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A Little Poisoning Along the Road to ME/CFS
Looking at my symptoms, many of which are far less these days and some are gone, it would be easy to figure that I'd just been dealing with some heavy-duty menopausal issues.
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Big Mistake, Conspiracy, or Nothing Unusual?

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by toddm1960, Apr 2, 2011.

  1. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    Hi Kurt,

    Your location says "USA. Earth" but your post sounds like you are on Mars today...little poke for the B12 comment...I happen to like B12 with a few other vitamins.

    Should I just believe John Boehner, Michelle Bachman, Mitch McConnell, and think they are implementing everything in the public interest?

    How about the Banksters? Should everybody just ignore the fact the banks don't have titles when they foreclose on somebody's house? And there are not really multiple people working for the mortage servicers named "Linda Green" Forging loan documents being paid $10 an hour?

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/04/01/60minutes/main20049646.shtml?tag=contentMain;cbsCarousel

    Should I just Believe that BP's previous CEO, Steven Koonin, doesn't now work for Dr Steven Chu of the department of Energy as the undersecretary for science??? Steven Koonin had no influence with how BP was treated for their spill in the Gulf?

    http://motherjones.com/blue-marble/2010/05/steven-chus-ties-bp

    Should I really believe that the situation in Tunusia, Egypt, and Lybia(all contiguous countries on the sea south of France) is all humanitarian? And everybody is just Hunky Dori in Dafur, North Korea, and the Ivory Coast?

    Should I just believe the US health care law was written by Politicians lawyers and with no influence from lobbyists for the health care industry?

    The US and UK are not the most powerful countries on this planet because it allows a bunch of politicians to make the rules and laws. The whole government is managed by lobbyists, Think tanks, and independent agencies like the CIA, and pentagon, chamber of commerce, that operate without elected officials and with little input from congress or the senate.

    Planet Earth is now nothing like "Leave it to Beaver" on TV that government officials all want us to believe it is....

    I'm on a planet that believes the US/UK are on top of the world for a reason. 330+ million people control the other 6 billion? No accident. It takes careful planning and influence by smarter people than Michelle Bachman, Eric Kantor, and Sarah Palin. I have no delusions that each agency has careful oversight to get desired outcomes.

    All this doesn't happen by accident.

    (edit) Money has been ruled free speech by the supreme court.

    The head of the CDC is going or has gone to work at a vaccine manufacturer.

    Have no delusions about the influential power of reciprocity..
     
  2. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    Now that I re-read your post Kurt, I have a new thought for who the most problematic group might be. It's probably the drug company lobbyists who have systematically abused us patients.

    I seriously doubt that many people are being abused by medical doctors. Those are mostly good people, even if many are only reading the CDC psychobabble studies.

    I think the politicians(authorities) are the fuzzy bunnies, and that vaccine maker lobbyists, and big pharma lobbyists, are the wolves guarding the fuzzy bunny pen.

    Not to mention the incestuous revolving door policy between governments and corporations that is problematic for us abused patients.
     
  3. justinreilly

    justinreilly Stop the IoM & P2P! Adopt CCC!

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    I agree about the vested interests.

    Gag agreements in settlements are standard these days, I assume they were then. They are controversial, but legal. A gag agreement doesn't, by itself, necessarily mean that there was or was not something nefarious to hide. There certainly could be something wrong they were trying to hide, but the mere fact that there was a gag agreement, by itself, isn't suspicious to me.
     
  4. justinreilly

    justinreilly Stop the IoM & P2P! Adopt CCC!

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    I agree with you, Cloud. In the US, it seems to me that CDC and later NIH were mostly incompetent, sexist and criminally negligent, then those working on ME there eventually realized they were wrong, but couldn't go back mostly because they had misappropriated the whole "CFS" budget at CDC for years and lied about it to Congress year after year. So, to me, that is clearly a conspiracy.

    I don't know enough about the UK situation, but it seems to me it is a cottage industry for psychiatrists who get perks, posts, publishing and prizes arranged by insurers. It is beyond doubt they know exactly what they are doing. I would think this awareness arose in the very beginning of their work or not that long there-after.

