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Anyone using b12oils?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by hixxy, Dec 15, 2015.

  1. hixxy

    hixxy Senior Member

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    Anyone using b12oils? I can't tolerate lozenges at all (hypersensitive mouth from MCS).

    I'm finding it really difficult to dose consistently with them as when I get a new bottle the oil is stronger with the strength gradually decreasing as I work through the bottle. I've noticed that the oil is much more red at the beginning, quite quickly becomes more translucent.

    Has anyone else had troubles with b12oils? I've tried mb12 injections but they're much too difficult to titrate and also too expensive.
     
  2. helen1

    helen1 Senior Member

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    I've been using them for about eight months and have not noticed any difference between the different bottles. So far mine have been consistent. Have gone through maybe 15 of them.
     
    hixxy likes this.
  3. hixxy

    hixxy Senior Member

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    Which form are you using?
     
  4. helen1

    helen1 Senior Member

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    The methyl and the adenosyl forms.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2015
  5. Sherpa

    Sherpa Ex-workaholic adrenaline junkie

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    @hixxy if you start to get less full (more translucent) squirts, then find the hole in the bottom of the bottle and push up on it pretty hard with a stiff paper clip or the bottom of an incense stick. This will push the vacuum plunger higher and it will make the squirts more full and red.
     
  6. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I used 1 bottle of B12oils. Then I switched to DIY transdermal. I'm now using 1/2 Country Life 5000mcg MB12, crushed into a bit of body lotion, and applying to skin. Works great. Very inexpensive.
     
    Christopher likes this.
  7. Johnmac

    Johnmac Senior Member

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    DIY transdermal sounds interesting @ahmo.

    I'm taking the Country Life under the gum, but it dissolves very fast, & is causing tooth cavities.

    Which skin region is best for your method?

    Just crush, mix with oil, apply?

    Will any old oil do?

    Are the results just as good as with sublingual?

    Why "very inexpensive"? CL is cheaper than Enzy, but still not cheap... Do you mean compared to other methods?
     
  8. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @Johnmac I started w/ Bluebonnet liquid B12, because I had it on hand. I mixed it initially w/ a body butter, applied it on leg, arm, belly. Once I'd used up the Bluebonnet, fortuitously there was none available, so I tried the Country Life. I'm now using 1/2 tablet CL 5000mcg/day. This has become even cheaper than the Bluebonnet, and way cheaper than B12oils.

    I'm now using this same method for B2 (FMN). The B2 was really unpleasant to just smear on my body. It got yellow onto my clothes and bedding, which the B12 never did. So I now crush both B12 and B2 onto a piece of fabric, put some lotion onto it, and then strap on just above my wrist. I'm doing this because I have a pair of anti-nausea velcro wrist bands that are perfect to hold the patch on.

    I started w/ oil only body cream, now use a more liquid formula, so grease + H20. Don't know if there's any difference. I have been stable and symptom-free for at least 4 months, probably more. I can only assume my B12 levels are right. I was recently contemplating adding B12 injections, but don't have any symptoms that suggest this would make a difference. (and having reached an equilibrium, and very reluctant to mess things up.)
     
    Kathevans likes this.
  9. Johnmac

    Johnmac Senior Member

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    Thanks @ahmo. Glad to hear it's going so well.

    Is that the same CL mB12 dose you were using sublingually? I.e. do you just use the same dose for the transdermal?

    I don't have any velcro wrist bands, so I guess I could just put an improvised bandage or something over it? The CL mB12 stains everything if I spill any - so something is needed.

    My Solgar methylfolate is also contributing to cavities I think - not as sweet, but they stay undissolved for much longer. Do you know if this transdermal method would work for them?

    You're obviously convinced you are getting a good hit of B12 transdermally? If so, that would suggest that the theory that the B12 molecule is too big to cross through skin is wrong.
     
