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Completely eliminated my severe anxiety symptoms with three supplements!

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by Hip, Jul 7, 2012.

  1. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    It's fairy uncommon to have psychosis symptoms in ME/CFS, but pretty common to have anxiety symptoms (I believe around 30% of ME/CFS patients have some type of anxiety disorder); so that is why this thread focuses on anti-anxiety supplements, as these supplements can be useful for many ME/CFS patients (and useful for anyone else with anxiety, for that matter).

    Though now that you bring this point up, it might be an idea to create another thread that focuses on the supplements that I found do have some mild antipsychotic effects (namely the supplements listed here), as a few ME/CFS patients do seem to get some mild psychosis (ie, feeling slightly crazy) symptoms.

    As well as those supplements, I found that very low dose amisulpride (12.5 to 50 mg), which I took for its anti-anxiety and antidepressant effects, also had some antipsychotic effects — but this is not surprising, since amisulpride is an atypical antipsychotic, used in higher doses (400 mg +) to treat psychosis. I still take 12.5 mg of amisulpride every day, as without it I get some depression.
  2. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    If you want it to dissolve, you can mix it with some hot water.
  3. sregan

    sregan Senior Member

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    I am trying this again. Not going full dose like last time. Took about 1/4 of the 750 mg cap and slept pretty well. (not as good as my first try with the full cap). I'm hoping this helps my sleep more than anything. Maybe it will help my gut also. Going to try to stay at this dose and increase as I can or decrease if anxiety returns.
  4. D.B.

    D.B.

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    alwayshopeful likes this.
  5. gibs123

    gibs123

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    hello hips it is nice to meet you, i was very intrigued by this thread i just started this regime as of yesterday i feel like it is working but i tend to have the placebo affect with most supplements or medications where as if i believe it is working i think it is working, so i hope this isnt the case for this supplements i myself have had blockage of the nostrils over the past few years and that has only worsened my symptoms, i just want to know i got this brand of N-A-G http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/...gclid=CNOn9cOi6bkCFdSY4Aodj1oABg#.UkREIWRxte4
    just wanted to make sure it was sufficient enough and this tumeric
    http://www.vitaminshoppe.com/store/en/browse/sku_detail.jsp?id=VS-1672#.UkREY2Rxte4
    currently am taking 2 tablest twice daily as of now, because there 300 mg pills

    let me know if these supplements are sufficient enough, looking forward to hearing from you soon.
  6. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    gibs123
    I hope the supplements do work for you.
    The NAG you bought is fine (though I buy my Jarrow brand NAG from iHerb, who are very cheap for most supplements).

    The turmeric you bought is unfortunately the wrong type: you've bought a concentrated curcumin extract of turmeric, rather than ordinary turmeric (normal turmeric contains around 3% curcumin, but also has other good things in it). Curcumin is also on my list of anti-anxiety a supplements, and you can use it, but I found turmeric is much better. If you have an Asian grocery store near you, you will find they often sell bags of turmeric for just a few $s.

    You'll need to work out yourself if the supplements are sufficient enough, by noting the level of your anxiety symptoms each day. If you feel that your anxiety is much improved, that's fine; otherwise, you may want to add some more supplements from my list. The supplements at the top of the list I found generally had the most potent anti-anxiety effects. I myself take around 5 or 6 supplements from my list, in order to maintain an anxiety-free state.
  7. Beyond

    Beyond 10% of discount in iHerb!--> PEZ915

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    I find your wordpress site highly helpful, Hip, as I suffer of a lot of your "psychological" symptoms, which I find particulary devastating. Well done and congratulations.

    About curcumin, I will try it for my "adrenal fatigue" and intestinal inflammation. Also for my MAO A and B mutations!

    Here is why: http://www.bmijournal.org/index.php/bmi/article/view/45/71
    Hip likes this.
  8. Lala

    Lala Senior Member

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  9. outdamnspot

    outdamnspot

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    Hip, I've run a cursory search on google and read through parts of this thread, but it seems like you're the main person having success using N-acetylglucosamine for anxiety.

    I've had sinus issues since I was a kid, and certain anti-inflammatories (garlic, cayenne pepper, acute Dexedrine doses) will have the effect of clearing up my breathing and my headspace at the same time.

    I have severe, crippling anxiety and have exhausted most pharmacological/supplemental options, which is why I'm very interested in the N-aectylglucosamine, but for some reason I react quite badly (almost paradoxically) to GABAergics and NMDA antagonists, i.e. benzos, magnesiums, N-acetylcysteine, Taurine etc. It's terribly frustrating, since a lot of those are core supplemental/pharmacological agents in helping get anxiety under control.

    Anyway, I was just wondering if you knew whether the glucosamine worked via a similar mechanism, or if it was somehow unique? I just don't want to waste money on another thing that's going to make me feel worse.

