1. Patients launch $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
The Pathway to Prevention (P2P) for ME/CFS: A Dangerous Process
Gabby Klein gives an overview of the P2P process, shedding light on the pitfalls with advice as to what we can do in protest ...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

Dr. Chia Produces New Form of Oxymatrine

Discussion in 'Antivirals, Antibiotics and Immune Modulators' started by Cort, Jul 29, 2009.

  1. Kati

    Kati Patient in training

    Messages:
    2,117
    Likes:
    1,754
    It's Equilibrant from Dr Chia. Equilibranthealth.com I believe.
     
  2. leaves

    leaves Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes:
    15
    Aaah :) that explains ... those are 100 mg a tab I believe. I didnt take those cause im not tolerant of the other ingredients.
     
  3. Kati

    Kati Patient in training

    Messages:
    2,117
    Likes:
    1,754
    Per 6 tablets serving size, Equilibrant has 1500 mg of proprietary herbal blend. Consisting of Astragalus Root extract, Shrubby sophora root extracts, olive leaf extract, licorice root extract and shittake mushroom extract. Also included is Vitamin A. D Calcium and Selenium.
     
  4. leaves

    leaves Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes:
    15
    ooh so it doesnt really say how much sophora root is in there. hmmm. I guess I will up the dose to 3 tabs or so.
     
  5. Kati

    Kati Patient in training

    Messages:
    2,117
    Likes:
    1,754
    There is a big lack of regulation in vitamins and supplements in the world. I am wary of other companies that want to copy a compound- you never know what and how much they put in their pills. That's why I stucked to Equilibrant.
     
  6. consuegra

    consuegra Senior Member

    Messages:
    102
    Likes:
    32
    Dr. Chia recommends building to six pills of Equilabrant per day. My daughter built slowly to this level without a problem. She has been on Equilibrant for four months or so. Over this time some symptoms have improved, but as usual it is difficult to tell what, in anything, might cause improvement. I believe over time the antibody levels might drop in a significant way but it takes a long time according to Dr. Chia.

    Chris

    http://cfspatientadvocate.blogspot.com
     
  7. leaves

    leaves Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,193
    Likes:
    15
    about enteroviruses; nitazoxanide also has an anti viral effect was recently discovered, also against enteroviruses. Reason i mention that, i had to take it for a while for something else, and felt very good... they now also use it as a treatment against hep c and it is is a pretty safe medicine. i am considering asking my doc for a trial..
     
  8. Andrew

    Andrew Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,977
    Likes:
    1,267
    Los Angeles, USA
    I bought a bottle of Oxymatrine and then figured I should search for a thread and read it before taking the stuff. Very interesting. I'm wondering if any of you have found significant improvement since you began this. For example, if you were already improving slightly before trying this, did you notice a significant change beyond this at some point.

    BTW, you might find this interesting:

     
  9. CBS

    CBS Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes:
    312
    Western US
    So has anyone documented/studied the time of year that patients with a sudden onset of ME first got sick?

    ETA: I just created a poll asking "In which month did month sudden onset folks first become ill?"
     
  10. Andrew

    Andrew Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,977
    Likes:
    1,267
    Los Angeles, USA
    I just thought of something. This Equilabrant contains licorice root. Licorice is one of the natural remedies that has to be taken carefully. So that's another reason to be careful with dosing.
     
  11. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

    Messages:
    5,128
    Likes:
    3,398
    N. California
    Hi Andrew--

    Licorice is known for it's anti-viral properties and its use as an adaptogen to regulate the HPA axis. TCM practitioners will also often add it to their formulas to help harmonize the other herbs in the mix. The only serious side effect of licorice is that it can increase b.p., so it is contraindicated for those with hypertension.

    In general, I have not found pre-packaged formulas to be the best option when it comes to taking herbs. I always prefer to take Chinese herbs that are formulated specifically for me by a knowledgeable TCM practitioner, and adjusted accordingly with each visit. Every body is different, so there can be no way that one formula will be effective for every person who tries it. And in time, herbs that were once very effective may become less effective, especially if they are taken repeatedly for an extended period of time.

