BBC1 tonight — Doctor in the House, featuring "chronic fatigue"

[trishrhymes]

Just watched it. Very good program.

One think I noticed was that with both patients he explored past trauma.

But just because he found a possible explanation in the man's case in his period of homelessness, he didn't stop there and assume that was the cause or immediately line him up for therapy.

He continued to look for physiological causes, and found it in a genetically based high homocysteine problem, completely fixed with high dose B vitamins. No more talk of past trauma there!

In the case of the woman with panic attacks, he started with lifestyle changes, and eventually found a therapist she could trust who diagnosed PTSD and was continuing to work with her, but he also continued to work on the diet, alcohol and caffeine issues as well.

No drug treatments for either patient. Very refreshing.

I was going to say I wish he was my doctor, but I'm waiting to see what happens in the ME case later in the series.

 

[ruben]

I suppose this is the key question then. Just how easy is it then for us to go to see our GP and have the blood tests which are as thorough as the bloke in the programme.

 

[Hutan]

Anyone ever had their homocysteine levels checked?

• Homocysteine levels increase in the body when the metabolism to cysteine of methionine to cysteine is impaired. This may be due to dietary deficiencies in vitamin B6, vitamin B12, and folic acid.

• Elevated homocysteine levels affect the interior lining of blood vessels in the body, increasing the risk of atherosclerosis or narrowing of blood vessels. This can result in early heart attack and stroke.

• There is a relationship between the levels of homocysteine in the body and the size of the carotid arteries that supply the brain with blood; the higher homocysteine level, the narrower (stenosed) the carotid artery becomes.

• In pregnancy, homocysteine levels tend to decrease. (i.e. potentially symptoms might be better when pregnant)

Sounds as if a homocysteine test is worth adding to the list of 'things to do'.

 

[mermaid]

Anyone ever had their homocysteine levels checked?

Yes, I had mine done about 3 years ago via a private Dr I was seeing at the time in London. He was a GP with an interest in environmental medicine, and he did a number of tests for me including the mitochondria one that Dr Myhill does with Acumen.

My homocysteine was in the normal range, but only just, so he suggested that I took B12, B6 and folate to bring it down a bit to a better level. I could not afford to go back to him, so don't know what it is like now but I kept up the supplements.

 

[Valentijn]

Sounds as if a homocysteine test is worth adding to the list of 'things to do'.

In the US it's often routine on yearly physicals.

 

[JamesH]

I avoid reading or watching anything related to curable cfs...esp the word "simple"
If theres a ligit cure we would all know about in short order.

Hi... I have to say, I disagree. The problem is that a lot of people being treated for cfs and ME are actually misdiagnosed, and have MTHFR gene mutation! Nearly 40% of the uk population is estimated to suffere from this, and the NHS do not test for it, so just treat symptoms, which are identical to cfs, ME, Depression and even menopause.
The fact is, there is PROBABLY a simple cure for nearly half of people diagnosed and treated to cfs.

 

[Valentijn]

@JamesH - More than 40% have MTHFR mutations. They are very common, and the common ones are easily compensated for by eating a reasonable amount of vegetables or supplementing folate. Those mutations very rarely cause problems, unless there is also a considerable nutritional deficiency - which is difficult when so many foods are fortified with folic acid.

 

[trishrhymes]

symptoms, which are identical to cfs, ME, Depression and even menopause.

Have you read much about the diagnostic criteria for ME? It is unfortunate that a lot of doctors use the discredited Oxford definition of 6 months unexplained fatigue. From what I understand of your symptoms from watching the program, I can see that a doctor might misdiagnose the symptoms described there of excessive sleepiness as ME using that broad and inappropriate definition.

There is a lot of confusion between the tiredness/sleepiness you described and ME fatigue which is a reduced ability of the muscles to produce energy and abnormally prolonged muscle energy recovery time after exercise.

However all the internationally recognised definitions of ME/CFS highlight the hallmark symptom of post-exertional malaise (PEM), which is not just tiredness after exercise, but a prolonged (days or weeks) worsening of all symptoms so that the sufferer feels like they have a bad dose of flu or similar.

Again, from what I remember of the program, you were able to go to the gym and exercise without ill effects, so this should have precluded a diagnosis of ME/CFS.

