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Hair Mineral Testing

Discussion in 'Alternative Therapies' started by Dog Person, Mar 10, 2012.

  1. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

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    I am very interesting to see hair test results of CFS diagnosed people. If anyone has done this testing, please list the lab that you had the testing done at, date and year, and the values for the minerals, calcium, magnesium, sodium, potassium, iron, copper, zinc, manganese, selenium, chromium, molybdenum, lithium and cobalt and the metals of lead, mercury, cadmium, arsenic, aluminum and nickel nickel. Please list the reference type such as mg% or mcg/g, etc.

    I would like to combine the results in a database to see if there is a strong correlation between people with this illness. Then I will let you know my observations.

    Thank you
     
  2. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    Lab: Trace Elements, Inc.
    Reference type: milligram percent (mg%). "<<" means below the calibration limit.

    - - - - - - - - - Apr10 - - - May11 - - - Dec11
    Calcium - - - - - 54 - - - - - - 37 - - - - - 34 > > supplementing at first test; stopped.
    Magnesium - - - 4.7 - - - - - 3.3 - - - - - 3.2 > > supplementing at first test; continued.
    Sodium - - - - - 5 - - - - - - 4 - - - - - - 6 > > began supplementing after first test.
    Potassium - - - << - - - - - - 1 - - - - - - 1 > > began supplementing after first test.
    Iron - - - - - - - 0.8 - - - - - 0.7 - - - - - 0.5
    Copper - - - - - 1.2 - - - - - 1.5 - - - - - 1.3 > > supplementing at first test; continued.
    Zinc - - - - - - 16 - - - - - - 16 - - - - - - 12 > > supplementing at first test; continued.
    Manganese - - .011 - - - - .007 - - - - - .016
    Selenium - - - - 0.09 - - - 0.09 - - - - - 0.08 > > supplementing at first test; continued.
    Chromium - - - 0.05 - - - - 0.03 - - - - - 0.04 > > began supplementing after second test.
    Molybdenum - - << - - - - .001 - - - - - .005 > > supplementing at first test; increased; decreased after third test.
    Lithium - - - - - .007 - - - .001 - - - - - .001
    Cobalt - - - - - - << - - - .001 - - - - - .001 > > supplementing methylB12 at first test; continued.
    Phosphorus - - 18 - - - - - 17 - - - - - - 16

    Lead - - - - - - 0.1 - - - - 0.1 - - - - - - 0.2
    Mercury - - - - 0.01 - - - 0.01 - - - - - 0.02
    Cadmium - - - .001 - - - - .001 - - - - - .005
    Arsenic - - - - .004 - - - .004 - - - - - .005
    Aluminum - - - 0.3 - - - - 0.3 - - - - - - 0.6
    Nickel - - - - - .01 - - - - .01 - - - - - - .01

    I inadvertently decreased my zinc and copper dose by half for at least one bottle between the second and third tests, which I think is the reason for the drop at the third test.
     
  3. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

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    This is very helpful! Now I have three to compare. I hope more of you will add your results for an even better correlation.
     
  4. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    Hi Dog :) , Ive been curious for a while if a deficiency of a trace element or something like that could make us susceptable to whatever ME/CFS is or be the underlaying original cause of our illness.. maybe we all have an unknown deficiency?.

    Our genes and polymorphisms could also play a part of all this (ME/CFS runs in my family) if it was deficiency making us susceptable to possibly something else which could be non harmful in other people (say something like XMRV or whatever).

    Good on you for collecting results as I see our future may lay in us arranging our own studies on things as maybe this is something we should be doing more of as individuals and as ME/CFS communities (as of cause we cant currently rely on governments putting any decent money into studying our illness!!). We can all work with one another to help gain clues in our illness.

    Below is a copy my hair analyses results (if the links dont work, let me know, I thought it was far better to include as one can then see the referance range as labs may have different ones depending on the sensitivity of equipemnt). Maybe their could be a biomarker in this or the ratios too or something.. nearly all of my ratios are extremely screwed up).

    Note.. i hadnt taken any mineral/vitamin supplements for many months before my test was done so that wasnt affecting my test results. Those posting results should probably also note if they were doing anything which may of affected them.

