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Breathing.

Discussion in 'General Symptoms' started by Fuzzyhead, Dec 16, 2016.

  1. Fuzzyhead

    Fuzzyhead Senior Member

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    Does anyone else feel like they can't get a full breath? I think it's anxiety but it scares me every time. I feel like it's hard work to breath and the back of my throat feels like when i have been exercising hard. (Don't know if that makes sense?)
     
    Monarda likes this.
  2. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member

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    This has been one of my most concerning symptoms, long-term.

    To me, it feels like I am taking a full and complete breath -- that my lungs are expanding all the way, in other words -- but that this still isn't enough air. I did extensive health diary work to determine if this symptom was related to anxiety and I determined that it is related to:
    • weather
    • time of year
    • hormonal cycle
    • immediate environment / air quality
    ...but not whether something had been stressful in the past 24 hours.

    I can tell when it's coming long before I breathing is noticeably difficult, because my rib cage aches: I attribute this to trying to take deeper breaths than is 'normal'.

    Eventually, I also figured out this was related to:
    • food allergies!
    ...particularly milk. Dropped milk and the issue didn't drop off my radar, but it became so much easier to breathe! Apart from that, it may well be a cell metabolism issue for me.

    I take Vitex agnus-castus to help regulate hormones, but it's also reputed to be a mitochondrial protectant, and an anti-inflammatory specific to the lungs. It is one of those supplements I (maybe literally) can't live without. If I drop it a few days in a row, the problem has 100% returned.

    The other thing that I've noticed has helped is high doses of Coenzyme Q10. That makes me think it's a cell metabolism issue, in part. If your cellular respiration, which requires oxygen, is flagging, your body may be sending you signals saying you're suffocating... even when too little oxygen isn't actually the problem.

    Just my 2 cents -- be well aware that coenzyme Q10 is really a cofactor in cellular respiration and Vitex has some research saying it does the above, but the connection to ME and why these work is based on my own speculation.

    -J
     
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  3. Monarda

    Monarda

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    I would describe it differently. Sometimes I am so exhausted that I can feel the energy I use with each breath. Sometimes I even feel I don’t have the energy to draw another breath, scary!

    For me it’s not related to anything but exhaustion, so tired I have to plan my steps to the fridge or bathroom, I don’t have the energy to waste a single step or motion. This is why I keep peanut butter and crackers on my kitchen table. At times like these directions on a microwave dinner are too complicated. I simply watch the shadows creep across my walls as the sun moves across the sky, willing myself to breath.

    Yes, I understand what you are describing... :(
     
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  4. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Senior Member

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    Anxiety can make it worse, but I don't think it's anxiety that's the primary issue.

    I have experienced this as well, even during times of total relaxation. I'm now "anxious" to try high doses of Co-Q10 as mentioned above.;)
     
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  5. justy

    justy Donate Advocate Demonstrate

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    I had a lot of breathing issues until I was finally diagnosed with MCAS. being on meds for that illness, plus using a mask if around chemicals/perfumes, if able to clean I no longer have any breathing issues at all

    Two years ago I spent three months sitting in a chair struggling for each breath, the Drs could find nothing worng with me, but we now know it was caused by the MCAS - it was VERY scary.
     
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  6. PatJ

    PatJ far and free I gaze

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    I used to feel this quite often until I realized it was related to OI, low BP, and staying upright too long. Since I have been bedbound so much more I haven't had this problem unless I stay up too long. If OI is the cause for you then it might be related to lack of blood in the upper organs.

    When this effect happens I don't get any feeling at the back of my throat but do have the inability to take a deep or satisfying breath. Sometimes I can sneak a deeper breath by suddenly inhaling. Lying down is the best remedy since the breathing problems are a sign that my body needs to lie down so the blood can circulate properly.
     
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  7. Dechi

    Dechi Senior Member

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    Yes, I had that about 10 days ago, and it lasted 4-5 days. In my case it was anxiety driven, but it took ,e a while to realize it. The more I stressed over it, the worse it was.
     
