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Beginner's Guide: A Roadmap for ME/CFS Testing and Treatment

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by Hip, Jul 25, 2014.

  1. Steve.

    Steve.

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    Hi Hip. Nice document.

    I just read your evidence based document above. I was writing here to ask if you could include natural anti-viral treatments, as according to Wikipedia reference valganciclovir
    anti-fertility effect, which is a real breaker. Plus many alternatives have serious effects, are heavily regulated here, and expensive.

    I was going to originally try silver, vitamin C or olive leaf. The last two have had positive effect on me after weeks (6 weeks vitamin C). But I don't know how much is anti viral, and how much is just health (the olive leaf quickly produces complications somewhere in digestive tract I found.

    Maybe it would be good to do a document entitled "Suggestive anecdotal treatments yet to be researched to completion". Dealing only in natural alternative medicine nutritional treatments. So medical people are not turned off.

    I'm looking up a few things to talk to a doctor about starting a treatment clinic locally. I don't have the time to be much involved myself, but such resources help them step ahead.

    I'm sorry if this has been covered before. Unfortunately there is no thread search function so I can see if this is covered in thread (if there is ever one, it would get good if it had OR and Not (-) and definite (+) operators so you can easily find all posts with any terms.
     
  2. Sushi

    Sushi Moderation Resource Albuquerque

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    Albuquerque
    There is an indirect thread search function that works like this: open any sub-forum and under ""Post new thread" type in a title for a thread that would cover your subject (don't post it though) and the software will show you the titles of any similar threads.
     
  3. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    To my knowledge there are no herbs or supplements that have any decent antiviral effect against the viruses found in ME/CFS.

    I recently spend a few months of solid work trying to find natural antivirals that were effective, but my pharmacokinetic calculations showed that natural antivirals are very weak in comparison to standard pharmaceutical antivirals. I am going to post these pharmacokinetic calculations in a new thread soon. I was doing all that work because I was hoping to find some herbs or supplements with potent effects in vivo, but unfortunately I found none.

    You often see studies finding antiviral effects of herbs in vitro, but when you perform the pharmacokinetic calculation to see what antiviral effect the herb actually has in vivo (in the body), most turn out to be very weak in vivo.


    However, some herbs and supplements have immunomodulatory effect which fight viruses by boosting the immune response, oxymatrine and inosine being good examples, and these are used by ME/CFS doctors to fight viral infection.
     
  4. Steve.

    Steve.

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    Yes, olive leaf extract (green seems best) and vitamin C has that effect. Vitamin C also has a direct attachment effect to I read. But what about changing the pH of the body at the same time? Utlimately the effectiveness is the accumulative effectiveness. So, the suggestive rate of cure of natritional routines of treatment would be a starting place for research. Testing in the lab is fraught due to the amount of variable ways it can be regularly tested.

    Silver was shown to have done sort of effect that way, but I think it is more direct. I make my own for personal use and I can tell you the stuff is temperamental. I have noticed using on skin, it is easy for it to not be really right and loose a effectiveness to varying degress. It can go off effectiveness after making and it is hard to make most effective.

    The basis of silver water (ionic or coloidal) is purity and size of silver particles. Depending if you are going ionic or coloidal, you can make too much non ionic or too much non coloidal. As the particle size increases or are attached with impurities the effectiveness can deteriorate, and varioys nonpure compound recipes have issues.

    Trying to get your water purer is an issue. I've tried many repeat distilling runs to get down impurities, but eventualke concluded the stainless steel distiller (and maybe glass) was crontrubuting and probably defeating the attempt. I have some testing equipment and will try again.

    I have only made some a lot more effective (a number of times). I am looking into making a technique to produce more effective silver. Water purity is still an issue.
     
  5. Steve.

    Steve.

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    Hi Sushi. I meant search in the thread, in post bodies, for a bunch of related terms in individual posts. This helps locate if what you want to discuss has been discussed. I've seen it on forums.
     
  6. Steve.

    Steve.

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    Thanks for the PM sushi. Under the little magnifier.
     
  7. Steve.

    Steve.

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    I've looked up Artesunate, and found it is an compound related to Chinese (sweet) wormwood Hip. Which is interesting, because 20 years ago a herbalist put me on Chinese wormwood and cats claw (etc), which has action in CFS and anti viral. I put the short term gains down to an extract that used grapeseed, green tea and something else (can't remember). They had some other pill that stopped blood cells sticking together.

    The sweet worm wood active ingredient is said to be a lot less effective. But maybe that one might have some action worth future scrutiny.
     

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