    ***Treatment I started based on my hair test results has certainly helped me a lot in brain function. I can now do maths in my head which I couldnt do at all before.. improvement was noticable after only 5 days of starting molybdenum supplementation (molyzinc) in regards to finding the molybdenum deficiency along with taking selenium to further lower the toxins.

    Ive spoken to several others with ME/CFS were found to have a molybdenum deficiency who also find correcting it to be helpful. From my past chats to others about my hair analyses results, is quite possible that this deficiency is more common in our illness??. My molybdenum was almost nil. Babies that are born with genetic fault in which they dont have molybdenum in their bodies all die!! One has to ask.. what was was having almost nil of that in my body doing to me?

    Also the lithium, my levels are so low there too that they dont show on the graph... quite a few at this site have had hair analsyes done and found deficiencies in that too, is that more common in us?. (Many with that issue were having mood issues in which dietary lithium supplementation can nearly immediately help).

    My copper was high. It is possible I may of had a little hair dye of the henna variety come into my test results thou when sending it back to lab they are supposed to allow for that as one does send back with ones hair what products one uses. I did thou try to get the new growth hair where the henna had grown out of it so didnt send any hair which had henna showing as being on it. (I dont know if henna in results could cause a high copper reading to appear or not)

    Hopefully many people will respond to your post (maybe people can photo copy their results so people can see the reference rangees etc but black out indentifying info if they are worried about others seeing it) and this all can be better analysed.

    I really wonder how 100 different ME/CFS peoples hair analyses would compare against a 100 people control group of the general population? Question to all.. Any way that a transparent study like this can be set up with open willing volunteers? (I say transparent as then its hard for anyone to dispute the findings). Maybe we ourselves would find a helpful biomarker to help back up illness and then push forward to the medical profession?

    The days of the way studies are currently now done, taking lots of funding and behind closed doors..... could be over with openness and the internet, where all can see. It IS possible for patient groups to be doing their own open to all studies. If people were willing.. we could as a patient group be leading the way with research and how its done.

    http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z458/taniaaust1/Hairanalyses1.jpg
    http://i1190.photobucket.com/albums/z458/taniaaust1/Hairanalyses2.jpg
     
  5. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

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    Tail 3.jpg Hi Taniaaust1,

    Thank you very much for the positive words. It can be good to be your own advocate. I learned this the hard way when my health was severely compromised by a medical professional that had no knowledge of nutrition! I wish I had researched his advice.

    In my opinion your high copper does not mean you have too much copper, it means you are not making enough of its carrier protein and/or binding it to the protein, thus you have circulating levels of unbound (free radical) copper in your bloodstream, which is observed in your hair. (Henna does not affect the hair test results) Normally, when I see copper elevated above the normal range it either means the person participates in aerobic exercise regularly and/or they eat a diet of high copper foods such as chocolate, potatoes, oysters, nuts, sunflower/pumpkin/squash seeds, tomatoes, lobster/calamari, legumes, dried herbs especially basil, marjoram, parsley and oregano. The high reading just accentuates that the body is having trouble binding copper in the liver.

    Molybdenum is a strong chelator of copper (removes from the body). Cattle can actually have copper deficiency when they graze on pasture grass that is high in molybdenum. Molybdenum also chelates calcium. Your chart indicates high calcium, meaning loss from the body and into the hair instead of being deposited into the bones. High calcium slows the energy producing system. Inadequate amounts of bound copper can lead to osteoporosis and joint pain because it is necessary to place your calcium into your bones with the help of magnesium and vitamin D. I believe you became low in molybdenum because it has been attempting to remove your excess, unbound copper. So by taking molybdenum you can continue to remove the free radical copper and lower the calcium and it makes you feel better. But in time, you may not have enough calcium to keep your bones strong and not enough copper to keep excess iron from over accumulating in your liver and body tissues. Best to address what is causing the unbound copper and loss of calcium in the first place but apparently when you received your hair test results, you did not have anyone to help you understand the chart based on nutritional factors.