    As to whether government agency and executive branch brass in each country knew and know the scam, that's definitely harder to assess. I would say in the US, probably at some point since patients have been protesting so long about it. I would think the evidence produced in the government reports of CDC "CFS" program malfeasance and nonfeasance in addition to the continued patient protests, including the fastidious documentation in Osler's Web (just it's existence, even if it were not read), and the bona fide scientific evidence and the ridiculously low levels of funding together would make any reasonable NIH and CDC brass investigate what was going on, rather than just accepting the word of Bill Reeves and Stephen Straus. The agency brass are politicians but they're also scientists, and hopefully public servants. I can't believe there wasn't any funny business at the top levels of CDC and NIH, certainly after 2000 when the government reports came out.

    In the UK, whose govt treats pwME even worse than the US, I think the case is stronger for one because of the extent of the official misinformation and maltreatment; because they are so at odds with the science (and probably common-sense). Though to some extent, this may be partially explained by the cognitive biases of groupthink, etc. pointed out by urbantravels.

    On balance though, the fact that the UK govt has so highly classified its documents on ME, way way beyond anything reasonable if the UK govt had not done something wrongful to cause ME, it's spread, denial and/or mistreatment, makes me land on the side of conspiracy at some point by the UK govt. This is a smoking gun to me. Sometimes the circumstantial evidence is so strong, we can reliably infer something despite not having any direct evidence. Res Ipsa Loquitor; the thing speaks for itself; 'nuff said.

    Even harder to tell is whether there was some kind of conscious cover-up emanating from the top levels of the agencies and executive branch down from the very beginning. This would have happened in the case the US govt did something nefarious like manufacturing biological weapons which caused ME or just realized ME could possibly be caused by a pathogen present in vaccines produced by the government. I think there isn't much evidence of which we are aware for this scenario; though that doesn't mean it didn't occur; it may just mean that the evidence has not yet been produced (that the evidence, if it exists, has successfully been hidden).
     
  5. justinreilly

    justinreilly Stop the IoM & P2P! Adopt CCC!

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    I've got to agree. We need to keep voicing the reasonable big-picture conclusions that can be solidly derived from the facts (eg CDC and NIH have always tried to crush ME science and patients) as well as the facts themselves. Unfortunately, most people, including me, are not equipped to evaluate medical and science data well. ME patients have to do it for them (in addition too presenting the facts).
     
  6. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    Dr Kenneth Friedman illustrates the hassle he is getting from a previous university for research into CFS. He also describes what sounds like outright retaliation from the Government and the university. Too crazy not to watch. Unbelievable.

    [video=youtube;KhB-701-BMU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhB-701-BMU&feature=player_embedded#at=349[/video]
     
  7. Cloud

    Cloud Guest

    I highly recommend the book "Vaccine-A", by Gary Matsumoto. The book is primarily about GWI, but the similarities directly and indirectly relating to our situation, are quite disturbing. It's not only the well known common symptoms we share, but also the same Gov involvement with disguising the truth behind the "all in your head mass hysteria" smoke screen. And here too, it is done in spite of huge amounts of blatant evidence of biological disease. The book IMO, makes it quite clear that these are common tactics used by our Gov health agencies and military, to deliberately disguise the truth about the cause and truth of these diseases. One can also see that Stephen Straus, and the NIH had to of been fully aware way back that CFS was a true physical disease and not a Psych disorder. The book has many more similarities directly and indirectly related to CFS that will allow one to develop a more informed opinion about certain "conspiracy theories". Gary Matsumoto is an investigative journalistic using records, interviews, and factual data to support his thesis.
     
  8. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    http://www.burzynskimovie.com/

     
  9. toddm1960

    toddm1960 Senior Member

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    If anyone has any high profile media or celeb connections it would be nice to forward them this video link. I can't believe even with the limited media coverage it has gotten that the story didn't blow up more. Guess that's what happens when the governement wants to cover things up.
     
  10. Mya Symons

    Mya Symons Mya Symons

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    I am not sure there is any conspiracy or coverup. I have met enough doctors in my lifetime to know they come with some pretty large egos. I imagine the scientist ego is even bigger. I think they are just so convinced they are right that they can't see anything else.

