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Audio recording your consultation with NHS doctors

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS Discussion' started by golden, Mar 10, 2013.

  1. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.u...ations-with-NHS-doctors&p=4164894#post4164894

    I don't know if people can access this thread without joining the forum.

    I was wondering if people are doing this, either openly or privately.

    One practical reason is obviously with M.E. we may miss some important information in the consultation which we could listen to again at home when we feel like.

    It appears to be perfectly legal in the UK and some US states (although I am not a lawyer and just going from this threads contents).

    Privately recorded messages CAN be submitted, if the judge agrees, as evidence of abuse or negligence.

    However it appears there is hostility to the idea from the medical profession especially doing it openly, where you maybe subject to bullying or being banned.

    If anyone wades through it all I liked the story - Take Two Recorders Into your G.P...

    One was overt and the other private. During the consultation the G.P. told his patient to turn off the recorder, which they did, at which point the Doctor began yelling at the patient (all recorded on the private recorder) :)

    Of course , so long as the Doctor is behaving in a professional manner, and practicing medicine in a scientific way, then I can oonly see this as a win win situation and in any good doctors favour?

    I was wondering what people think....:)
    leela and overtrain like this.
  2. lnester7

    lnester7 Seven

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    I am in USA, I record my consultations because I used to have severe brain fog and I need my family to be up to date with my issues/progress and is very nice where the doctor explains where the symptoms come from (and somebody don't question their legitimacy because so many new ones used to pop up). She never refused to be recorded and actually understood my BF very well. Is a God send because I always forget pieces of information and I can refer back to the consultation. I really recommended.
    golden likes this.
  3. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    That sounds wonderful :)

    But in the UK, it seems that the advice is to record privately because of the hostility it engenders. There seems to be a written document stating that patients who ask to record sections should be classed as 'vexatious'.
  4. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    VEXACIOUS.... :rolleyes: ..... in other words daring to question a medical authority.
    I think these doctors need a shrink to help them get over themselves.

    Luckily, I don't need to record any doctors, because I gave up wasting my time on them long ago.
  5. jeffrez

    jeffrez Senior Member

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    Vexacious, lol. I think they can cure that with CBT now. :D
  6. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    Well, that was the other part of the document - questioning the accuracy of urn medical records, omissions and doctor diagnoses - vexatious and a ....wait for it....

    mental health illness!

    I was at my happiest when I was completely out of the system. I think it is beyond useless. (etc. etc. etc)

    But I entered it again in the hopes of getting financial help. And also found myself right in the centre when they were killing off my mum under the death care pathway.

    I was hoping to proceed with tests myself and then I got riled as it reminded me of what a hold they have over people.

    I am frustrated because i am not well enough to support myself financially (yet).

    So I am forced to deal with it somehow...
    Allyson likes this.
  7. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    that was meant to read...

    questioning your doctor... they are basically saying is a mental health problem!!!

    Grrrrrrrr
    Allyson likes this.
  8. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Hi golden--I am so sorry you have to deal with THOSE PEOPLE. It's like going back in time to convince the psychos in charge of the Inquisition that the earth really is round. o_O Very frustrating and a bit crazy making, I can imagine.

    I wish you the emotional fortitude that you need to get through it.
    golden and Allyson like this.
  9. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    :)

    Yes its like entering the dark ages. Very primitive.

    Thank you for the well wishes :)
    Dreambirdie likes this.
  10. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    p.s. they say the earth has moved on from being round and is more like 'the matrix' lol :)
    Allyson likes this.
  11. Allyson

    Allyson Senior Member

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    I don t think it is legal here in Australia - not sure though.
    I can see it would make docs defensive - especially tough with new disease where we are all still learning.

    However i wish i HAD done it for a Caulfield based cardilologsit who was extremely abusive and also told me my illness was psycosomatic after a 10 minute consult that did NOT include a thorough medical history ( AND IGNORED A PRVIOUS DIAGNOSIS of "cfs " by a specialist physcian in a major public hospital.

    I could then use it to report her to the medical board here. As it is it is too much effort to write it all out.
    golden likes this.
  12. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member

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    Thanks for posting about this. Interesting topic, and it's something I would like to read more about.
    golden and Allyson like this.
  13. Allyson

    Allyson Senior Member

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    I suppose we can only hope that with the speed of research and communication increasing and with advances in things like testing and genetics and epi-genetics some good things may still happen in our lifetimes.