    I have worked with many Bedlington Terriers. They are known as dogs that accumulate high levels of copper in their livers. Hair charts were preformed on these dogs before and after use of chealtors for copper. Molybdenum as well as penicillamine was tested. Prior to chelation, the hair tests have always shown elevated copper (just as your hair chart indicated) and many times elevated iron. After chelation, liver biopsies indicated stores of copper and iron were lowered. The retest charts showed very low copper, iron, manganese and calcium, but the charts still did not indicate adequate binding of copper, iron and/or manganese. So the question that presented itself was why were they re-accumulating copper and iron in the liver once off of the chelator and circulating unbound copper and iron again, as seen elevating on the hair charts. Another question was why are liver biopsies indicating elevation of copper in every breed of dog that is tested, not just Bedlington Terriers? And last, why did some dogs that were biopsied with very high levels of copper, exhibit no adverse symptoms. The answer that I sought appeared to have a commonality between human and dogs since the charts were uncannily similar. So I searched for what would both be exposed to which could create such a similar imbalance.

    In the photos above and below, you can see two dog tails. I call this the tale of the tails. The color change from dark brown to orange indicates inability of the body to adequately bind copper and iron, with which the body uses to color the fur. Bound copper allows the body to use iron. Copper gives a Vizsla dog its orange color. Combination of copper, iron and manganese give various shades of brown coloration. Iron and manganese create black. As the dogs ability to bind copper lowers, which lowers their ability to adequately bind and place iron into the fur, you see the color lightens revealing the higher copper with less iron and manganese. My experience indicates extremities of the body normally show the imbalance first, because the body allocates minerals to life critical processes first and coloring the tail is not a life critical function.

    Two important questions: I believe your wheat products are enriched in Australia with iron, niacin, folic acid, etc. Is this true?

    Is your milk enriched with vitamins A & D?
     

    Attached Files:

  6. richvank

    richvank Senior Member

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    Hi, dog person.

    I'm wondering if you are familiar with these two books:

    Nutritional Balancing and Hair Mineral Analysis, by Lawrence Wilson, M.D.

    and

    Hair Test Interpretation: Finding Hidden Toxicities, by Andrew Hall Cutler, Ph.D., P.E.

    If so, I would like to know what you think about them, and whether or not you agree with the approaches described in them.

    Best regards,

    Rich
     
  7. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    Hi Taniaaust1,

    It is interesting to see the scans of your results. My brain fog, low energy, and low tech ability decree that I am going to stick with typing them in. My ratios are extremely screwed up too, but not quite the same as yours.
    Ca/P: low normal
    Na/K: off-the-chart high (because the K is so low)
    Ca/K: off-the-chart high (because the K is so low)
    Zn/Cu: normal
    Na/Mg: low
    Ca/Mg: high normal (for the first time. It was high before)
    Fe/Cu: low normal (and falling)

    My problem is that my dietitian does not know anything about ME/CFS. Despite the fact that my cobalt is barely detectable, she does not want me to increase my cobalamin because it will lower my already low, and not increasing despite supplementation, potassium.

    Shortly after I had my most recent hair mineral analysis, I saw my physician and had her test blood potassium. It is low normal. Moving K from the blood to the cells requires energy that I do not currently have. Taking the B12 might increase my energy level, which might in turn get more K into the cells. It will take K from the blood, which currently isnt getting into the cells anyway. I have increased my methylB12 and have adeneslyB12 and methylfolate on order. I am also taking plenty of K and am considering ordering a potassium saliva meter. The way I see it, the tissue K will not come up until I resolve/reduce the ME/CFS and the ME/CFS will not resolve until I take cobalamins.

    I tend to think these mineral imbalances may be results, rather than causes, of the ME/CFS. (I have no medical background on which this is based.) Even if that is so, if a fairly consistent set of mineral imbalances can be found in ME/CFS patients, it might shed some light on its cause(s) and remedy(s). For instance, my fairly normal blood K and very low tissue K is better explained by mitochondrial dysfunction than immune system disregulation.

    I hope more people join us. I think this could be useful.