    They don't have to cover anything up. They have known about the posibility of murine viruses (or fragments of murine viruses) in vaccines for years and thought they were harmless to humans and still think they are harmless to us. They really do believe XMRV is a one time freak lab contaminant and it can't be found in humans. They are 100% convinced they are correct and; thus, have nothing to hide. They are just too important to be wrong (what they think anyway).

    Oh yes, one more thing: They really do believe that CFS/ME and FMS are psychosomatic diseases. My doctor is one of them and I can tell you for sure she really really believes her theories are the right ones, even though she does not have these diseases herself. She wrote her thesis on it. And, if anyone tells her different, she will tell them off. It is an insult to her and her years of schooling. Not a thought goes into what those ideas do to us.
     
  11. ggingues

    ggingues $10 gift code at iHerb GAS343 of $40

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    Wow, I realize you might not have much of a selection, but can you find a different doctor? How can a Dr like that be of any value?

    GG
     
  12. Levi

    Levi Senior Member

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  13. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    Hi Mya,

    To me actions speak louder than words. The actions of various agencies has proven, over a long time, there is a conspiracy. Not everybody is involved, most are manipulated. You can also watch the videos and read the links and stuff in this thread. The Dr Kenneth Friedman video is short and sweet.

    I think most doctors just implement what is on the CDC website and actually want to help. However, if you believe that the CDC can be manipulated by big pharma in a way politicians are often manipulated. Than Houston, we have a problem.

    Even many researchers are paralyzed at the thought the "science" the they are using has been contaminated. Contaminated by a select few.

    Subtle Information and opinions are often spoon fed to the public thru television, news, and other forms on media. Stuff so clever, most people can't even realize it. See the news clip below and the thread that explains it. Pretty dang clever eah?

    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/showthread.php?12449-MSNBC-Today-Show-Segment

    BUT read this thread as a perfect example of how the definition of our disease has been cleverly and scientifically adjusted for the special interests. So clever, many researchers and doctors probably can't see it without knowing our unique history. It turns ME into CFS back in the 80's. The 80's is when it all started.

    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/show...e-difference-between-ME-and-CFS-to-the-public


    Also,

    Have you read the "dear sirs, I am sick.pdf" on Hillary Johnson's Osler's web? In which the lead researcher at the CDC, responsible for overseeing the ME outbreak investigations was basically making a big joke out of CFS and patients back in the 1980's?

    http://www.oslersweb.com/

    Right from the very beginning the CDC's policy was obvious. I haven't seen the CDC come out and apologize or do any meaningful research for 30 years while autism has spiraled out of control from 1 in ? to 1 in 68? Have you?

    Even worse than that they have been doing research to make us seem depressed, lazy, crazy, etc...etc... to deny benefits.

    That's a brief introduction, I could ramble on all day if I had the energy. Many patients here get it, many are too sick and avoid the stress of commenting though. Not a fun topic.

    take care,
    Markmc20001
     
  14. SilverbladeTE

    SilverbladeTE Senior Member

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    Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
    See the US/Uk governments actions against Gulf War Syndrome
    Most telling is the documentary interview with the former US SEAL, who after leaving active duty, went to work in the US veterans administration to help his fellow servicefolk
    he ended up in the department dealing with Gulf War SYndrome and found ot his horror a deliberate policy to silence, lie, and deny any help or serious scientific investigations into the syndrome and screw over the victims as the were "inconvenient" to high levels of government, for some reason.

    Some people either know or just suspect and fear something and want it hushed up at ANY cost.
    My own supiscion is that these illnesses are linked to vaccines, and hence the Power Elite are ruthlessly determined ot cover it up as they'd be crucified, literally for damaging millions of children.
    Vaccine industry is worth about $50 billion/annum
    In the US, pharma corps are the biggest lobbying group, they spend $2 billion a year on lobbying government alone, fourt time smore than the oil industry!