    Also there is a groundswell, it seems to me, of medical people who now take these conditions seriously.

    I also think if EDS ME are the same thing or parts of the same illness then combining forces and knowledge will help.
    There are so many pages out there of people all around the world with EDS ME POT and OI that we must reach a critical mass soon. (Remember that MS has at least 4 distinct subtypes so we may have that happening here, so the more research the better.)

    Also people are now not taking uninformed dismissals from doctors and are instead researching for themselves and persisting until they get accurate diagnosis and help. If I had stopped at the first doctor I saw .....ok the tenth,... I would still think I was not gluten intolerant, not lactose intolrant and had no allergies and no IBS - all those things have now been proven by doctors who were top specialists in those fields and knew the right tests and answers to be able to diagnose them. However I might have stopped when I thought I had coeliac if not for research on the internet where I found sites like this with others with the same weird symptoms as me and others who had done reaerch into amlot of them.

    I am afraid with our health we just have to persist until we get justice.

    (BTW I have met a 12 year old boy with spine cancer who was sent home from docs and hospitals with just panadeine for a year beforo he got diagnosed, his mother told me (so it was all in his head too). When i met him he was going in for emergency life-saving surgery - I never heard the result.)

    I know GPs now are more inclined to refer you to a specialist if they are not sure - and you can't know everything as has been pointed out above. And more docs are, thankfully , prepared to say "I/we don't know"

    (rather than "You must be crazy because I never learned that in my one lecture on that topic in medical school 20 years ago" hehe)
    golden likes this.
  14. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    Can I just say that in an ideal world we could go to the doctors with our recorders and have a consultation and it would all be professional, thorough, respectful and useful, I am more convinced than ever that the best way to go is recording privately NOT openly.. as things may get pretty bad for you if you ask your doctor if you can record openly...

    This is just my opinion as I am preparing for any future contact with the medical profession.

    From the thread its obvious to me I do not know enough of my legal entitlements which would greatly support me if I did.

    If I get a chance I will try to list them for practical purposes and patient empowerment.

    PALS is what I always thought it was too. Set up to quash complaints - great name....
  15. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    Court appointed psychiatrist caught molesting patient who recorded the sessions using spycam - sentenced to 5 years imprisonment:
    "
    The allegations against Levin came to light in 2010 after one of his patients came forward with secret videos he had recorded during court-ordered sessions with the psychiatrist.
    The videos, played in court last fall, show Levin undoing the man's belt and jeans and appearing to fondle him.
    The patient, identified only as R.B. in court, was on probation at the time the videos were taken and had been ordered to see Levin twice a month.
    The man said he had told authorities about previous assaults and no one believed him, so he bought a spy camera and brought it to his appointments.
    "It seemed hopeless," R.B. said in one of three victim impact statements presented to the court Wednesday.
    "I had nowhere to turn."

    http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/mobileweb/2013/01/31/aubrey-levin-sentencing-judge_n_2588126.html
  16. Allyson

    Allyson Senior Member

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  17. golden

    golden Senior Member

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    The judge said the sentence should have been 8 years but because of his health problems and age reduced it to 5 years.

    The defence argued Levin would suffer in prison and suggested a sentence of 60-90 days to be served on weekends!!!


    Good on this person for recording the sessions.

    I believe this psychiatrist also tortured homosexual patients to try to cure them. This was before the psychiatrists changed their minds over night and decided homosexuality was no longer an illness.

    Such is the science/moods of psychiatry.


    The judge also said:

    They came to you for help for their problems. Instead you added to their problems."

    This sums up my experience with the medical profession unfortunately.
    Allyson likes this.
  18. caledonia

    caledonia

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    It depends on whether your state or country is a one party state, or a two party state. If it's a one party state (like mine), only you need to be aware the conversation is being recorded. If it's a two party state, then you and the doctor would need to be notified.

    Here's an international list from Wikipdeia. It says telephone recording, but the same law also applies to recording in person: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_recording_laws

    The UK appears to be a one party state.

    My sister records doctor visits because she has brain fog. I just take notes.
    Allyson likes this.
  19. golden

    golden Senior Member

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  20. xks201

    xks201 Senior Member

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    I was told by one doctor when I was younger that I was schizophrenic when in reality I had dairy allergies and severe hormone deficiencies. What I would give for a recording of that.
    overtrain and golden like this.

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