    Thanks!
    Delia likes this.
  10. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    No, quite a few people (on this forum, and on my website) have told me that NAG worked surprisingly well for their anxiety symptoms; though just as many people told me that NAG did not help them.


    I don't really know the mechanism by which NAG exerts its anti-anxiety effect; I only discovered its anti-anxiety effects serendipitously. However, I don't think it works via GABA or NMDA receptor agonism/antagonism; and I suspect NAG probably works by an anti-inflammatory action. I have listed some possible NAG mechanisms in this earlier post here.

    If you have problems with GABA or NMDA receptor agonism/antagonism, you might want to explore the anti-inflammatory route to treating anxiety, which I had good success with, and I detail on another anti-anxiety thread located here.

    To go down this anti-inflammatory route, you would need to use COX-2 inhibiting supplements, NF-kappa-B inhibiting supplements, and also take high doses of prebiotics and probiotics to lower gut inflammation. This anti-inflammatory approach requires taking say 6 or more supplements daily, so if you don't like splashing out on supplements, then this route is not for you. My anxiety levels were so severe, that I would have walked to the ends of the Earth to find an answer, so I did not mind buying hundreds of supplements to test.

    You might also want to try some of the top-of-the-list supplements detailed at the beginning of this thread, such as flaxseed oil, turmeric, arginine pyroglutamate, citrulline malate. Again, you may not find the complete answer in one supplement, so (unfortunately for your finances) you may have to take several to get a substantial reduction or elimination of anxiety.
  11. outdamnspot

    outdamnspot

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    Thanks for the helpful post, Hip. Turmeric made me worse too (NMDA antagonist and MAO-i), and fish oils disturb my sleep (I don't know about flaxseed, though).

    Unfortunately, finances are a problem, so I'll begin with the N-acetylglucosamine for the time being.
  12. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    @outdamnspot

    iHerb and Amazon seem to be the cheapest for Jarrow NAG (Jarrow seem to be the best value brand of NAG).
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2014 at 4:15 PM
  13. Mr.NiceGuy

    Mr.NiceGuy

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    Hip ! First of all thanks for this Great thread! I happen to stumble upon this in my search for Inositol info.

    Since i was a young kid I had Chronic Sinusitis and Crippling Anxiety. I would never have thought to connect the two which is what caught my attention regarding the info you provide.

    Anyway, I decided to get some NAG, Inositol, Flax, and Tumeric.

    I dosed it all for the first time about two hours ago....I feel VERY sedated. I am in absolute peace right now.

    I really dont know whats doing what since I took it all at the same time on an empty stomach. The only of those supplements that I havent used before are the inositol and NAG so its easy to narrow it down to those two.

    Anyway, ill keep updating my results but more importantly I wanted to thank you for this Valuable info.

    Im going to enjoy this blissful feeling now :)
    Beyond and rosie26 like this.
  14. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    @Mr.NiceGuy

    Great to hear that these supplements have delivered absolute peace to you! For those who suffer anxiety disorder, I know how good it is to experience a calm and relaxed mind for once, when usually the mind is in such a horrible constant state of internal tension, nervousness and stress. I hope these supplements continue to work for you. I pretty sure they will.

    In my experience, the anti-anxiety effects of N-acetyl-glucosamine (NAG), flaxseed oil, and turmeric kick in pretty fast: within an hour or two of taking them; by contrast, the anti-anxiety effects of inositol take a good 12 hours or so to kick in, thus often you don't get the benefits of inositol until the next day after taking it. So I think the anti-anxiety effects you are now experiencing, just two hours after taking these four supplements, derive only from the NAG, flaxseed oil, and turmeric. You will not get the full anti-anxiety benefit until probably tomorrow, when the inositol also kicks in.

    Please let me know how you progress with these supplements. It is always very nice to get feedback from people who have tried these supplements.
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2013
  15. Mr.NiceGuy

    Mr.NiceGuy

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    Well, its only been a couple days but the effects have been constant. The Amazing part is that I have been on Various Benzo's and Anti depressants and none have been this strong and calming.

    I had to lower my inositol dose to 6 grams a day 2 x 3 grams ( down from 12 grams) and dropped my NAG dose to 750 x 2 daily ( From 750mg x 4) because I actually found myself in a coma like super state of concentration (That may not make sense lol ) and my appetite drastically decreased.

    However even though I lowered my doses the effects remain constant at a slightly lower intensity but not much lower.

    So I pretty much just have to tweak the dosage a little so i am at a comfortable level....

    Im finding is that I talk less and I get super focused on whatever im doing. I have an adderall type concentration without the stimulation and euphoria.

