1. Patients launch a $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
Part 2: Brain Cells Making us Sick? Messed up microglia could be driving symptoms
Simon McGrath looks at theories that microglia, the brain's immune cells, might be overactive and driving the symptoms of ME/CFS and fibromyalgia.
Discuss the article on the Forums.

CBS Mutation.. High sulfate but normal Taurine? TOTAL BLOCK?

Discussion in 'Genetic Testing and SNPs' started by DREBS, Dec 24, 2013.

  1. DREBS

    DREBS

    Messages:
    18
    Likes:
    1
    Texas
    I am CBS +/+… I just took a Sulfite urine strip test and my level's were >1600 (greater than 1600) the highest reference level it reads. However, Some of my lab's contradict what is seen in CBS up regulation and was wondering if anyone had any insight as how this shakes out.

    My homocystine is in the upper normal range

    My cystine is right in the middle Normal

    Sulfate levels high on urine strip

    However, my cystathionine, and I may be wrong one this might need some wisdom on this the test (amino acid blood results) reads >dl for the result (nothing else read's this I think it means low?) But if I'm right how can my cystine be low but cystathionine normal? As cystathionine upstream from cystine.


    My ammonia levels are just slightly elevated above the middle still well in reference range


    However my Taurine levels are completely normal.. Everything I've read said they should be low?


    However even with the "methyl dump" of CBS taking SAM-E even at 100 mg is very stimulating for me. Along with methyl b12 and methyl folate at doses 300 mcg's and up.

    I am also confused on why my methionine is higher, and how that relates to the CBS. Because everything on the main cycle is high except for SAME I'm a little confused on where my block is at.



    My mutations are as follows…(post viral fatigue since Aug 12' 24 yr. old Male)


    +/+ MAO A ….. CBS (C699T) …..SHMT…...


    ACAT +/-
    --------------------
    MTHFR (C677T) +/-
    --------------------
    MTR (A2756G) +/_
    --------------------
    MTRR (A66G) +/-
    --------------------
    MTRR(11) +/-
    --------------------
    BHMT 2 +/-
    --------------------
    BHMT 4 +/-
    --------------------
    BHMT 8 +/-
    --------------------
    CBS (A360A) +/-


    Methylation Pathway Panel


    Glutathione (oxidized) 0.58 (.16-0.50)

    Glutathione (reduced) 3.8 (3.8-5.5)
    ----------------------------------------------------

    SAM-E… 223 (221-256)
    SAH……. 56.4 (38-49)
    --------------------------------------------------

    5-CH3-THF …….….14.3 (8.4-72.6)

    10-Formyl-THF…. 8.5 (1.5-8.2)

    5-Formyl-THF…….2.0 (1.20-11.7)

    THF……………………0.67(.60-6.80)

    Folic Acid…………..16.6 (8.9-24.6)

    Folinic Acid (WB)..10.2 (9.0-35.5)

    Active Folate…… 361 (400-1500)
    ----------------------------------------------------

    Adenosine ……….26.9 (16.8-21.4)

    Borderline high Methionine 3.3 (1.6-3.6) per Amino Acid Plasma

    Borderline High Homocystine .41 (<.50)

    However my Ammonia isn’t bad 18 (<30)
  2. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

    Messages:
    5,887
    Likes:
    7,975
    Amersfoort, Netherlands
    @DREBS - CBS +/+ does not result in a harmful change in sulfur levels. All of the research shows that this is not the case. Hence any assumptions based on the Yasko theories are likely to be wrong. Sulfur strips are also designed for industrial use, not biological. So it's pretty impossible to make any sense of them, with the possible exception of observing fluctuations.

    "<dl" means "below detectable level". Normal homocysteine + low cystathionine + normal cysteine could mean a couple things. One is that your CBS gene may be a bit slow, either due to its SNPs or due to other factors which effect up- or down-regulation of the gene, such as vitamins, etc. But if you have no problem creating cysteine, then that continues to be produced at a regular rate. It wouldn't be much to be concerned about, because it's the cysteine which is needed - cystathionine levels are just helpful in narrowing down problems if there's a cysteine problem (or actually elevated homocysteine).