While I am sorry that you, and probably many others have at some stage been misdiagnosed as having ME, and your experience may be helpful to others like you who have been misdiagnosed, you need to be careful about unsubstantiated claims that a high percentage of people diagnosed with ME can be cured by the same treatment you had.

I'd say this is especially true for members of PR many of whom have had ME for many years and understand that PEM is a hallmark symptom of ME, along with a range of other symptoms.

 

[slysaint]

Have just watched it on iplayer.
It just goes to show how if only the NHS would allow a few more blood tests to be done instead of dumping people into the MUS/mental illness/trauma bucket they could actually find out what is wrong, and help patients.

Homocysteine testing on the NHS:
"Routine screening of homocysteine is not recommended, however this test may be appropriate:-

• In the investigation of younger patients with premature vascular disease in whom there are no obvious risk factors.
• Investigation for suspected infantile homocystinuria
• Confirmation of vitamin B12 deficiency".

 

[MysterA]

Hi all, I've just registered because I came across this thread when trying to find out why the episode about the woman with ME had apparently been pulled from the schedule. I too was looking forward to seeing it but the episode they showed and the one you all watched must have been an older episode they put on instead. One thing's for sure, it wasn't series 2 episode 4. It's not available on BBCi player either and I can't find any explanation why they have decided not to show it. I suspect that the BBC or the doctor himself might be worried about criticism if his advice was at all tainted with the type of ignorance that pervaids most of the medical profession when confronted with us lot. From the clip I seen this might be the case as I saw a woman in tears pleading with the doctor not to tell her that her illness was due to mental issues. Whether this was the woman with ME or the other woman who was supposed to feature in the show I don't know.

Anyway I thought I best inform you all of this and if anyone finds out anything about why the show was cancelled/postponed please let me know. It's intriging to say the least.

 

[MysterA]

I've managed to clear a few things up:

The episode you all watched was series 2 episode 2 (aired 22/05/17) which featured a man with chronic fatigue and sleep problems.
The episode I was looking for (that wasn't aired) was series 2 episode 4 which features a woman with ME, Fibro & other conditions.

This is what the BBC have said on the program's iplayer page: "Due to schedule changes this episode did not broadcast on the 5th June 2017 as planned and will be shown at a later date."

Looks like we will need to wait and see.

 

[trishrhymes]

I've been waiting for that episode too. It may have been pulled because it was due to be broadcast in the week leading up to the election and I think they probably needed to slot in the extra election related broadcasts. I, too am waiting to see how he handles it, given he has done so well with all the other cases in the series, but I can't imagine what treatment he could have found for a patient with ME, since there aren't any.

I've just looked on the website for the program. It says it will be shown at a later date, and there is a short clip from the program showing the doctor getting the household to clear out all snack foods etc so he can put the patient on an elimination diet to 'help sort out her gut issues'. Sound like a good start to me, even if that's all he can do for her. No date given yet for the program to be shown.

 

[MysterA]

Hi Trishrhymes,

Yeah it will be interesting on many levels. As you said he has done well with others and really tries his best to test, research and understand before jumping to conclusions, so I hope I'm wrong about him being 'just like the others'. However, I did see a clip of the woman crying which worries me. But we all know how editing can distort things. So we'll just need to wait and see.

The gut problems are of interest to me too. They're definetely a factor. I've been eating that simple stewed apple recipe he used in the last episode (S3-e3) that is supposed to help improve the variety of benefiial gut microbes and I have to say that I certainly feel some benefit from it. It spaked my interest after he said that a single dose of antibiotic in some people can severely diminish them. So far less IBS symptoms, less brain fog and I've lost some weight. So I'll defo be keeping that up to see how it goes.

 

[veganmua]

Hi... I have to say, I disagree. The problem is that a lot of people being treated for cfs and ME are actually misdiagnosed, and have MTHFR gene mutation! Nearly 40% of the uk population is estimated to suffere from this, and the NHS do not test for it, so just treat symptoms, which are identical to cfs, ME, Depression and even menopause.
The fact is, there is PROBABLY a simple cure for nearly half of people diagnosed and treated to cfs.

