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Dr. David Tuller discusses the flaws of the PACE trial

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by Cheshire, Mar 1, 2016.

  1. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    There's no indication about when and where the shooting took place. Netherlands presentation of Forgotten Plague?
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2016
  2. Sasha

    Sasha Fine, thank you

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    I believe that's right.

    Thanks for posting - it's very well worth watching. Some great quotes in there!

    Big thanks (as always) to David Tuller. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
    leela, moosie, Dolphin and 12 others like this.
  3. Gijs

    Gijs Senior Member

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    Thank you so much dr. David Tuller for your presentation and telling the truth!:)
     
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  4. Keela Too

    Keela Too Sally Burch

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    Ah.. thanks I saw a link to this earlier today... started to watch it and some-one called in. Then I couldn't find it again.

    Will settle down now with a cuppa and watch. :)
     
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  5. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    A cup of tea! I was about to get one for me. I'll virtually share it with you!
     
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  6. Sasha

    Sasha Fine, thank you

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    6:40:

    :cool:
     
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  7. Yogi

    Yogi Senior Member

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    Good video.

    Thank you PACE MAN aka D.Tuller for ripping this trial to shreds.!!!!

    Forever indebted to you for your courage and tenacity.!!
     
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  8. Keela Too

    Keela Too Sally Burch

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    This is brilliant... Just what I needed today after recent shenanigans. :)
     
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  9. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    Wonderful talk. I have been discussing the cult angle for years, I was pleased to hear the cult angle commented on. There were numerous other angles discussed that I approve of, but I am starting to forget them already. (Bad brain, bad. ) I may have to watch it again.

    Its important to discuss the research and not individuals. I have long held that view. We can prove things about the research, including numerous flaws, but we usually cannot prove anything about individuals. It does not matter if we have suspicions and they might be true, what matters is what we can prove. Given there are so many things we can prove its much better to spend our time on that.
     
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  10. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    This is so good it needs some biscuits or cake to go with that tea. If it were longer I would suggest popcorn.
     
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  11. Keela Too

    Keela Too Sally Burch

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    Second cuppa and a second listen now. (Raises mug to friends :p )
    I too thought the CBT/GET cult was a nice turn of phrase. And he's right, it is like a cult! :p
     
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  12. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    I had a Breton crêpe. Yumi.
     
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  13. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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  14. A.B.

    A.B. Senior Member

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    A group of people that:
    - Promise a return to good health if only patients are willing to work on their beliefs.
    - Teach patients that they need a therapist to decide what to think, feel, and do.
    - Won't let lack of objective improvement get in the way of their fantasies.
    - Ignore criticism from outsiders.
    - Fervently believe in some vaguely defined mind over matter stuff that nobody has ever proven.

    PS: I forgot: they also seem more concerned about expanding their influence and power than actually doing the best for patients.

    Yep. It resembles a cult.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2016
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  15. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    And try to estrange supportive relatives from patients. Keep only those who are in favor of their "cure".
     
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  16. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    You forgot the part about relying heavily on charismatic leaders. Rhetoric, not reason and evidence.
     
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  17. BurnA

    BurnA Senior Member

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    Comments section in you tube is looking very bare......maybe some people would like to say something ?
     
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  18. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    The video ends abruptly and the sound quality is not great but a professional recording is on the way!


    Thanks to Anil van der See and everyone involved in that event! Unfortunately, Anil was not well enough to attend the screening...

    For those who are not on tweeter or FB (or missed it) he gave David Tuller this amazing T-shirt:

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. worldbackwards

    worldbackwards A unique snowflake

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    Wessely maybe, but not sure White fits the bill!

    Greatly enjoying the 'tea and biscuits' related turn this thread has taken though. :)
     
  20. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    This started with Charcot and Freud, in the nineteenth century, who became cult figures. Its about people using persuasive rhetoric. Its not necessarily about being liked.
     
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