  8. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member

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    I know I have POTS, but when I lie down I feel worse, like I'm fighting against a weight on my chest. (Sounds like congestive heart failure, I know. But so obv not!) It does seem to get better when I'm less active, though. When it was worst, I'd go lie down, but propped up on a bunch of pillows.
     
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  9. Webdog

    Webdog Nothing left to say

    Low-dose Naltrexone (LDN) helped my breathing and other ANS symptoms. I'm currently on LDN 9mg/day.

    I didn't notice the benefit until I had reached 4.5mg.
     
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  10. PatJ

    PatJ far and free I gaze

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    Could your BP have risen when lying down to cause that effect? Some people can't lie down when they take too much of certain BP raising meds because their BP rises too much when they lie down.

    I don't have POTS. The closest description I can find is 'Orthostatic narrowing of pulse pressure' which means that when I'm upright, my pulse pressure gradually narrows and my heart rate very slowly rises to try to compensate for lack of blood in my upper body. My BP when lying down averages 80/50. It rises a little when upright but then the narrowing of pulse pressure starts. I can be upright for roughly 45 mins before other symptoms (such as the start of shallower breathing) warn me that I need to lie down for at least an hour before I can be upright again.
     
  11. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member

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    I shouldn't, but sometimes I use OI and POTS interchangeably! (oops) For those who aren't sure what I mean, POTS is a kind of orthostatic intolerance. It's the kind I have, so sometimes I use it more generally than I should.

    I just read that high blood pressure when lying down is a sign of adrenal insufficiency! (What? Why?)

    I also encountered this: "However, people with postural hypotension due to neurological disorders usually have higher blood pressure when lying down." (Okay... why?)

    This also happens in something called autonomic dysreflexia, which occurs after a spinal cord injury. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=autonomic dysreflexia

    Interesting -- might be something to look into for that small but significant percentage of us whose issues started after a serious injury.

    -J
     
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  12. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    Whenever I have the "asthma" feeling (and I don't have asthma) I know it is from salicylates / phenols / nitrates. Estradiol is a phenol... I think Vitex inhibits aromatase and lowers estradiol production.

    The only things that help me with salicylates (plant hormones) is magnesium oxide and B5. Phenols deplete B1, and there will be a need to replenish it, but I have not yet ascertained whether B1 directly helps with food allergies.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2016
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  13. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member

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    But this blows my mind @Gondwanaland ! Phenols would be in every fruit and every veggie! How would it be possible to avoid such a thing?

    Estrogen is lowest right before menses, which is when my breathing problems are worst. We'd be seeing a drop in breathing problems at that time if this were the case. When I take Vitex, it helps with this.

    But salicylates are really ubiquitous too.

    Cite!

    I know you've done lots of research on this stuff, but I'm a primary source kind of gal. ;) <3

    -J
     
  14. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I don't think anyone should avoid them, but must be careful if deficient in nutrients that help to process them.

     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2016
  15. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member

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    p. 31
    Heat-stable thiamine antagonists occur in several plants; ferns, tea, betel nut. They include polyphenols; these and related compounds are found in blueberries, red currants, red beets, brussel sprouts, red cabbage, betel nuts, coffee and tea (Hilker and Somogyi, 1982). They react with thiamine to yield the non-absorbable thiamine disulfide. In addition, some flavonoids have been reported to antagonize thiamine as well as haemin in animal tissues. (See Table 15).

    I see; thank you @Gondwanaland -- I just don't see how a human could avoid polyphenols in the diet. I guess as they say, you might want to avoid drinking strong coffee with your vitamins, but polyphenols and phenol-based compounds are impossible to avoid altogether.

    :)

    -J
     
  16. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    Food for thought.
     
  17. JaimeS

    JaimeS Senior Member

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    V. interesting @Gondwanaland! But I don't see any mention of phenols or polyphenols there, and what the carbohydrate-rich foods mentioned have most in common (or at least on the surface of things) would appear to be their carb content. It is super-fascinating that this seems to decrease signs of autoimmunity though -- I wonder why?

    Here is their explanation:

     

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