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Dr. David Bell on Chronic Lyme disease and ME/CFS

Discussion in 'Lyme Disease and Co-Infections' started by Sushi, Oct 29, 2015.

  1. Sushi

    Sushi Senior Member Albuquerque

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    read more at the link above.
     
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  2. duncan

    duncan Senior Member

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    Well, it's good that he got at least some of it right. :cool:
     
  3. justy

    justy Donate Advocate Demonstrate

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    which bits did he get wrong Duncan? I thought it was a good answer - honest and the most we know at the moment. As he says a a shame they didn't do further work and publish anything on the samples at the time - a missed opportunity only in retrospect I guess.
     
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  4. duncan

    duncan Senior Member

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    I have no idea what I was speaking to. :confused:

    Let me see if I can remember.

    ETA: Ok I remember. He equated chronic Lyme with ME/CFS. I think this is worth challenging.

    But I agree with most of what else he says, e.g. Lyme like many viruses can lead to or trigger ME/CFS
     
  5. duncan

    duncan Senior Member

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    Confusing chronic Lyme for ME/CFS is different than saying they are one and the same. I think it is easy to confuse the two. Many individuals diagnosed with chronic Lyme may have ME/CFS, and visa versa. You can also have both simultaneously, as some of us on this forum can attest.

    But acute Lyme that devolves into chronicity after treatment - or despite it - is chronic Lyme. The active agent behind the symptoms is Borrelia in chronic Lyme. Late Stage Lyme that does not respond to treatment is chronic Lyme. PTLDS is a different matter that may or may not be based on reality.

    At least, that's how I see it.

    But just like certain viruses, Lyme can lead to ME/CFS. When it triggers ME/CFS, the symptoms are not attributable to Borrelia.

    Distinguishing the two becomes problematic in the face of dicey diagnostics. Swollen knees and PEM and NK function are a few things that address that.

    I hope I am making sense here and not pissing anybody off. Bad brain day; hard to tell. This is all just my probably incoherent opinion. :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2015
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  6. msf

    msf Senior Member

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    My incoherent opinion (I like this disclaimer) is that ME is a combination of a chronic bacterial infection and the resulting autoinmune/immunological changes.
     
  7. duncan

    duncan Senior Member

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    Intracellular infections, in particular, make things a little hairy.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2015

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