of functioning prior (maybe a brief description?) Have you always been working
even at your pre-"cure" stage? What is the cost and time commitment of the Lightening Process?
Many thanks and CONGRATULATIONS!!!!
 
Messages
88
Location
Dutchy
I was never defending an anecdote - the woman in question was my direct report and I was closely involved in her day to day struggle with ME - equally I have been privileged to share in her cure and her utter joy at regaining her life - she was transformed and remains transformed by LP - I urge anyone reading this to give it a try

I think the viruses responsible for this are so minor, yet with major effect due to their location (gut, brain), that all sorts of things could trigger a recovery. So good for both of you :hug:. But I also think there's a significant group that could actually get hurt by even trying it, if only financially.
 

Daffodil

Senior Member
Messages
5,875
could you and your friend have had major depression and not CFS? often, depression can manifest many of the same symptoms.

do you have any NK cell function tests?

how can emotion regulation be our problem? I sleep most of the day and barely feel emotion at all due to brain swelling.

thanks
 
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10,157
LP treats mental conditions, not physical conditions.

I would strongly caution people who are reading this thread NOT to put out one cent/penny to support Phil Parker's scam, quackery and cult-like pyramid scheme if you have ME because there is no way on God's green earth that standing on a piece of paper with an X on it and making affirmative statements about not 'doing' ME is going to cure you of ME in three days. There is absolutely no scientific evidence that this training program does anything for ME -- it might help with depression, anxiety, stress etc because it does rely on a form of CBT.

It's more than likely that those who say they have ME and then state a cure have either diagnosed themselves or been misdiagnosed. After all, I did read somewhere that up to 44% are misdiagnosed and have treatable conditions.

These LP practitioners have NO medical training.

I heard from someone, that posting positive material about LP after you have completed the training will earn you a bit of cash (can't confirm that though).

I, personally, think it's a crime that people are making money from offering bogus 'training programs' like these to people with serious physical illnesses.

http://www.ronsrealm.me.uk/lightningprocess.htm
The bottom line is that no genuine physical illness can ever be cured just by talking about it, or by changing the way one thinks about it. It is simply not possible. I believe the same holds true for those therapies that employ massage of various sorts to "cure" ME, too.

http://frownatsmile.wordpress.com/2011/01/06/patient-experiences-of-the-lighting-process-links/

http://liverpool-leftovers.blogspot.co.uk/2007/02/quacktitioners-and-quackometer.html

This is from the LP course material

This is the Stop technique from CBT - just one technique you learn for a fraction of the price of the LP.
(http://www.lightningprocesshelpedme.com/discussion/46/does-the-lightning-process-works/p1)

- Spot when you are having negative, anxious, or repetative thoughts
- Say STOP with hand gestures
- Say a mantra - for example if you had anxiety you say "I feel healthy and happy right now, and I
accomplished a lot today. It's a beautiful day, and I'm enjoying the
sunshine. I ran all my errands, did my laundry, and now I'm going to
enjoy curling up on the couch with my book."
- You do visualisations.

This is from my CBT course sheet - You need to start out consciously
practicing it every single time in the day that you find yourself using
pressuring or anxious self-talk. Every single time. You'll be doing it
hundreds of times a day at first, then the frequency will rapidly drop.

LP will not cure ME. LP trivializes our illness. It is an insult to all of us.

http://www.hfme.org/lightning.htm

These money-making scams are dangerous, and will never help genuine M.E. patients. Media reports of recovery of some individuals with this 'treatment' is dubious at best, but even where claims are genuine, these are NOT in any way M.E. patients. It is cruel and unhelpful to recommend or badger M.E. patients about trying such pseudo-treatments; please don't do it!

Thirteen year old attempts suicide after LP

Enough said.
 

ruben

Senior Member
Messages
282
I went on the lightning process at the end of January this year. Since then I have been going to the gym three times a week, playing golf once per week and doing HIIT at home 1-2 times a week. I have lost fat and gained muscle. I feel phenomenal. I go to the gym at 7, work out for an hour, shower and go to work. I can't believe it's me - LP has transformed my life - my energy levels are higher than when I was a student - I'm now 51 years old. If you have the money go do it - if you haven't, buy the books. I'm not an LP troll, just someone who has direct and indirect proof that the process works - as I've reported before a colleague did the process first and she was cured too
Dster, good to know you are still well, I have sent you a couple of queries by way of a conversation