    Little Bluestem
     
  8. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

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    Just want to clarify a couple of things about hair testing. It is not the same as a blood test. Hair is considered a soft tissue of the body, thus it reflects what is happening in the soft tissues (cells) of the body. It is also 1,000 times more sensitve for detecting minerals than a blood test would be. Also, most heavy metals leave the bloodstream within 24 hours so a hair test is the best place to observe elevation of heavy metals if they are present. The potassium is reflective of the potassium inside the cells where the mitochondria are that produce energy (ATP). The sodium reflects the concentration outside of the cells. Sodium is to be 2.5 times greater than the potassium inside the cells for the proper pressure gradient to pump nutrients into the cells and then out again. The adrenals are what regulate the sodium and potassium levels as they are what signal the kidneys to either retain or remove these nutrients based on the level of stress to the body at the time.

    The other thing that is VERY important is that the minerals on a hair chart are NEVER to be read/interpreted as individual levels. They must be interpreted by someone that understands their interactions. You can not bring a level up of a mineral just by taking it. The reason it is low is due to so many factors that must be observed by every other mineral and metal and ion on the hair chart. If it were this simple to just take a mineral to correct it's deficiency, then there would not be a need for interpretation. Also, hair testing would be considered fantastic to use to correct imbalances, but so far, they have not been well received. Their complexity evades most people's knowledge, thus they think the charts are of little value.

    I value them greatly and have seen removal of the heavy metals without using chelators. Heavy metals are normally only present because you are not using your own minerals adequately and the heavy metals are brought into the body as a substitute for enzyme reactions. They do not substitute well, thus you do not function well, but you do not die instantly from poor usage of your minerals. This is why I am so very anxious to see more of the CSF charts, because I do believe I can make an educated theory as to the imbalance causing the lack of energy production.
     
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  9. xrunner

    xrunner Senior Member

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    Surrey
    My personal experience with hair testing isn't positive. I have very high intracellular sodium and very low chromium (from blood tests, whole blood, plasma and intracellular) but they showed up as low and low normal in my hair...

    Here's a video I just saw with an alternative view by Dr Klinghardt of high copper in hair mineral testing.
    He says high copper in hair can be a sign of the body fighting infections.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fCdtAl8hvhg&feature=related
     
  10. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Heavy metals have been a major problem for me. My nervous system is much too sensitive to handle chelators, so I am curious to know more about their removal without chelators. Arsenic and uranium have showed up in my hair, along with lead. Thallium has showed up in fecal metals testing.

    Here's 2 tests I had with Trace Elements Lab back in 2007 and 2008. This was before my big relapse in 2009, so I imagine that my tests might be worse now than before.

    I have attempted to get more supplemental zinc to replace the VERY HIGH COPPER, but this has been a challenge, to say the least.

    HAIR MINERAL TEST.jpg
     
  11. Adster

    Adster Senior Member

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    Here's a couple from a few years back from me:

    hma2p2.jpg hma2p1.jpg hma1p2.jpg hma1p1.jpg
     
  12. baccarat

    baccarat Senior Member

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    As you have not explained it, and I noticed you just joined, it's not clear on what basis you're doing that.
    I hope this is not one of those low key, introductory pitches, leading later to something you're going to sell (I've seen a few of those over the years).

    As for hair testing is concerned, I had a few and never anything abnormal ever came up, yet although not too bad, I'm far from being completely recovered. They don't tell anything particular in my case. But I have had slightly elevated lead showing up following a heavy metals challenge test. I'm deeply skeptical about such tests.
     
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  13. baccarat

    baccarat Senior Member

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    I used to have strong reactions to zinc. My doctor at the time said I needed to supplement to support my immune system although I wasn't deficient.
    In the end I gave up. I try to get my minerals from wholesome foods and infusions.
     
  14. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

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    Has our world gotten so bad that we only think the worst of people first?

    My company is only me. I only charge enough to cover business costs, but do not make a profit. What I do I believe is a gift to me from God and I am to pass it on. I do not sell anything.

