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For those interested in E.coli Nissle

Discussion in 'Gastrointestinal and Urinary' started by donovank730, Mar 25, 2014.

  1. donovank730

    donovank730

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    I am purchasing a small amount of E. coli nissle and I will be culturing it so I don't have to keep purchasing it from oversea's at highly inflated prices. If anyone has interest in where they might find some within the United States please pm me, I would love to help with some information.
     
  2. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    Would love to hear how to culture it as I hope to do so when my supply runs out.
     
  3. donovank730

    donovank730

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    look into Lb broth its really quite simple, e.coli is also resistant to freezing so you can freeze the broth for some time when you get sick of culturing it
     
    Little Bluestem likes this.
  4. donovank730

    donovank730

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    have you benefited at all from it?
     
  5. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    Yes. Last time I took it my MCS was better. What is Lb broth?
     
  6. donovank730

    donovank730

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    your best bet is to google it and then check ebay for a supply of it, its all pretty simple
     
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  7. snowathlete

    snowathlete

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    Dr Myhill has a page on her wiki about how to culture it:
    http://www.drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/Growing_Mutaflor
    I just bought some and will be trying it sometime. I am taking it as part of my attempt to improve the state of my gut flora. It's been studied in ulcerative colitis which I have so I'm hoping it helps with that too.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2014
    donovank730 likes this.
  8. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    What about this:

    Growth of E. coli usually stops, even in the presence of the large total concentration of organic nutrients in LB broth, when the OD600 reaches around 2, corresponding to about 0.6 mg of E. coli (dry weight) per ml. The reason is not difficult to find: LB medium provides only a scant amount of carbohydrates, and surprisingly small amounts of other utilizable carbon sources. Tryptone and yeast extract are mostly composed of peptides of varying length. In their definitive 1968 study of Bacto Neopeptone using gel filtration, Payne and Gilvarg found that there was a clear size limit for the usable peptides at about 650 daltons—which corresponds to the exclusion limit of porin channels determined several years later. The smaller, usable peptides were a minority, perhaps a quarter of the entire mixture. Free amino acids were an even smaller minority, approximately 1% or less of the entire preparation. If we assume a similar size distribution for the peptides in tryptone and yeast extract, we can postulate that the yield of E. coli is limited primarily by the available carbon sources.

    from

    http://schaechter.asmblog.org/schaechter/2009/11/the-limitations-of-lb-medium.html
     
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  9. donovank730

    donovank730

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    .6 mg per ml is still alot of bacteria. I am sure I could do the math on that if I really wanted but if you drink a sizable portion of the broth(1/2 cup or so) you will get billions or trillions of the bacteria. you could easily add sugar to the mixture for added carbohydrates. In any case the both is still a good medium for e. coli growth
     
  10. aaron_c

    aaron_c Senior Member

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    @ Brenda: Wow, that blog is...rich with information.

    My understanding of what they were saying was:

    LB Broth may not be a perfect growth medium for E. coli. As with pretty much any growth medium, what this means is that E. coli will grow "normally" until it runs out of the necessary and preferred nutrients. Like humans, when runs out of necessary nutrients (they discussed magnesium) it will continue to grow for a while, but it will not be as healthy. Also, when it runs out of the nutrients it prefers (they suggested that it might prefer to use some amino acids over others) it will use other ones that it does not like as much. Again, this will probably effect its growth.

    This is seen with E. coli in the pattern of growth, where it reproduces quickly for some time until it runs out of what it wants, and...I think that basically they see less growth of E. coli in the petri dishes, and even a shrinkage of it after enough time.

    My thought is that for us, we do not necessarily need E. coli nissle to gobble up every bit of what we give it, and to that end perhaps both the soy-milk method from Dr. Myhill's web site and the LB broth method might work. On the other hand, if we do allow it to grow as much as it possibly can (thus pushing it into territory where one or a few nutrients are lacking), will it spring back once deposited in our guts and given all the goodies therein?

    How much do you ferment yours, @donovank730?
     
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  11. donovank730

    donovank730

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    Yes I grow mine in soymilk very easily and it grows very effectively. I do retention enemas with it and it works very well but it is a very strong probiotic.
     
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  12. SwanRonson

    SwanRonson Senior Member

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    I saw this strain recommended for constipation, but I'm reluctant to take probiotics orally after a nasty bout with sibo last year. Is enema delivery a good method for this strain or is oral the best route?
     
  13. aaron_c

    aaron_c Senior Member

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    @donovank730: Good to know. What do you mean by "a very strong probiotic?"
     

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