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Deplin and spinach cause headache- could it relate to methylation?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by knackers323, Nov 23, 2013.

  1. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    When I have these I get a throbbing headache and the only thing I can think of that would tie them together is increasing folate.

    Could this be possible? If so what would that be telling me in relation to the methylation cycle?

    Thanks
  2. bertiedog

    bertiedog Senior Member

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    Methylfolate can convert to glutamate according to Amy Yasko and this can definitely cause headaches and severe migraine. I am completely intolerant of anything about 500 mcg of mixed folates but I do eat quite a bit in my diet.

    I think I am right in saying that if you have the genetic polymorphisms COMT and CBS it means either you won't be able to tolerate much folate or that you don't actually have a high need for it. You might also be better with hydroxyB12 because again you will be getting less methylgroups.

    Hope this helps, I have suffered terribly from keep trying to take added methylfolate and MB12. Everytime I get the same horrendous migraines. It must have happened at leat 50 times of the years but now I just accept I cannot tolerate anymore.

    Pam
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  3. PeterPositive

    PeterPositive Senior Member

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    100g of spinaches contain almost 200mcg of folates, so they are pretty high.
    See here: http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/vegetables-and-vegetable-products/2626/2

    If you cook them they will probably loose quite a bit unless you just steam them. Take a look at this article: http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=/BJN/BJN88_06/S000711450200243Xa.pdf&code=cc31ea081df710cfe4a6c55bf429b91c

    In particular Table 1, shows the differences between raw and cooked.

    Correct me if I am wrong but Deplin is already a pretty high dose, so maybe in conjunction with other dietary folates you are overdosing it?
    Star-Anise likes this.
  4. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Knackers,

    Headaches have many causes. Folate related headaches can come form many causes, usually low folate of some kind, because of the effects the folate has on the muscles, nerves and other things. It may not be an "absolute" highness or lowness but rather an high or low amount related to other nutrients. If you look on the lists of symptoms you will see a number of kinds of muscle pains and headaches. For instance, the reverse curvature bending of the neck in ME can cause terrible headaches. That is a largely CNS-MeCbl deficiency and as little bit of L-methylfplate can affect how it feels and how the muscles are very much. These things are often very tricky and many layers deep.
  5. SickOfSickness

    SickOfSickness Senior Member

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    Spinach is very high in oxalates. I don't know if they could cause headaches directly but you may want to avoid high oxalates for other reasons.

    "Oxalates deplete glutathione, one of the body’s key antioxidants; oxalates change how zinc works within the body, which can affect immune function; and oxalates also fuel inflammation, a major issue in FMS."

    (FMS means Fibromyalgia. Headaches are a definite symptom of FMS.)

    "Oxalates are said to suppress the immune system and make one more susceptible to Candida overgrowth."
    Star-Anise likes this.
  6. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    Thanks for all the ideas guys. I will definatly be avoiding both from now on. I thought it may be some indication that my methylation cycle isn't working properly.

    But it sounds as if I could be getting this effect from high folate even if it was functioning properly?

    Or could it even be a sign that it is functioning well?
  7. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Knackers,

    Headaches are a symptom of MeCbl deficiency and of l-methylfolate deficiency or both. The are a symptom of both partial methylation block and methyltrap.

    As some of the headaches are caused by muscle spasms in the neck and head, it can take months for the muscles to recover enough to stop the headaches and require both LCF and AdoCbl as well. It isn't just a methylation issue.

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