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Gulf War Illness Research

Discussion in 'Latest ME/CFS Research' started by Frickly, Mar 3, 2010.

  1. Frickly

    Frickly Senior Member

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    I wonder if this research could also help those with CFS?

    "What Dr. Watkins suspects, based on her research on microglia in chronic pain, is that an initial exposure to some toxin "primes" the microglia in the brain to make them hyper alert. Then when a second infection, injury, or toxin is experienced, the brain's immune cells over-react, releasing too much of the chemical signals that cause the "sickness response", and they do not stop releasing the substances after the body heals. In the case of Gulf War veterans, the "initial trigger" could have been a reaction to an immunization, stress, or exposure to low-level toxins. Later a second insult to the body unleashes a run-away illness. Research from several labs on microglia in chronic pain has identified many steps in this neuro-immune signaling process that become disrupted and researchers have found specific drugs to restore the normal function of these pain circuits, thus ending the chronic pain. Most of this work is in laboratory animals but clinical studies are now under way."

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-douglas-fields/new-suspect-in-gulf-war-s_b_483875.html
     
  2. kurt

    kurt Senior Member

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    Thanks Frickly! For a quick look, here is the entire article.
    I wonder if this might be related to Dr Light's research showing elevated fatigue and pain receptors after exertion?

     
  3. PoetInSF

    PoetInSF Senior Member

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    It could, but the damaged microglia theory of CFS has been around before. Somebody will have to come up with a way to test and prove the hypothesis. Till then, it's just a theory along with a dozen others. My problem with microglia theory is that it does not explain dysautonomia and sex disparity in CFS population.
     
  4. kurt

    kurt Senior Member

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    This is new evidence, so probably some researcher will go back now and revisit the micoglia theory in a CFS context.

    Just thinking about this, if microglia infection by something like HHV6 leads to a downstream depletion of glutathione, that might explain the gender differences given the higher hormone involvement (which must all be detoxified eventually by glutathione). And dysautonomia, hmm, maybe that depends on how/whether the infected microglia connect to the hypothalamus.

    Microglia infection really is interesting since it can possibly explain the diverse sensory hyper-sensitivity in CFS. Also, if damaged microglia create an auto-stress situation, by the hypothesized secondary infection mentioned in that article, that would support the adrenal looping/depletion theory, which then creates all the other depletions we have in CFS.
     
  5. JPV

    JPV Senior Member

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    It always seems to come back to Mercury poisioning... doesn't it?

     
  6. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    are there no postmortem studies? one was done in autism showing chronic microgliosis, persistant throughout lifespan. http://www.neuro.jhmi.edu/neuroimmunopath/autism.htm
     
  7. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    JPV, Blaylock is missing one huge aspect here, that of chronic infections being capable of inducing the same thing...
     
  8. JillBohr

    JillBohr Senior Member

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    Thank you for posting this Frickly! I want to mention that when I lived in Germany, there was a documentary on American Soldiers during the 2nd gulf war (I think it was in 2005). I wish I could find this on the internet and for the life of me, I can not remember the title. It was in German. Anyway, they showed a veteran that was damaged by vaccines he had to take before he went to serve. Please keep in mind that I am not one of those anti-vaccine people that shout and rage that vaccines do nothing but harm but I do think there may be a problem when given too many vaccines or in some cases, some people may have a genetic predisposition or some other environmental insult that sets their immune system over the top when given vaccines.

    Another thing I want to mention, my father died of a glioblastoma (GLIAL CELLS) brain tumour in 1996. It was also during this time period that my sister-in-law and aunt came down with ME/CFS. My two children were born in 1998 and 2000 and have autism. Although my sister-in-law is not genetically related to me, I do wonder if XMRV plays havoc on people with a certain genetic predispostion. I also want to mention that my uncle's wife was also diagnosed with MS in 1996 and died in 2008.
     
  9. richvank

    richvank Senior Member

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    Hi, all.

    I suspect that Gulf War Illness and CFS share glutathione depletion and a partial methylation cycle block. I attended two meetings of this committee in Washington, D.C. several years ago, and spoke to them as well as writing to them about this many times. I wasn't able to convince them. Also, I don't think this committee has the power to influence what the VA does. They can only give advice.

    I also tried to convince some people who have GWI to try this approach, via one of the veterans' internet groups. I didn't have much luck there, either. Most of them seem to be waiting for the VA to do something for them, rather than being willing to try things themselves.

    I really did want to help the veterans, being a Vietnam veteran myself, but just wasn't able to get very far. I may try writing to the committee again.

    The mix of stressors that brought about the glutathione depletion initially was probably different in most GWI cases froim the stressors in most CFS cases, probably including the vaccinations and the chemical toxins to which the troops were exposed, as well as the stress of war.

    It's true that the oligodendrocytes (one type of glial cell) form the myelin that serves as insulation around the nerve axons in the brain. I think that the link here is that methylation is required to make phosphatidyl choline from phosphatidyl ethanolamine, and it is also required to make myelin basic protein. Both are essential components of myelin. Without sufficient methylation capacity, the myelin probably degrades over time and is not properly repaired and maintained. The evidence for myelin problems in CFS is the observed low processing speed in the brain. The speed of transport of nerve impulses depends very much on the condition of the myelin.