  10. garyfritz

    garyfritz Senior Member

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    @hixxy, I've been using the oils for over a year. I've gone through a ton of it -- Greg tells me I use more than any of the other 800 people buying his product, how lovely. :confused: But it works very well for me. I'm using the ad/me blend, 3x/day.

    That's odd that your oil is changing *color*. The methyl-only oil is pinker, not the dark blood-red of the ad/me oil. But I haven't seen any change color as I go through the bottle. You're not letting sunlight hit the bottle, are you? The bottles are fairly opaque but not totally. Sustained exposure to intense light could possibly cause some photolysis, which might change the oil color. I'd ask Greg if he has any idea why it would change color.
     
    Christopher likes this.
  11. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I've been using transdermal for a year. I keep notes on everything, but reading them later is not easy. As far as I can tell, I was using 5mg orally, and decreased that to 2.5mg transdermal. However, the B12oils dosage is calculated to be higher than that. So I do well w/ 1 squirt of B12oil, and 1/2 tablet CL.

    My dosage over the last year has been primarily in relation to folate. Too much folate stresses my adrenals. So when I've gotten folate deficiency symptoms, I decrease the B12, rather than increasing the folate. This has worked for me. Between these doses and B2, I've been essentially symptom-free for months, for the first time since ME. My remaining symptoms seem to be of oxidative stress.

    I was using Bluebonnet when I used to rub it into skin, and rarely found the red on anything, it dissolved into skin rapidly. Since switching to CL, I've been combining it w/ FMN on a patch, so haven't had opportunity to see if it stains.

    If I didn't have my wrist bands, I'd probably have used terrycloth tennis wrist bands.

    I'm now very happy w/ Life Extension 1mg tablets. No sweetener, dissolves quickly.

    Certainly the B12oils folks are convinced it crosses. garyfritz is one who's having good results w/ it. It's been a year that I've been using transdermal, have had no symptoms of B12 deficiency.
     
    Kathevans likes this.
  12. garyfritz

    garyfritz Senior Member

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    I think I should retract that statement. I just held a bottle up to full late-afternoon sunlight. The **neck** of the bottle is translucent, but that part is covered by the wholly-opaque pump top. The body of the bottle itself seemed to be completely opaque, as far as I could tell. I'd say very little light gets through to the oil. Still, I think I will be more careful about where I leave the bottle -- I discovered the late-afternoon sun shines directly onto my bathroom sink!
     
  13. Kathevans

    Kathevans Senior Member

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    @ahmo I'm glad I found this more detailed thread. As to your lotion, I recall you saying (I think!) that coconut oil would probably work well if you could tolerate it. Do you hold to that opinion?...!:D
     
  14. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @Kathevans I've gone from an all-oil to an oil+H20 mixture based on my understanding for body lotion, that this creates better hydration. But, hydrating the skin (ie, moisturizer) might be irrelevant to just creating a means of absorption. The commercial B12oils seems to be oil only, and is incredibly efficient, only a small drop, compared to my blob. So...you've inspired me to try coconut oil only, I'll use this for my midday dose today.;)
     
  15. Kathevans

    Kathevans Senior Member

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    I spent some time today talking to my local compounding pharmacy and they recommended using Lipoderm, a base they use for transdermals that has more of a fatty base itself, for the MeB12. That said, it requires a prescription as it is Rx quality. So, in turn, I texted my GP to see if she'd write a scrip for me. We shall see. Even if she does, I may just use the coconut oil. I love that stuff and have a big container of it.

    As I said in my posts on Gary's other thread, I'm actually stopping both the MeB12 and Folate for the moment while I try out the adoB12 all by itself. I seem to be part of a subset of people who have a difficult startup with the adoB12 and I want to see how I react only to that. This is only day 2.

    I know that Freddd started and stopped many times to fully understand so many aspects of his protocol.

    I'm happy to have reminded you of what was, after all, your inspiration in the first place!
     
