1. Patients launch $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
Ergonomics and ME/CFS: Have You Hurt Yourself Without Knowing It?
Having a chronic illness like ME/CFS can make it hard to avoid problems that come from bad ergonomics. Jody Smith has learned some lessons the hard way ...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

cholesterol + diet

Discussion in 'Lifestyle Management' started by madietodd, Jul 10, 2012.

  1. madietodd

    madietodd Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,483
    Likes:
    1,744
    East Coast, USA
    I finally went to a doctor, and my cholesterol scared her. She's very open and alternative, but she's putting me right on 10mg of lipitor. Of course I'm changing my diet, and I could use some help with that.

    The easiest way to think about this seems to be to start with vegan. I have to eat gluten-free, so lots of pre-made vegan foods won't work for me. I gain weight if I think about carbs, so I somehow have to fill my protein requirements without too much emphasis on beans......or high-calorie nuts....or too much fruit (sugars).

    I do know about high-protein vegetables, eg kale, but I just can't eat that every day.

    So if any of you are already eating gluten-free vegan with low-ish carbs, or any other way that will help me figure this out, please post!
     
    L'engle likes this.
  2. Sushi

    Sushi Moderator and Senior Member Albuquerque

    Messages:
    7,301
    Likes:
    6,377
    Albuquerque
    Hi Madie,

    If you do take lipitor, don't forget about adding CO Q 10, as lipitor will deplete it.

    Best,
    Sushi
     
  3. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

    Messages:
    5,130
    Likes:
    3,400
    N. California
    Personally, I would not consider taking statins. They have some pretty nasty side effects, including causing immune depression and liver damage. You can read more about this on Pfizer's website: http://www.lipitor.com/aboutLipitor...=23127370|166376222|0&skwid=43700003061901882
    And on Mercola: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...20/the-truth-about-statin-drugs-revealed.aspx
    And here:http://www.livestrong.com/article/117641-bad-side-effects-statins/

    Mark Hyman's article is the best one. It has a lot of info on how to lower cholesterol with diet and supllements: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-mark-hyman/lower-cholesterol-naturally_b_815393.html

    Good luck with this Madie
     
    lnester7 and CJB like this.
  4. madietodd

    madietodd Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,483
    Likes:
    1,744
    East Coast, USA
    Well, my cholesterol is so high I'm not going to admit what it is. I mean, seriously, I didn't know the readings went that high.

    I had warned my doctor that it would be elevated, so she did a massive blood draw and checked vitamin and mineral levels, and liver function. Honestly, our hope is to smash this with diet and a very low dose of statins, and then stop the meds. She's all about avoiding meds as much as possible.

    I remember Dean Ornish from years ago, so I'm getting a bunch of his books from the library.

    Sushi, I already take 100mg ubiquinone. Do I need to increase that, or just get it checked in 3 months when we re-do the cholesterol readings? Thanks for the heads-up about this.

    Thanks for your support, y'all.
     
  5. Sallysblooms

    Sallysblooms P.O.T.S. now SO MUCH BETTER!

    Messages:
    1,767
    Likes:
    332
    Southern USA
    Vegan would not even be on my list of changes. Just common sense healthful food. Paleo, Wahls, etc. no sugar, no bad carbs. Lots of fruit and veggies, sea veggies , hormone balance. Soluble fiber is impotant.
    Gentle exer. Works great.

    Have you checked your thyroid level lately? Good luck!
     
  6. CJB

    CJB Senior Member

    Messages:
    743
    Likes:
    387
    Oregon
    Really good article. I just checked with my library and they have one of his books on CD. Can't wait for them to send it.

    Me too, Madie -- good luck. It's just one more level of difficulty with diet. :hug:
     
  7. madietodd

    madietodd Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,483
    Likes:
    1,744
    East Coast, USA
    Thanks, all.

    Sally, I actually have to give up Paleo, because it's meat based. That's where all the cholesterol is. I follow Wahls' diet in terms of colors, but I can't stomach the "smoothies," or that quantity of vegetables.

    My doctor did check thyroid function, and it's fine. But I haven't seen a copy of the tests yet, to check which thyroid tests were used.

    The diet Hyman recommends is the same as the diet for high cholesterol, if lean meat is eaten moderately:

    3. Eat a Healthy Diet. Eat a diet with a low glycemic load, high in fiber, and phytonutrient and omega-3 rich. It should be plant based, and you should consume plenty of good quality protein such as beans, nuts, seeds, and lean animal protein (ideally organic or grass fed).
     