    I've spent many hours of my time working on the charts that have been offered. The correlations are going very well. Elevation of lead is a common denominator - which means that people are not forming RBC's with iron and hemoglobin, intead they are using zinc with lead - called a protoporphryn. It carries oxygen, but not nearly as efficiently as iron in a prophryn heme ring.

    baccarat - you mention your have a few hair tests but did not offer them to add to the data base?
     
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  15. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Hey Dog Person--

    I think it would be helpful for you to keep in mind that ME is a complex debilitating neuro-immune disease. Many of us here have been ill with it for many years, some of us for decades. A great number (perhaps a majority) of us have been around the block hundreds of times with theories, remedies and treatments that have gone nowhere, and done nothing to improve our health.

    Though you may be sincere in your efforts, after what we've been through, we most certainly have every right to be skeptical, and to question your motives and intentions. If we didn't, then that would be rather dishonest, or just very naive.
     
  16. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    I wont question anyone unless I see them actually doing something which is suspecious... eg telling people to go and buy a certain brand after hearing results would be a suspecious act. Ive seen none of this so far, just someone who obviously paid a lot of attention to my chart and gave their own analyses of it which would of taken up time and energy to do.

    Thank you dogperson.

    For some added info.. thou my toxic elements were under the reference range. I do have explainations of why some of those are showing for me. My mercury level maybe is cause when I was a child a broke a therometer and played with the mercury for a while? (I was a very curious child and did that thou Id been told not to). I always wondered if I took in mercury from doing that.. note I have no teeth fillings with mercury in them.

    The lead showing may be cause my father was a spray painter/panel beater.. and I used to often help him in his shed without a face mask when he was spraying paints (many of those paints would of had lead in them).

    I dont know where cadmium comes from, I got to look that up sometime.. (I do know paints have many toxic things in them thou). The aluminum, I always up until recently all my life have used aluminum fry pans etc.
     
  17. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    Im not sure even recommending particular brands is cause for concern. Brands do get recommended on this board. Two prominent member I can think of who do so are Freddd and Rich VanK.

    I, too, appreciate the time that Dog Person spent analyzing my charts, explaining the reasons for her concern, and making recommendation based on her analysis. What she said made a lot of sense to me and I am more hopeful than I have been in a while.

    Some of us have been communicating with Dog Person via PM and Members Only Chat. I think as she become better known to the board members in general, any concerns about her legitimacy will be allayed.
     
  18. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

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    Than kyou for that, I didnt know all that. I did get a quite good 9 page report on top of getting the test results from the place which did the hair testing. Its on what symptoms the abnormal things I have can cause and what could improve them in regards to diet advice, what to avoid etc based on my results but it didnt tell all that copper stuff about carrier proteins.

    Yes Im aware that my molybdenum deficiency may of caused my copper to go up. Hence one of the reasons I was so interested in seeing others charts. The others have high copper too but dont have the issue with molybdenum.

    As far as copper containing foods, I do like my chocolate.. used to buy a block a week. I also do eat more nuts then most people do.

    On blood tests they said I have no iron stores by the result of that thing which carries iron but actually do have good blood iron levels.

    What is written in my hair analyses report may explain that too "low iron/copper ratio - High copper relative to iron can be antagonistic to many functions of iron metabolism, and can often contribute to iron-deficiency anemia. Copper in excess will interfere with iron absorption and decrese the utilzation of iron by the body. "

    So maybe my copper is what causes me to have no iron stores?

    My calicum thou its the second highest thing on my essential element graph, it is within referance range so I havent viewed that as being high thou it is causing imbalance to some things in the ratios. In the past (before I read a heap of stuff about calicum building up in the cells of ME/CFS people), I used to take calicum for my severe PMS and it actually helped that .. so something about it helped me.
    Ive had a severe D3 deficiency thou my D2 is fine.

    sorry Im completely lost by that point and cant work get my head around where iron fits with all this.. By blood tests, they said I have no iron stores but a good blood level of it showing on the common iron test.

    What conclusion did you come to about why the dogs were re-accumulating copper? With what should they or we be treated?

    Due to having a severe issue with insulin (hyperinsulinemia which was causing me to have major symptoms). My carbs had been severely resistricted for 3-4 months (maybe longer) before I had that hair analyses done.. eg no breads or cereals were being eatten so they werent being a factor.