    The blinkered hubris around vaccines is insane. Yes, they are one of the few viable treatments for viral disease. yes they are potentially fanastic life savers.
    BUT...there are many, many problems the very poorly-scientific and practically aware medical community will even deign to think about, they are as bloody blinkered as freakin' pit ponies! :/
    "Vaccines are God's gift they CANNOT cause harm!" is the mantra, bull ****** ****!! Multiple injections of severe immune reponse reactive materials, some live viruses even, and potential for contamination and reactions/pahtogens we as yet are scientificlaly ignorant of...is a catastrophy waiting to happen.
    How bloody often have we seen "miracle cures!" turn out to have catastrophic problems in the long term?
    They think that because somehting gives a benefit, that outweighs ANY potential harm, in fact, they refuse ot even accept they could cause harm...:rolleyes:

    Another possibility (or synergistic issue) is organopshosphates: we've been spraying nerve gas on our food for 60 years, only now have they begun to admit that, duh!! those chemicals are much more poisonous than they stupidly told us, and they have very severe immune-system effects. Those exposed to high levels of organophosphates often develop multiple chemical sensitivity or suddenly develop a severe allergic reaction to somehting they didn't have before. And note, MCS is another illness the Weasel-types claimed was "Psychosomatic"...and guess what? they were WRONG, AGAIN!
    Well no sh*t Sherlock! that was kind of damn obvious, DUH!
    But, again, the industry is so vast powerful and in-bed with government it's a culture of denial.

    At the end of World 2, the US took the German's store of Sarin nerve gas, and the British took the Tabun.
    The British dumped 14,000 TONS of Tabun nerve gas in the sea NW of Ireland (and around 2 million tons of munitions in a sea trench 15 miles between the Irish and Scottish coasts), the Americans likewise dumped huge quantities of Sarin and VX nerve gas in the seas off their coast.
    Several governments disposed of other German poison gas stock piles in the Skagerrak between Denmark and Sweden.
    The potential risk is obvious and...suicidally stupid.
    For those in America, look up the case of World War1 chemical weapons, Lewisite gas, being dug up in building work in Washington DC.

    Human beings in groups, ie government, big business etc, become *INCREDIBLY* stupid :(
     
  15. Mya Symons

    Mya Symons Mya Symons

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    She believes that trauma causes pain so prescribes pain medicines and that is why I go and see her. I've tried many doctors and 99% of them didn't want anything to do with me because of the CFS and FMS. She is the best I can do, unfortunately.
     
  16. justinreilly

    justinreilly Stop the IoM & P2P! Adopt CCC!

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    That's so great for us that he came out publically! Some government workers have morals.

    Are you referring to the Beyond Treason documentary?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9iRxiQoZjI

    Didn't know *that* much money was involved. It makes me suspect vaccines and the like even more now.

    I agree that the level of unscientific denial is ridiculous.
     
  17. SilverbladeTE

    SilverbladeTE Senior Member

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    Somewhere near Glasgow, Scotland
    Justin
    no it's in this documentary
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-475226309740846580#
    GULF WAR SYNDROME - Killing Our Own
    [video=google;-475226309740846580]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-475226309740846580#[/video]


    Pharma corps
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pharmaceutical_industry#Controversy_about_drug_mar keting_and_lobbying
    wish I had kept link of article where they claimed the $2 billion figure, because there's a whole load going on we don't see
     
  18. Enid

    Enid Senior Member

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    I think it's the infiltration of the psychiatric "profession" that is scary in the UK - could well be termed "conspiracy". It took years for my GP to admit to herself more than me "but you are not mad" (can't remember her exact description). Then too 4 junior Docs in Accident & Emergency following yet another collapse saying "we have a theory - it's all in the mind". So the psyches have penetrated deeply into medical teaching/textbooks. Is this the 21st century one's bound to ask.
     
  19. markmc20001

    markmc20001 Guest

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    more films

    It's common knowledge now.....Cats out of the bag. Two more films


     
  20. justinreilly

    justinreilly Stop the IoM & P2P! Adopt CCC!

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    Big Pharma even got Underdog hooked on "Super-Energy Pills": :D:D
    "The secret compartment of my ring I fill, with an Underdog super energy pill!"
    This abuse of pharmaceuticals was edited out of the shows when I saw them as a kid. Pharma cover-up! :D
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TdbwDfdaoA&feature=related
     

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