    Best regards,

    Rich
     
  10. kurt

    kurt Senior Member

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    Rich, do you have a copy of any of your writing about this topic? How the glial cell problems might connect to CFS? Or maybe what you sent to that committe? I would love to read that.

    Also, the idea of low processing speed being due to leakage, that is interesting. So we might have a short-circuit type problem. But one obvious problem with that idea is that some people do go into remission rapidly, and also the brain fog seems to wax and wane. Not what one would expect with permanent damage like that, or damage that is very slow to repair. Maybe the glial cell problems are yet another subset issue.
     
  11. Cort

    Cort Phoenix Rising Founder

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    Immune Brain Cells the Main Problem in GWS (and CFS) (?)

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-douglas-fields/new-suspect-in-gulf-war-s_b_483875.html

    Researchers have found it hard to dig into the immune cells in the brain but this researcher thinks they play a key role in the
    problems in GWS (and therefore CFS). GWS should be such a boon to us and I'm surprised we haven't followed it more closely. Dr. Klimas says its the same thing. Thistheory even incorporates the two-hit phennomena as well as hyper sensitization - and its all centered on immune cells in the brain - the micro-glia.



    So encouraging for us....
     
  12. raul

    raul

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    glia, new culprits in chronic pain

    I found this article

    http://www.rsds.org/2/library/article_archive/pop/Fields_ScientificAmerican.pdf

    published in Scientific American really interesting. There is even a box on the last page with a list of drugs that are being investigated.

    Scientific American 301, 50 - 57 (2009) doi:10.1038/scientificamerican1109-50

    New Culprits in Chronic Pain.
    R. Douglas Fields

    KEY CONCEPTS

    * Chronic pain that persists after an injury heals is often caused by overly excited pain-sensing neurons that signal without an external stimulus.
    * Traditional pain drugs that target neural cells directly rarely quiet these abnormal pain messages because the neurons' heightened sensitivity is driven by a different type of cell called glia.
    * Such cells monitor the activity of neurons and attempt to keep them healthy and functioning efficiently. But well-intentioned glial reactions to intense pain can at times prolong that pain.
     
  13. spindrift

    spindrift Plays With Voodoo Dollies

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  14. Jenny

    Jenny Senior Member

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    Thanks raul - this is a very interesting article.

    Interesting too that one of the drugs that has potention is minocycline. Some people do find that one of the tetracyline family of drugs help.

    Jenny
     
  15. Gerwyn

    Gerwyn Guest


    yes i agree especially the role of creb co factors
     
  16. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    both microgliosis and CREB involvement also fit with this theory

    Abstract
    Many symptoms of chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS), including severity of fatigue, may be periodic, fluctuant and induced by physical and mental activities, including trauma and stress. The fatigue in CFS is distinct from the fatigue of neuromuscular disorders but is similar to that found in disorders of the central nervous system such as multiple sclerosis, Parkinson's disease and multiple system atrophy. Though fatigue is a common symptom of depressive disorders, it is now clear that CFS patients differ from patients with major depression in their symptoms, biologic markers such as steroid metabolism and response to standard antidepressant drug therapy. In this paper, we propose dysfunctional ion channels in the cell membranes as the key abnormality in CFS which may also be responsible for the altered neuroendocrine functions reported in this condition. In our hypothesis, changes in the neuronal ion channel function from time to time offers a rational basis to explain fluctuating fatigue and related symptoms in CFS. Finally, ion channel abnormality leading to selective neuronal instability may be the common disease mechanism in CFS and other paroxysmal disorders affecting brain functions such as migraine and epilepsy. Copyright 1999 John Wiley & Sons, Ltd. http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/40002006/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0


    (btw this is what I have been pointing as being THE pathological mechanism in autism ... http://www.autismcalciumchannelopathy.com/index.html)
     
  17. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    forgot the title for the above:

    Chronic fatigue syndrome is an acquired neurological channelopathy
    Abhijit Chaudhuri *, Peter O. Behan
    University Department of Neurology, Institute of Neurological Sciences, Southern General Hospital, 1345 Govan Road, Glasgow G51 4TF, UK
     
  18. Hysterical Woman

    Hysterical Woman Senior Member

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    Hi All,

    Yes, maybe start a forum on GWS, or just a long running robust thread on this forum about the similarities. I am particularly interested since I became ill while working at a hazardous waste disposal facility. Unfortunately, I suspect I might have been exposed to some of the same toxic chemicals to which military people have been exposed. Yuck.

    HW
     
  19. flybro

    flybro Senior Member

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    Don't know if this helps anyone but I'll share anyway.

    My x-hubby had all his jabs ready to go the 1st Gulf War back in 1990 and got called back as he just has he was getting on the plane, so he didn't go.

    His health has been OK, but he never was a full of beans type guy.

    He recently age 50 had to have an operation for svt, they they found a birth defect while doing the op, however he had had no heart problems previously.

    A question for anyone else reading this thred.....

    Do you know of service personal and their families that have had their medical reords thinned out before leaving the military.

    As this is the case for mine and x's-records. Also my mother and father discovered their records were susbstaialy thinned out aswell.
     
  20. Frickly

    Frickly Senior Member

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    There is another thread on this article under "Other Health News". Could we combine the two?

    Thanks
     

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