    My milk also was being restricted a bit for a couple of those months before that test to about 300g per day. The milk I drink is not usually enriched in anyway.. but the small amount I was having at the time when I was having to restrict was at times. When I went back to normal drinking of milk thou I was having milk which wasnt enriched.
     
  19. baccarat

    baccarat Senior Member

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    If you think I believe a word of what you say, you're mistaken. If you were moved by charitable purposes, you'd have been a bit more transparent as to who you really are, what your company does etc. That's in really stark contrast to the open and transparent way others (like Rich, Fred, Annesse etc. to name few) who are genuinely interested in helping people around here, instead operate.

    You give the impression of gathering data on the cheap to develop a product which you're going to nicely package and sell afterwards. Also, I'm not sure where your interest in CFS come from but your superficial understanding of the nature of this illness leads me to believe that you look at it as a potential market for your services rather than an area of genuine personal interest. I wouldn't be surprised if were doing the same in other areas/markets besides CFS.

    It's the lack of transparency in your whole modus operandi and style that I find questionable.

    As for my tests, I'm certainly not going to share any with anonymous people, not too mention the fact that some of the things you said sound to me a bit dodgy and I prefer to rely on health professionals I know for sure have expertise in the area.
     
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  20. Hanna

    Hanna Senior Member

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    Jerusalem, Israel
    Hi Dog Person,
    I very much appreciate your interest and the time you're spending to look for some correlations in our hair test results.
    Here are mine, from doctor's data - oct 2011.
    TOXIC METALS:
    Aluminun : 3.4 (ref<7.0)
    Antimony 0.017 (ref <0.050)
    Arsenic 0.054 (ref<0.060)
    Barium 0.32 (ref<2.0)
    Beryllium <0.01 (ref<0.020)
    Bismuth 0.030 (ref<2.0)
    Cadmium 0.040 (ref<0.050)
    LEAD 3.9 (ref<0.60)
    MERCURY 1.2 (ref<0.80)
    Platinum <0.003 (ref<0.005)
    Thallium 0.001 (ref<0.002)
    Thorium <0.001 (ref<0.002)
    URANIUM 0.75 (ref<0.060)
    Nickel 0.05 (ref<0.30)
    Silver 0.01 (ref<0.15)
    Tin 0.06 (ref<0.30)
    Titanium 0.32 (ref<0.70)
    TOTAL TOXIC REPRESENTATION >95th percentile

    ESSENTIAL AND OTHER ELEMENTS :
    Calcium 261 (ref 300-1200)
    Magnesium 17 (ref 35-120)
    Sodium 70 (ref 20-250)
    Potassium 67 (ref 8-75)
    Copper 6.9 (ref 11-37)
    Zinc 200 (ref 140-220)
    Manganese 0.07 (ref 0.08-0.60)
    Chromium 0.42 (ref 0.40-0.65)
    Vanadium 0.056 (ref 0.018-0.065)
    Molybdenum 0.077 (ref 0.020-0.050)
    Boron 4.9 (ref 0.25-1.5)
    Iodine 0.34 (ref 0.25-1.8)
    LITHIUM <0.004 (ref 0.007-0.020)
    Phosphorus 143 (ref ref 150-220)
    Selenium 1.0 (ref 0.55-1.1)
    Strontium 1.1 (ref 0.50-7.6)
    Sulfur 45200 (ref 44000-50000)
    Cobalt 0.006 (ref 0.005-0.040)
    Iron 6.0 (ref 7.0-16.0)
    Germanium 0.027 9ref 0.030-0.040)
    Rubidium 0.14 (ref 0.007-0.096)
    Zirconium 0.031 (ref 0.020-0.42)

    RATIOS:
    Ca/Mg 15.4 (range 4-30)
    Ca/Po 1.83 (range 1-12)
    Na/K 1.04 (range 0.5-10)
    Zn/Cu 29 (range 4-20)
    Zn/Cd > 999 (range >800)

    Thank you very much for your help,
    Best,
    Hanna
     

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