    Given that, I am still glad to know that Chia is making herbal remedies available to his patients. It's good to know there are alternatives to the a.v. drugs.
     
  12. Andrew

    Andrew Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,977
    Likes:
    1,267
    Los Angeles, USA
    There are other possible negative side effects. There are several information pages, but here's one: http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/natural/881.html

    Of course, the amount in this formulation might be so low there is not a problem. But I think it's better for people to know about side effects so they can decide.
     
  13. Andrew

    Andrew Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,977
    Likes:
    1,267
    Los Angeles, USA
    This is sort of scary. I searched for his presentation using Google and got nowhere.
     
  14. baccarat

    baccarat Senior Member

    Messages:
    188
    Likes:
    80
    The interesting bit for me is that Dr Chia found a better response in patients given the antibiotic Rifampin, in addition to the herbs.
    I don't understand why an antibiotic would help in fighting an enterovirus infection...
    The other main question is how people do once they stop taking the herbs. I tried herbs in the past, some were quite helpful in getting symptoms down but as long as I took them. Whenever I stopped then I'd slip back to square one.
    It would be helpful to hear from anybody who has had this treatment for a while and then went off it.
     
  15. CBS

    CBS Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes:
    312
    Western US
    Perhaps Rifampin is actually working against a chronic C. Pneumoniae infection (not uncommon in ME(CFS) patients): http://chronicfatigue.stanford.edu/infections/chlamydia-treatment.html

    Just a thought.
     
  16. shannah

    shannah Senior Member

    Messages:
    848
    Likes:
    179
    I found Dr. Chia's remark that there was improved response when Rifampin was added very interesting as well.

    Many Chronic Lyme patients have major turnarounds in their health when Rifampin is introduced. The connection that they make is that there must be the co-infection Bartonella present.

    As we know there are many symptom similarities between Chronic Lyme/Co-infections and ME/CFS and many misdiagnosis also between the two. Many even believe they are the same. The Rifampin could possibly be treating a common denominator in both.

    All very intriguing!
     
  17. shannah

    shannah Senior Member

    Messages:
    848
    Likes:
    179
    Here's a short write up on Rifampin from one site

    Description: A semisynthetic antibiotic produced from Streptomyces mediterranei. It has a broad antibacterial spectrum, including activity against several forms of Mycobacterium. In susceptible organisms it inhibits DNA-dependent RNA polymerase activity by forming a stable complex with the enzyme. It thus suppresses the initiation of RNA synthesis. It is bactericidal and acts on both intracellular and extracellular organisms. It has also been shown to induce cytochrome P450 CYP3A4.

    http://www.biotrend-usa.com/us/shop/search-query?itemid=BG0307
     
  18. Zuriel

    Zuriel

    Messages:
    65
    Likes:
    3
    Australia
    Anyone knows the cost of test for enterovirus and the procedure? I was directed to www.evmedresearch.com but could not find out how the procedure is carried out?
    Dr in Australia shook his head and laughed when I mentioned the possibility of enterovirus making my gut feel so awful.
     
    end likes this.
  19. CBS

    CBS Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,378
    Likes:
    312
    Western US

    When I last looked, IHC analysis of the the stomach biopsy tissue through Dr. Chia (EV Med - http://chronicfatigue.stanford.edu/infections/entero-tests.html) was $250-300. The biopsy itself is separate and done via upper GI endoscopy. It can be done by your own gastroenterologist (can be expensive in USA). Don't be dismayed if the initial local analysis comes back as completely normal. Few labs test for enteroviruses and fewer still use a sensitive enough test (ARUP Labs). Antibody tests for enteroviruses really need to be done through ARUP labs in SLC, UT USA.

    http://chronicfatigue.stanford.edu/infections/entero-experts.html
    Silly Aussie Doc! Someday he'll know better. Tell him you just need to put this to rest and that if the testing is negative you'll drop the topic entirely (then don't cut any corners on getting the right tests).

    Good Luck!
     
  20. Zuriel

    Zuriel

    Messages:
    65
    Likes:
    3
    Australia
    CBS- G'day! Many thanks for the information and support after hitting many brick walls. Cheers.
     

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page