  16. Johnmac

    Johnmac Senior Member

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    Thanks @ahmo. I'll try the full oral B12 dose as transdermal & see what happens. Can always halve it like you if needed.

    I've had the opposite reaction with folate: it picks up my adrenals nicely. (Have reduced hydrocortisone from 30 to 5 mg.) But I haven't pushed doses over 7mg/day yet.

    Increasing B12 is an interesting method of dealing with PFD. Haven't seen that before.

    "Symptom-free for months" is excellent - congratulations (& fingers crossed).

    I'll keep an eye out for wrist bands of some sort. (Am deep in the third world, so not a lot on offer.)

    I've just ordered 6 months' worth of Country Life B12 & Solgar folate - but will try your brands next time.

    The scant science I could find tended to support the theory that the B12 molecule is too large to cross the skin. However the results you mention seem to contradict that.

    My big remaining symptom is psoriasis. In my shoes, would you do some kind of high "test dose" of the folate for a week or 2, to see what happened?

    Thanks again, & glad you've had good progress...


     
  17. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I remembered that Life Extension, in addition to folate 1mg tabs, makes capsules, 1mg and 5mg.

    It's possible there's a Candida link to psoriasis. Otherwise, I guess I'd treat it as if it's folate deficiency, as you say, and try higher doses. Good luck. And happy new year.
    [​IMG]
     
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  18. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @Kathevans Thanks to you I've switched to coconut oil.:)Simpler, less messy, and my body is saying this is better.
     
  19. Kathevans

    Kathevans Senior Member

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    @ahmo Terrific. However: Northern Hemisphere caveat: in cold weather coconut oil is a solid! :eek: I'd forgotten this. This morning I put two Enzymatic MeB12s in roughly 1/2 tbsp melted coconut oil. I waited for it to cool a bit after putting it in a 165 degree oven for a few minutes, wondering if the heat might in some way degrade the B12. I covered the small porcelain pestle with foil to keep out the light and just came back to it for my afternoon dose.

    Well, it's solidified around those small tablets, tiny pink islands in an icy sea! I wonder if I kept it on a radiator whether that would work, keep the coconut oil soft enough to dissolve the tabs. But I'd still wonder if heat would degrade the B12. Maybe I can google that.

    On the other hand, maybe even some sunflower oil would do and possibly the Solgar 5,000mg nuggets would dissolve more easily, as they seem to in the mouth. Or the Country Life, for that matter, which also dissolve faster than the Enzymatic. I remember you just dissolved a 5,000--or however much--in your lotion overnight and it was dissolved by morning...

    I see that you use the transdermal oil/solution 2x/day. Others have said the transdermal oils allow for a more even diffusion, which is to say gradual, spread out over a longer time, that they might use the oil only 1x/day and it would diffuse over 8 hours. I think it was @Sherpa who said this, though possibly someone else.

    As to your foot baths, I administered my afternoon dose of 300mg K+ by foot bath--doubling the dose to 600mg, just to ensure high enough absorption. I found a terrific plastic kitchen container (good size for travels, too, should it come to that!) and filled it only an inch and a half or so. After I'd finished and had a look at my feet, I noticed what great veins I have on the top of my feet and felt some dismay that I hadn't had enough water in the container to reach them. But if there's more water and the solution is more diluted, should one use more of the 'stuff' for better absorption?

    I'm still trying to listen to my body--but other than very obvious symptoms, which I am getting better at reading, I am still flummoxed by its responses...!

    Happy New Year ahmo, you give many of us here hope. Your efforts and your insights inspire us and guide us. May your New Year bring new aspects of healing that lighten your path.

    Kathleen
     
  20. garyfritz

    garyfritz Senior Member

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    @helen1, I just noticed this. You've gone through 15 bottles in 8 months?? One every 2-ish weeks? That's even faster than I inhale the stuff! Are you using 4 doses per day? The bottles have about 60 doses, so at my 3x/day rate they last just about 3 weeks.
     

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