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BMJ new paper : claims internet CBT successfully treats ME (!)

Discussion in 'Latest ME/CFS Research' started by Countrygirl, Feb 2, 2018.

  1. Countrygirl

    Countrygirl Senior Member

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    http://www.cambridge.org.https.sci-...rolled-trial/5D0DAAB8740D23688778FD2239317101

    I hesitate to post this on the research forum, but for what it is worth.

    This is a new paper just published in the BJ of Psychiatry which reports the successful treatment of ME with internet CBT.


    :bang-head::ill::depressed:
     
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  2. boombachi

    boombachi Senior Member

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    I am waiting for internet based get or Virtual Reality get :D
     
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  3. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member

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    If virtual reality GET worked I would be cured. I am very active, as a computer toon, in many games.

    What objective evidence of improvement or recovery might they provide? How do they excuse not doing that?
     
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  4. Countrygirl

    Countrygirl Senior Member

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    This rings a distant bell @alex3619 . Didn't some UK bright spark of a psych suggest that a programme of video game playing would cure ME?
     
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  5. boombachi

    boombachi Senior Member

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    A suitable measure of virtual graded exercise would of course be an increase in the amount of virtual steps that can be taken.
     
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  6. Mary

    Mary Senior Member

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    This is so awful ..... not much I can say but ARRGGHHHH!!!!! :bang-head::aghhh::nervous::sluggish:
     
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  7. Soup Dragon

    Soup Dragon

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    Does anyone know what diagnostic criteria/criterion they used? Was it "feeling a bit tired for a few weeks"? ;)
     
  8. alkt

    alkt Senior Member

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    it seems that the bmj is now just another rag that will print any old rubbish without checking on anything inconvenient like scientifically proven facts.
     
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  9. Sundancer

    Sundancer Senior Member

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    Holland
    Yep, those are the Dutch psychobabbleboys... One of them sat on the committee that doles out funds for research, all the 2 million for ME research went to his group... and none to proposals for real medical research. ( this is some years ago)

    A version for the public, hailing the the internettherapie has been published today on the website of one of our academic medic centra. Sneering at patient-associations who "claim that CBT is not effective and unsafe and that some people get more complaints doing this therapy".

    De onderzoekers concluderen dat gedragstherapie via het internet veilig en effectief is. Zij denken dat nog meer CVS/ME-patiënten kunnen profiteren van behandeling door een intensievere vervolgtherapie aan te bieden aan patiënten die na de internet therapie onvoldoende verbeterd zijn.

    the researchers conclude that CBT via the internet is safe and effective. They think that even more CFS/ME patients can have profit from this therapy by giving an intensive continuation to patents who have not enough improvement from the internet therapy.

    so...first they say it is effective, and then they give intensive continuation therapy for those patients who did not miraculously cure themselves... yay, that's a nice way to get working hours for psychologists isn't it.

    Pays well, when you have a job at an recognized hospital.
     
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  10. Sundancer

    Sundancer Senior Member

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    looking through this paper

    for measuring fatigue they used the Checklist Individual Strength, this is a list of 20 questions to be answered on a likertscale ( seven circles and make black the one that fits best to your idea,) I think it has a good validity, but...it is of course totally subjective.

    the questions are arranged in four groups
    subjective tiredness,( like I feel tired)
    concentration, ( like I have trouble to get my attention focussed)
    motivation ( like, i do not feel to do anything)
    bodily activity , this is the only objective measure, but from the 20 questions there are only 3 measuring this..

    this questionnaire is created by the some of the same people as the paper mentioned here.

    They say it is good for both the clinical practice and for research. I doubt the last one, but for clinical practice I deem it good.

    It thus has the same problem as other research, there is no objective measure used. Methinks when you use this scale for instance in a clinical practice, it can give a doctor a quick insight in whether a patient is stuck on a level, or going forward/backward.( all patients with fatigue I mean, for instance an older person recovering from an operation, or cancer and chemo. It is used for that)

    But to use a scale like this after
    iCBT consisted of seven modules aimed at change of fatigue-related behaviours and beliefs.9
    is in my eyes decidly not valid, i scanned the rest but became nauseous
     
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  11. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member

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    They only used the fatigue subscale of the Checklist Individual Strength questionnaire not the other sections.

    However in this study they did actually report the results of actigraphy/actometers and there was a benefit found for Internet-based CBT.
     
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  12. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member

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    This is in the British Journal of Psychiatry not the BMJ.
     
  13. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member

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    CDC/Fukuda criteria. Though 6 of the 240 didn't satisfy it.
     
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