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Can someone please explain one big folate cycle step to me

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by undcvr, Jul 15, 2013.

  1. undcvr

    undcvr Senior Member

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    If you look at the step where 5 methyl HTF enters the methylation cycle, it needs to interact with methylB12 to change homocysteine to methionine. This step always puzzles me bcos on the face of it, it looks like the cycle does not need the methyl group from folate becos methylb12 is already supplying the methyl group. So it looks like a transfer of the methyl group from 5 methylTHF to methyl B12 (which already has a methyl group). In other words, from most of the diagrams that I have seen, the rxn will go thru w/o the need for methylfolate or at least folate in its methyl form. I read somewhere that that methyl b12 'acts like a shuttle'. I don't know what that means. Further I have tried using formylfolate (folinic acid) before and the experience is very different. Some diagrams also have MTR as a catalyze/enzyme to this reaction ? What is that ?

    Also one more question can I assume that the uptake of methyl folate and methyl b12 in this cycle is 1:1 ? Thanks in advance.
  2. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Undcvr,

    MeCbl acts sort of as a catalyst. It starts and ends the process with the methyl group. It is this recycling that some people see as evidence we can use HyCbl, using the recycle part without supplying the original methyl group and gradually a person becomes a depleted methylator, unable to convert non-active cobalamins to the active MeCbl and from there the active AdoCbl. When this depleted state happens, the original effectiveness of HyCbl and/or CyCbl disappears and partial methylation block happens, as far as I can tell. 100mcg absorbed of active B12 (MeCbl and AdoCbl) can require 15mg a day or more of methylfolate depending upon how the other folates; folinic acid, folic acid and veggie folates are processed genetically or otherwise.

    The diagrams vary depending upon the ASSUMTIONS of what folates and cobalamins are present. The simplest and most direct ones assume MeCbl and methylfolate. Then they don't need all the extra steps and loops to make the required active forms requiring ATP, enzymes and methyl groups to do so and is subject to deadlock non-functioning from lack of any of the Deadlock Quartet.
  3. undcvr

    undcvr Senior Member

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    thanks for the reply one thing I am noticing from this is that my mfolate requirement can be pretty high, like 45mg a day high. I take decent amounts of nac and mb12 too to go with this.
  4. undcvr

    undcvr Senior Member

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    I take about 15mg of methylfolate about 3X a day with very good results, I take 5mg of mb12 along with it for a ratio of 3:1. Is this sufficient to avoid methyl trapping ?

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