I have MTHFR and a few other mutations in methylation related genes. Supplementing with methylfolate, methyl & hydroxycobalamin and other methyl support supplements did little for me. For me, and perhaps many others, I think methylation is just one part of the puzzle.

I watched this episode, and I have to say, I was very surprised this was caught by a regular GP. He even mentioned the genetic mutation (although he didn't mention it by name). I wonder if the doc knew enough to recommend increasing potassium intake while on the supplements? I thought the occasional banana and glass of coconut water would be enough -it wasn't.

 

[Ambrosia_angel]

Hi all, I've just registered because I came across this thread when trying to find out why the episode about the woman with ME had apparently been pulled from the schedule. I too was looking forward to seeing it but the episode they showed and the one you all watched must have been an older episode they put on instead. One thing's for sure, it wasn't series 2 episode 4. It's not available on BBCi player either and I can't find any explanation why they have decided not to show it. I suspect that the BBC or the doctor himself might be worried about criticism if his advice was at all tainted with the type of ignorance that pervaids most of the medical profession when confronted with us lot. From the clip I seen this might be the case as I saw a woman in tears pleading with the doctor not to tell her that her illness was due to mental issues. Whether this was the woman with ME or the other woman who was supposed to feature in the show I don't know.

Anyway I thought I best inform you all of this and if anyone finds out anything about why the show was cancelled/postponed please let me know. It's intriging to say the least.

Interesting. I had a little look myself and I understand what you're saying.

It would've aired this week if it was due to the election. They've ended most of the election shows and it wasn't shown this week? They aired planet earth yesterday during this show's slot which means it's very unlikely that they're gonna air this episode in the same prime time slot again. They would've just got it over with then aired planet earth next week. Next week they are planning on airing another show during the same Mon @ 9pm slot.

It's unlikely that we'll ever find out why but if they did treat her badly then I hope she can bounce back from it soon. I'm not surprised once again. I'm happy that they chose not to air it though because I'd rather people not know anything about ME at all than the same old 'it's all in your head' PACE theory being regurgitate. Especially with millions of people watching! It's annoying to say but it's for the best.

Would you be able to find the clip of the woman being upset ? They only have the fridge clip online. She's the blonde one. Hopefully that will help you figure out whether it was her crying or not.

 

[trishrhymes]

The clip of the woman patient being upset is very briefly shown at the end of the previous program when they are flagging up what's still to come in future programs, I think. I'll go and have another look.

Yep, just checked it's right at the end of program 3.

She's introduced as someone suffering from severe exhaustion and pain, and shown curled up on a sofa.

He say's 'I think it's the fear that's holding you back'

and she, in tears, says 'please don't turn it into... this is because I'm mentally fearful'.

Good for her. Brave lady.

It is indeed a mystery why it hasn't been shown.

 

[SamanthaJ]

Does anyone know what was shown in its place? Programme about the terror attack seems a possibility? If that's so, I don't know why they can't put this on the iplayer, it's hard to imagine when they'll screen it.

Though if it's misinformed, I'm not desperate to have it broadcast. That clip was very off-putting, but then sometimes they use the sensational/confrontational bits for the trailers and it's not a true reflection. It did look suspiciously like he was referring to 'fearful cognitions', though.

 

[Ambrosia_angel]

Does anyone know what was shown in its place? Programme about the terror attack seems a possibility? If that's so, I don't know why they can't put this on the iplayer, it's hard to imagine when they'll screen it.

Though if it's misinformed, I'm not desperate to have it broadcast. That clip was very off-putting, but then sometimes they use the sensational/confrontational bits for the trailers and it's not a true reflection. It did look suspiciously like he was referring to 'fearful cognitions', though.

I looked at the viewings over the past few Monday @9pm and last week was an election based show. This week they put planet earth on and next week it says that they're doing a show called eat well for less. I truly don't think they're gonna air it. I can understand them not wanting to replace planet earth but they could easily replace eat well for less as the shows have a similar health and lifestyle format. But time will tell...

 

[Chrisb]

Perhaps they should commission a new series starting with a BBC executive suffering from cold feet.

 

[Hell...Hath...No...Fury..]

I've just heard this is now scheduled for Tuesday 27th at 10.45. Don't know if this is am or pm