    I have never had anything affect me this way in such a "Feelable" and effective way. I know its early on but if this continues working like this I will be a happy camper :) and its very affordable !
    Little Bluestem, maryb, Hip and 2 others like this.
  16. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    Perhaps this study might shed some light if someone can decipher it for those of us with no science background:

    http://udini.proquest.com/view/characterization-of-n-pqid:1888325151/
  17. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    Hi Hip,

    I found a few studies that show that curcumin (from turmeric) lowers or inhibits (or prevents) quinolinic acid toxicity, so perhaps that may explain in part why it has been helpful with anxiety. (My quinolinic acid acid levels in a OAT test were high…just realized that this morning.) Here's one of the studies:http://www.jnutbio.com/article/S0955-2863(12)00033-2/abstract
  18. soulfeast

    soulfeast Senior Member

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    I have and they have made a difference. I also have sinus inflammation with brain inflammation.. always go together. I am addressing as mast cells. I also am on Yasko's protocol and am focusing on resveratrol, grapeseed extract and pycnogenol along with neuroprotek from algonot (Dr Theoharides) with stinging nettle. I do take about 1/3 a capsule of curcumin but will switch to tumeric and see what happens. I am reading that different antioxidants and OPCs effect different inflammatory markers, so it made sense to me to use a combination.

    I also take h1 and h2 blockers (zyrtek 10 mg and zantac 10-20 mg in am and atarax 25 mg and zantac 10-20 mg in pm). I take benadryl rarely these days for "breaththrough" issues (breathing issues or brain inflammation, though atarax generally works better for that). This is baseline h1-h2 support for someone with mast cell issues.

    I also take ketotifen 2 mg twice a day. I had livedo reticulitis on my thighs until I took ketotifen. I could not tell any other benefit and I cannot say for sure the ketotifen resulted in this. I had also started midodrine which I was able to stop once I took Querca Max from Clark's Pharmacy (similar to d-hist). I switched from QM to neuroprotek since it also has luteolin. I had to add in stinging nettle which inhibits leukotrienes and is a vaso constrictor. My heavy leg pain went away with NP and stinging nettle. I take 100-200 mg of stinging nettle a day. I have noticed that my legs feel lighter when my inflammation is down. This inflammation seems to be able to trigger neuropathic pain as well and or an intense bone to skin pain (which is also common with mast cell disorders).

    My experience has been that either just working up to 6 pills of NP a day and or working up to 250 mg of gse, 100-200 mg of resveratrol (one in am and the other pm) and 50 mg of pycnogenol am and then again in pm has calmed my body down. I also upped lithium to 15 mg.

    I am working on Yasko's protocol in stages and not at stage where I address GI bugs.

    Once the weather shifted here from chilly-cold and less humid to humid and warm, my brain inflammation kicked in (along with sinus inflammation). I also decided to back off the ketotifen to 1 mg in am (experimenting) at same time, so not sure which is causing this but I do see a trend of increasing sinus-brain inflammation in spring which gets better in winter. I am going to add in the 1 mg of ketotifen and wait until weather turns cold again to experiment.

    I have chronic gi issues and became much sicker after 6 mnths treatment for lyme and babesia which destroyed my gut. I am now testing pos for EBV (early antigen), have relatively high nagalase and high mycotoxin levels in urine (mold issue in house, which we have since left along with belongings). I had sinus surgery to address infected sinuses (fungal and all cavities). So there has to be a connection there for me.

    I am finding that many antioxidants effect mast cells.. directly or suppress mediators. So difficult to know if mast cells or something else is going on. I do know that the h1 blockers can help come crazy symptoms that seem to involve my nervous system. Also even when adding in supplements in stages, difficult to know if a change is because one supplement has built up in system or the one added is having the effect unless immediate. I did have an immediate response to Querca Max which continued with NP when I added stinging nettle, though, for the complete effect (this was for legs). Brain inflammation (anxiety, depression, rage, inability to concentrate) most obviously helped by atarax first then sometimes zyrtek and other times benadryl. I can't tell if the supps help so clearly.

    POTS, EDS, MCAS trio would fit me and my daughter who may have excess mast cells in stomach and duodenum (30 per sample). I keep her on h1 and h2 blockers (and now NP) esp now to keep stomach acid out of her throat since she has what looks like EoE.. still pending results on that. She is also on Yasko's protocol and in beginning stages so not at GI protocol yet. She and I both have positive results for H Pylori and excess strep. She has also been exposed to lyme and clearly has EDS, hypermobile (appt in late spring with specialist).
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2013
  19. soulfeast

    soulfeast Senior Member

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    Interesting. We also have high quinolinic.
  20. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Thanks for the link, Dannybex. I did at one point consider at quinolinic acid from neuroinflammation as a possible source of anxiety, via its ability to activate the NMDA receptors. However, this study found that in neuroinflammation, quinolinic acid build up is in fact too small to cause any significant NMDA receptor activation. So that would seem to rule quinolinic acid out as a cause of anxiety.
    dannybex likes this.

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