1. Patients launch $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
Join the National PR Campaign for ME: Power to the Patient (P2tP)
Have you had enough of all the neglect and abuse of ME/CFS patients? Gabby Klein says now is the time for a National PR Campaign for ME/CFS to impress a change. Join the Patient Revolution to restore power to ME patients ...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

Are Folate supplements necessary to take with B12 if Red Cell Folate levels are high?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by axx, Apr 24, 2012.

  1. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,578
    Likes:
    1,920
    Tundras of Europa
    Taking the Swanson wouldn't be any different from my idea of taking them all separately, in active forms. The only thing different is the B3 form.

    I don't want to take B complexes with high doses of inactive forms any more. I believe it is very costly having to convert all that vitamin in the body.
     
  2. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1
    Adreno, do you think it is necessary to take B supplements that are much higher than the RDI? I understand with B12 that it is needed in high doses due to the problems with absorption that many people experience, but surely the other B requirements can be met by diet? Am I mistaken? Perhaps some of the other B vitamins are more like B12 or are difficult to find in sufficient quantities in food.
     
  3. hixxy

    hixxy Woof woof

    Messages:
    724
    Likes:
    107
    Russell Island, Australia
    The RDIs are typically inadequate for optimal health. Also, what is the quality of your food like? The function of your gut? Your ability to metabolise these vitamins into their active forms?

    hixxy
     
  4. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,578
    Likes:
    1,920
    Tundras of Europa
    With all the absorption issues, and increased energy demands seen in ME, I do believe RDA doses are insufficient. I would even prefer to take all my Bs sublingually.
     
  5. hixxy

    hixxy Woof woof

    Messages:
    724
    Likes:
    107
    Russell Island, Australia
    I've been thinking of trying transdermal b complex. Not entirely sure how effective it is tho.

    I was taking 600mg magnesium / day for months and it wasn't until I started using some magnesium oil that I got a big hit.
     
  6. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1
    That's interesting. I haven't read much about transdermal supplements so I can't offer any advice on that.

    I did find another b complexthat looks quite good with some of the superior bioavailable forms in it:http://www.wellnessresources.com/products/super_b_complex.php. A drawback though is that it has calcium folinate instead of methylfolate, but this is still better than FA.
     
  7. hixxy

    hixxy Woof woof

    Messages:
    724
    Likes:
    107
    Russell Island, Australia
  8. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1
    Is it really necessary to take a b complex in addition to B12?

    I have quite low blood pressure and am nervous about taking B3 niacin/niacinamide.

    If I just take the B12, fish oil (with A & D), magnesium, methylfolate and have some potassium on hand if needed, wouldn't this be enough? I have a really good diet and get plenty of vitamins and minerals, including calcium and zinc.
     
  9. hixxy

    hixxy Woof woof

    Messages:
    724
    Likes:
    107
    Russell Island, Australia
    B12 and Folate aren't the only b vitamins involved in the various aspects of methylation.

    You need B6 and B2 which are common CFS deficencies involved in methylation. B3 is also a cofactors in so many things it's ridiculous.

    Just search around fr a really low dose b complex at least. If it has a small amount of folic acid, just take your 5MTHF away from the folic acid.

    Also, when you start methylating, your body's demand for those b complex vitamins will increase -- not just potassium and magnesium.

    Same for trace minerals.
     
  10. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,578
    Likes:
    1,920
    Tundras of Europa
    Hixxy is right, you need all the B vitamins. I don't think a moderate amount of B3 will lower your blood pressure.
     
  11. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1
  12. Pea

    Pea Senior Member

    Messages:
    124
    Likes:
    3
    What about the Inosotol question - is it important?
     
  13. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

    Messages:
    2,578
    Likes:
    1,920
    Tundras of Europa
    If you take lecithin, you will get some inositol from that.
     
  14. madietodd

    madietodd Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,483
    Likes:
    1,741
    East Coast, USA
    Hixxy, do you know which mutations are involved in this? Or can you point me to a thread?

    Madie
     
  15. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,248
    Likes:
    386
    Virginia, USA
    They don't say where they are getting their methylfolate. Is it really just pure L-methylfolate or does it also contain D-methylfolate?
     
  16. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,248
    Likes:
    386
    Virginia, USA
    This rings a bell! Do you also suffer from chronic rhinosinusitis, headaches and tachycardia, by any chance?
     
  17. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1
    Interesting question.
    chronic rhinosinusitis - not chronic no, but the only time i really seem to get sick is when my sinuses are infected
    headaches - occasionally, but I can usually explain why (e.g. dehydration). usually very mild, only rarely do I get migraines
    tachycardia - i'm not sure. I have felt tightness in my chest, especially where my left breast is and this is one of the symptoms that concerns me most. Sometimes I feel really mild palpitations. I'm not sure how to get this tested/diagnosed, it is difficult to explain how it feels.
     
  18. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,248
    Likes:
    386
    Virginia, USA
    What about constant postnasal drip?

    I have this same exact set of symptoms, including the pain under the left breast! By the way, a recent echocardiogram showed everything is fine with my heart.

    The reason I asked those questions is my belief that all the symptoms are tied together to some form of histamine overload. When I was younger, my blood pressure was usually around 90/60. Now that I am older and fatter, my blood pressure is still a very normal 120/80! A good deal of the stuff that I currently take is aimed at lowering histamine.

    Here is an interesting paper explaining the effects too much histamine have on the body (including cardiac arrest):

    Histamine and histamine intolerance
     
  19. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1
    I remember doing a quiz recently regarding histamines and the symptoms didn't really resonate with me so I don't think this is an issue of mine, but I could be mistaken. I will go back and read the paper you linked to and do a bit more research. It may be worth noting that I do get hayfever in the spring though.

    On the topic of Red Cell Folate being high, the following article explains how this could be related to a genetic mutation whereby both formylated and methylated folate forms are in the red cell folate, rather than just methylated
     
  20. axx

    axx

    Messages:
    22
    Likes:
    1

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page