    Another possibility is that it's normal to have low levels on that test. If so, it would say that the normal range starts at 0. Most research into cystathionine indicates that it's high levels which are a problem. Low levels with normal levels of homocysteine shouldn't indicate a problem at all. It's also possible that the sample wasn't preserved or processed quickly enough, allowing time for intermediaries such as cystathionine too much time to be converted into end products like cysteine.
    allyb likes this.
  3. joshi81

    joshi81 Senior Member

    Messages:
    171
    Likes:
    25
    Rome,Italy,Europe
    @Valentijn Hi, i was wondering.. how it is possible that Yasko is not aware of an eventual mistake of interpretation of CBS ?? In all this time with lots of functional labs she saw (coupled with the genetic testing) is it possible that she did not realize it? Maybe noticing the discrepancy between genetic testing and functional lab findings?

    @DREBS Hi,Where did u test ammonia? on blood or on urine? (or it was in the blood aminoacid panel?). Is a reliable "negative" a normal ammonia tested in blood at morning fasting time? i read here in the forum a person who told that to catch his/her hiah ammonia it took several testing and that the morning fasting ammonia was not so reliable ..uff this damned methylation cicle is so difficult to understand :(

    anyway merry christmas everybody
  4. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

    Messages:
    5,887
    Likes:
    7,975
    Amersfoort, Netherlands
    I'm not aware of Yasko publishing any scientific findings on the matter. The confusion seems to arise from Yasko equating research regarding half of the gene chopped off in a bioengineered yeast with the results of having a common allele on a single SNP. It doesn't make any sense.
  5. caledonia

    caledonia

    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes:
    1,315
    Cincinnati, OH, USA
    Have you seen Rich Vank's Methylation Pathways Panel interpretation? (see my links). He says if SAM + SAH is below 268 you could have a CBS problem. Yours is above 268.

    Also you have the minor CBS mutation, A360A. Generally people with that mutation don't have problems. I've only heard of one case, which is the Heartfixer. Although having BHMTs is supposed to exacerbate the situation and even cause a CBS problem if you don't have the SNP.

    Recheck the urine sulfate over several days and see if it stays consistently high, not going up and down. If it stays consistently high, that's an indication of CBS.

    Then retry the methyl supps at very very low doses and see if there is a dose you can tolerate. See my Start Low and Go Slow doc for more info.

    =-=-=-==
    So in my situation, my SAM + SAH was below 268, I had the major mutation CBS C677T plus all the BHMTs. My sulfate was consistently high over several days. My ammonia was normal. I couldn't tolerate methylcobalamin even in a dose as small as 1mcg without getting a stress/anxiety reaction.

    So at that point I gave up and did a CBS protocol for three months. I've been able to tolerate up to 50mcg of methylcobalamin since then, the only limitation being the rate of metal detox symptoms (flu-like symptoms) getting too uncomfortable, so I'm holding it to 16mcg. But no more stress/anxiety reaction.
    Radio likes this.
  6. DREBS

    DREBS

    Messages:
    18
    Likes:
    1
    Texas
    Caledonia… Ok So my posting was a little hard to read I bundled all my +/+ together I have MOA +/+/.…..CBS c699t +/+ and SHMT +/+. My Urine sulfate is high… my Methionine is high… my Homocystine went from 7 to 12. I definitely need to be on the CBS protocol as well as a low methionine diet. Just curious what CBS protocol did you use that helped you??
  7. caledonia

    caledonia

    Messages:
    2,727
    Likes:
    1,315
    Cincinnati, OH, USA
    I used the Heartfixer protocol except I used the Free Thiol diet (much easier than the low sulfur diet), and didn't do any Yasko RNAs. Links to these are in my signature.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page