  8. Sushi

    Sushi Moderator and Senior Member Albuquerque

    Messages:
    7,301
    Likes:
    6,377
    Albuquerque
    Seems like if 100 mg of ubiquinone keeps your level good without lipitor, that you might need more while taking it...but that is just a guess. Is your doc open to that kind of question?

    Sushi
     
  9. Sallysblooms

    Sallysblooms P.O.T.S. now SO MUCH BETTER!

    Messages:
    1,767
    Likes:
    332
    Southern USA
    II am sure a short period of time is fine with no meat. I will never go meatless again, we eat quality, low fat and not large amounts. I see what Dr. Wahls eats when she posts it. Very small amounts of all of her food and lots of veggies etc. carbs and sugar are one thing that is not good for so many reasons.
     
  10. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

    Messages:
    5,130
    Likes:
    3,400
    N. California
    Hey Madie--

    I just had a thought... maybe you should considering re-checking your cholesterol, to see if the number was really correct. Sometimes labs DO MAKE MISTAKES. So possibly use another lab. Just saying, if it was me, I would want to be double sure of that cholesterol figure, before jumping into a Lipitor treatment.
     
    taniaaust1 and Sallysblooms like this.
  11. ukxmrv

    ukxmrv Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,535
    Likes:
    2,095
    London
    Madie, do you have a history of high cholesterol in your family? My husband and I have the same diet but his reading is very high and mine is very low. They cardiac doctor he sees tested him for some inherited genes and they are blaming this on a family problem. His siblings have the same high reading. We tried to control this through diet but it didn't work. Are their any heart problems in your family?
    Hope you find a solution. It's very hard when we already have a limited diet and I really sympathise.
     
  12. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1

    Messages:
    8,329
    Likes:
    5,266
    Sth Australia
    Maddie.. your issue may not be diet related at all.. as our own liver can be making the cholestrol. It is said that the liver makes 75% of ones cholestrol.

    I had my cholestrol level so high when I was about 15 or 16 years old, that a doctor told me I wouldnt survive my 21st birthday unless I got it in control (I cant remember what my levels actually were thou now). I got put on a strict low cholestrol diet... I got told not to eat eggs, cheese, nuts and so much more, I got sent home with a special diet plan. I then had blood tests every 3 mths while on this diet and the diet didnt help my cholestrol levels at all.

    Even on a vegan diet you would also need to consider cholestrol in nuts when on cholestrol lowering diets.

    After almost a year of that diet (what the doctor said really scared me so I stayed on it quite a while thou it didnt help)... I ended up giving up with the low cholestrol diet so then went back to normal eatting.

    Interestingly years later when I had my levels tested again, they were fine.

    My cholestrol thou went back up again some since Ive had ME/CFS. Its currently 7.3 when Im fasting. My fasting LDL is 5.5 is more then double the normal range (normal range 0-2.5). Both of my specialists have said they wont treat my level with statins due to the statins carry a risk themselves (IF one does have a heart attack while on a statin drug.. it is more likely to be a fatal).

    My third specialist.. he says my cholestrol level is due to me having hyperinsulinemia (that can affect cholestrol). I noticed you said your weight explodes with carbs... consider if you have carb issues.. you too may have something like hyperinsulinemia affecting your cholestrol level. (the way to test for hyperinsulinemia is a 2 hr glucose tollerence test with the insulin levels included).
     
  13. ggingues

    ggingues $10 gift code at iHerb GAS343 of $40

    Messages:
    4,123
    Likes:
    976
    Concord, NH
    My friends father went on the Atkins diet, and his high cholesterol went down a lot. Counter intuitive, but I think I have read this in other places. Perhaps worth a more detailed search?

    GG
     
    Sallysblooms likes this.
  14. Timaca

    Timaca Senior Member

    Messages:
    420
    Likes:
    75
    This website may interest you: http://www.heartattackproof.com/ I have bought and read his book and really enjoyed it.

    I am not gluten free, but I essentially eat a whole foods, plant based vegan (but with fish). I will eat eggs if they are in a baked item (like corn bread) and skim milk if it is also in a baked item.

    I eat no junk food and essentially no sweets (like cookies) as my diet is very low in fat (but not as low as this website or book recommends). I do eat avocados and nuts freely.

    I eat a lot of food all the time, just to keep my weight up. I wanted to eat this way (and I'm juicing too--drinking 3-4 cups of fresh fruit/vegetable juice daily) to help my immune system be as strong as it could be and to help my heart be as healthy as it could be.

