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EDITORIAL Differing case definitions point to the need for an accurate diagnosis of ME/CFS

Discussion in 'Latest ME/CFS Research' started by AndyPR, Jan 9, 2017.

  1. AndyPR

    AndyPR RIP PR :'(

    http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/21641846.2017.1273863
     
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  2. A.B.

    A.B. Senior Member

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    I wonder if pre and post exertion lactate would make a suitable biomarker. Take blood, have the patient walk until they feel exhausted, then take blood again.
     
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  3. AndyPR

    AndyPR RIP PR :'(

    It seemed to me, reading this, that they are making a strong argument against the type of broad criteria that MEGA intend to use.

    Particularly if the low initial lactate levels reported in another thread recently are a commonalty to all/most PwME, then it could be used as an initial screen, along with reported symptoms.
     
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  4. Sasha

    Sasha Fine, thank you

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    This is a UK-based team from the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine: Luis Nacul, Caroline Kingdon, Erinna Bowman, Hayley Curran & Eliana Lacerda.

    Good to see them speaking up against Oxford nonsense.
     
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  5. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    As Ron Davis pointed out, you only need the blood. Measure lactate, or some other marker, both pre- and post- a cell stress test and you have a simple blood test. Of course it has to be shown that this is reliable, has high specificity and sensitivity, and we have to use a good marker set.
     
  6. Forbin

    Forbin Senior Member

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    Yes, Ron Davis mentioned the development of a chip that could measure electrical impedance to evaluate cellular changes. Healthy cells and ME/CFS cells showed the same impedance until they were stressed by creating "a demand for ATP." After about 2-hours, the ME/CFS cells showed a reproducible increase in impedance.

    It's also been mentioned that healthy cells start acting like ME/CFS cells when exposed to an ME/CFS patient's blood (serum?), and vice versa. That would seem to imply an existing knowledge of how ME/CFS patient cells differ from normal cells (possibly via a test such as mentioned above). At any rate, if ME/CFS patient blood consistently altered healthy cells performance on some kind of test, that too might be a test for ME/CFS.
     
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  7. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    Serum.
     
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  8. lansbergen

    lansbergen Senior Member

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    Makes sense to me.
     
  9. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member

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    The adjunct point (underlined) I think is good. I don't think the comparison with other conditions is exact. For example, the CBT is not the same. Also there is an abnormal response to exercise in ME/CFS which makes it more difficult to design suitable graded activity and exercise regimes.

    But there is always a chance with peer-reviewed papers that the authors were pressurised by a peer reviewer to say something they might prefer not to.
     
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  10. Kati

    Kati Patient in training

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    It is much more complicated than measuring lactate pre and post exercise.

    Note that athletes will have high lactate following maximal CPET and if they are in overtraining, their pre-exercise lactate will show elevated.

    If it were this simple, we'd already have a biomarker.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2017

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