New Atmosphere, New Vision: Gibson and Whittemore Kick Off Invest in ME Conference 2016
Mark Berry reports on Dr. Gibson's introduction and Dr. Whittemore's keynote speech, at the 11th Invest in ME International ME Conference in London.
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Carnitine + lipoic acid

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by sillysocks84, Oct 17, 2015.

  1. sillysocks84

    sillysocks84 Senior Member

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    Many of us know carnitine helps produce energy in the mitochondria, this article took it a step further and discussed the significance of adding lipoic acid.

    "Dynamic Duo: Carnitine and Lipoic Acid


    There is no question that supplementing with any carnitine formulation enhances the mitochondrial use of fatty acids, thus making more energy available to cells and tissues, enhancing their various functions,5 and slowing the mitochondrial damage that leads to aging.2,6,7

    However, the very increase of electron flow associated with this more efficient use of fatty acid energy may itself lead to increased formation of reactive oxygen species.2 The solution to this dilemma, according to a research review released in 2002, is co-supplementation with lipoic acid.

    Lipoic acid is a natural cofactor for a mitochondrial enzyme that is critical in breaking down fatty acids, which may further enhance cellular energy efficiency. In addition, lipoic acid is a potent antioxidant that increases intracellular levels of vitamin C and glutathione, which are powerful antioxidants in their own right.8,9

    By adding lipoic acid to carnitine, scientists have reversed age-related decline in laboratory animals while further reducing oxidative stress.2 This "one-two punch" of carnitine and lipoic acid helps to knock out the oxidative stress that occurs with high energy utilization."

    I wonder who here takes these together regularly, and does it help significantly?

    Link below.
     
  2. sillysocks84

    sillysocks84 Senior Member

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  3. sillysocks84

    sillysocks84 Senior Member

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    I like how lipoic acid is a precursor to Vit C and gluthathione, which may also help mast cells stabilize.
     
  4. halcyon

    halcyon Senior Member

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    There is at least one study showing ME patients are deficient in carnitine. I've been meaning to try it again but I've found it too stimulating in the past.
     
  5. sillysocks84

    sillysocks84 Senior Member

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    Interesting. By stimulating do you mean you felt wired? Do you remember if you started on a low or normal dose?
     
  6. halcyon

    halcyon Senior Member

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    Yeah just an uncomfortable feeling. I think I was trying 250 mg.
     
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  7. sillysocks84

    sillysocks84 Senior Member

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    Ok, thanks @halcyon I'll keep that in mind.
     
  8. trails

    trails

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    New Hampshire
    I use Nature's Bounty Acetyl L-Carnitine (400mg) which also contains Alpha Lipoic Acid (200mg). It is the most effective supplement I take. Benefits to both brain fog and energy. Not a cure-all, but I definitely do worse without it. I take 3 capsules per day spaced about 4 hours apart.
     
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  9. sillysocks84

    sillysocks84 Senior Member

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    I didn't realize they made them a combo, that's convenient.
     
  10. Mogwai

    Mogwai

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    I took 500mg daily of Acetyl L-Carnitine for a week or so, before I realised it was completely messing with my thyroid!

    I still have no idea why my thyroid is underactive, but I wish I had read the below before buying ALC:

    http://cfstreatment.blogspot.co.nz/p/supplements.html

    CONS. Carnitine is not recommended for patients with low thyroid function, as it interferes with thyroid hormones. Excess amounts of carnitine can cause diarrhea and stomach upset, so start with low doses.

    My stomach was fine, but my skin was flaking off me, and I was beyond cold - wearing heavy winter clothes in close to 30°C heat!
     
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  11. angee111

    angee111

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    I take 1000mg of acetyl L carnitine, twice a day. I also take 300mg x 2 daily. It's one of the only supplements I've found to be noticeably effective in energy/motivation. It's not long lasting, but it helps enough for me to be able to cope with university studies.
     
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  12. Jammy88

    Jammy88 Senior Member

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    Italy
    I use the same supplement, too. :)
     
  13. Bansaw

    Bansaw Senior Member

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    I have spent thousands of $ on supplements but only about two I can say, hand on heart, have had a noticeable affect: Zypan, and Aceytl-L-Carnitine.
    I get my ALCAR from Bulk Supplements and dissolve it in water. It helps rid me of brain fog and sharpens me mentally.
    I might look at adding Lipoic. I suppose there is no difference between Lipoic and Alpha Lipoic Acid?
     
  14. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    I'm curious if you have any amalgam fillings @trails ?

    Some 'experts' out there contend that ALA chelates mercury and other heavy metals and is dangerous to take, yet there have been folks here who have done fine w/ALA even with fillings in their mouth.
     
  15. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    There's no difference between the two @Bansaw.
     
  16. Sam7777

    Sam7777 Senior Member

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    It's not worth the risk to take ALA wrong if you suspect you might have metals. It is a pain to take it 8 times a day. . but safer than sorry. Of course a lot of people here don't have metals, but a good chunk do and may not know.

    I didn't have 'chronic fatigue' per say until after I took ALA incorrectly.

    People w/o metal issues would do better with pure RLA too.
     
  17. trails

    trails

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    @dannybex, I do have my share of amalgam fillings. Apparently the ALA hasn't caused me a problem with respect to mercury since I still find the supplement among the most effective I take.
     
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  18. MeSci

    MeSci ME/CFS since 1995; activity level 6?

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    I take this UK supplement of Alpha lipoic acid 200mg and Acetyl-L-Carnitine HCl 250mg (one a day). After the first dose I had a dramatic reduction in leg ache and fatigue plus lightening of mood, but it didn't last. It was a good kind of energy, and I got really excited, thinking that it was a breakthrough. I then had a mild headache for part of a few days, and now I don't notice anything when I take it. It may help, but I don't know!
     
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  19. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    Thanks @trails. Very interesting. Also curious how long you've been taking the supp?
     
  20. trails

    trails

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    I've been taking it since about April of this year. At this point, the daily benefits are less discernible,,,probably because it has become my new "normal". However, my symptoms deteriorate pretty quickly (and significantly) if I stop taking it, then improve again upon re-start.
     
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