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B12 - issues with Liver - now fluid retention

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by kday, Jun 14, 2011.

  1. kday

    kday Senior Member

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    For those that don't know, vitamin B12 and methylation for me is a double edged sword. The vitamins make me feel a thousand times better, but it puts stress on my liver and kidneys. Lately I have needed much less B12 as the cycle seems to be (somewhat) restored again.

    Well, first it was my liver and dark urine. I retained some fluid throughout the day, but even with the troubles my body seemed to get be able to get most of it off on its own.

    I had a liver scan that indicated chronic liver disease a while ago. I started on alpha-lipoic acid (with vitamin e, vitamin c, and selenium) and it made a huge difference and helped the fluid retention symptoms (delayed urine emptying?) quite a bit as well. However, large doses of alpha-lipoic acid increased neurological symptoms, but after taking frequent small doses throughout the day (Andy Cutler style sort of), I can tolerate larger doses fine.

    My liver seems better. It doesn't seem full, and consistently has a nice percussion sound now. Liver enzymes are now perfect.

    However, my body is now having trouble dumping fluid. I upped the ALA dose to 600 mg last night and this morning, and I lost 7 pounds in 10 hours.

    Not quite sure what to do. Doctors never seem to know what to do so I am always hesitant to go. I'm wondering if it the antioxidant nature of ALA that helps a lot.

    I was thinking about adding Acetyl L-Carnitine since it can possibly help kidney stuff, and I read it may help CFS symptoms as well. I know I am just guessing, and may end up with another useless supplement, but despite the collection of useless junk, this has been the way I have figured out what works and what doesn't.

    Anybody know anything about Acetyl L-Carnitine?
  2. richvank

    richvank Senior Member

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    Hi, Kyle.

    Do you mean you excreted 7 pounds of urine in 10 hours? That would be the better part of a gallon.

    It would certainly be interesting to see results of some biochemical testing on you.

    Rich
  3. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Salt Lake City
    Hi Kday,

    Folate deficiency is associated with edema. When the fluid is dumped rapidly, ie I lost 4 pounds of fluid today in about 5 hours after my latest bout of induced folate deficiency was dealt with, I started getting spasms about 30 minutes ago that were just relieved by an additional 500mg of potassium about 30 minutes ago.
  4. kday

    kday Senior Member

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    In terms of methylation, I never had the comprehensive analysis since labs were quite expensive and insurance didn't cover them.

    I had my eyes looked at by a opthamologist for (suspected) Wilson's disease. No rings. However, they found another possible eye disease and my vision as deteriorated quite a bit in 2 years (I am 25). All the nerves and everything else looked good.

    I have molybdenum. Last night my neuro symptoms were starting to go mad, so I took a pill of molybdenum and I didn't need to take B12. However, when I woke up, my urine was very, very dark. Like brownish red.

    I am not retaining fluid like I was since when I avoid B12 I don't retain fluid, but I physically, mentally, and neurologically feel much worse when I don't take B12. Though molybdenum helps I think.

    Brief history: Lyme disease in 2008. On doxy 100 mg BID or I deteriorate. Going off doxy makes things a lot worse after a few weeks and does not correlate with liver/kidney symptoms. CFS diagnosed with Pacific Fatigue Lab type testing and very low sed rate, no HGH, etc.

    I'll post my lab tests here when I get a chance.
  5. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Kday,

    Consider that when more mb12 is taken, more Metafolin is needed. When there is a folate deficiency fluid is retained and more b12 is dumped in the more concentrated urine of "Like brownish red." I go through this with each cycle of folate deficiency whether induced ny folic acid, folinic acid, vegetable food folate of glutathione (precursors). I just came out of such a deficiency yesterday and the b12 disapperared entirely from my urine despite the 180mg/day I am currently injecting which on the average causes considerable coloration with increases and changes with folate deficiency and goes away entirely for a day or two after exiting folate deficiency.

    Also, with the increased Metafolin and mb12, the need for potassium can go up a LOT, especially when urine increases after coming out of the folate deficiency. I also dumped another 2-3 pounds of water since yesterday's post.

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