    I will be interested to see when my labs come back if my new diet (which I started in February) has made any difference in my cholesterol level or my immune tests.

    Best, Timaca
     
  15. madietodd

    madietodd Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,483
    Likes:
    1,744
    East Coast, USA
    I've asked around my family, and so far nobody has cholesterol issues like mine. So maybe this isn't genetic, and maybe it is related to the cfs. I'm glad I'm going to see Dr. Rey in August, and I can ask her about it.

    Dreambirdie, my cholesterol has been rising steadily, so this result is consistent. I just hadn't had it checked in - oh, at least 5 years. I appreciate your concern about the statin.

    Tania, you're likely right about the carb/insulin issue. I'm terrified my doctor will ask for that glucose test, because the thought of drinking down all that sugar makes me feel ill. FWIW my diagnos-techs saliva test showed fasting insulin to be normal (11, range 3-12), but non-fasting, following a 50g carb meal, was <3 (range 5-20). "Consider a closer examination of challenge meal composition to rule out pre-diabetic tendencies." Diabetes also does not run in my family.

    Ticama, thanks for the link. I'm going there next!

    Madie
     
  16. Crux

    Crux Senior Member

    Messages:
    583
    Likes:
    212
    USA
  17. hurtingallthetimet

    hurtingallthetimet Senior Member

    Messages:
    612
    Likes:
    115
    i dotn think theres anything that i can add that hasnt been said but just wanted you to know that is very possible to lower your cholesterol with all the great advice youve gotten...have a family member with very high cholesterol it was almost 400 at one time but they lowered it with diet, like the diets listed, fish oils added to cholesterol medications and exercise...and it got down to normal..so it can be done :)

    good luck : )
     
  18. john66

    john66 Senior Member

    Messages:
    131
    Likes:
    111
    Hi Madie, from what I have read, Livalo which is the drug pitavastatin has one of the lower side effect profiles among statins, if you decide to go that route. I have been on all of the statins and they make my CPK levels go into the thousands which indicates muscle and kidney damage are occuring. Not everyone who takes a statin gets this. There are lots and lots of websites and people who refute the cholesterol theory on the web, such as Uffe Ravsnkov, Anthony Colpo and Chris Masterjohn. I tend to agree with them on the lipid theory, with the exception of people who (like me) have familial hyperlipidemia. This means that most people have two LDL receptors on each cell, and I have one. People with homozygous familial hyperlipidemia have none, and their total choesterol numbers can range from 700-1200. This is according to Brown and Goldstein, who won the Nobel prize in medicine. I have tried the vegan route and in my opinion, it made my cholesterol numbers higher, for me it was very hard to stay on and I seemed to be sick too often (before CFS). I would seek the help of a lipidogist if your numbers are like mine. They can delve into the subfractions like Apo B, LDL-P, which are more advanced tests that give more information than a standard blood test for heart disease.
     
    Wonko likes this.
  19. madietodd

    madietodd Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,483
    Likes:
    1,744
    East Coast, USA
    I've heard back from 3 siblings (2 to go plus my mom). The forever-vegetarian's cholesterol is 218. The other two are on statins; one said very low dose, the other didn't give details.

    Hurting, thanks for the positive feedback. My level is "close to 400" - that's all the doc said. I can't do the exercise part, but I'm working all the other angles.

    I've been supplementing with zinc for over a year. ATM I get 100 - 200% RDA, daily. I'm hoping my doctor tested that; I haven't gotten a copy of the results yet. I'll take a look.

    I picked up the prescription, but haven't started the lipitor yet. I've got one last grapefruit in the fridge I'm going to eat tonight, and I'll start the med tomorrow. If I have side effects, I'll stop right away, and I'll ask my doctor about Livalo. Meanwhile, I'll put this information about CPKs in a safe place, to ask about next time I go in.

    This is all very new to me. I know a ton about using diet to support health, but nothing about cholesterol. I was a vegetarian for most of my 20s and 30s, so I know how to do that; it's only a little more complicated with the gluten-free aspect. It's the low fat part that threatens to make this boring.

    John66, if you have any links, that would help me a lot. And Wonko, I see you liked that post.........any information you can contribute would be most welcome.

    Does anybody have links or experience that give reasons for me to NOT do a 3-month trial of 10mg lipitor plus stringent diet? If this doesn't work, I'm not going to increase my dose. I'm really pretty anti-drug, but sometimes they're useful.
     
  20. Crux

    Crux Senior Member

    Messages:
    583
    Likes:
    212
    USA

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page