1. Patients launch $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
Give ME the Money
Graham McPhee spells out some of the cold, hard facts about the dismal state of ME research and politics, and has some suggestions as to what we can do about it ...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

Anyone noticed a link to ability to focus your eyes?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by rydra_wong, Mar 6, 2012.

  1. rydra_wong

    rydra_wong Guest

    Messages:
    514
    Likes:
    31
    Rich especially - have you ever looked at ferritin, RBP, and/or vitamin A as relates to methylation? (maybe not, but maybe you have some insight anyway?)

    Sorry I cant type so I am going to add this as edits.


    Has anyone noticed blurred vision after eating protein? I bought a protein supplement and ate that (no meal) and it caused blurred vision for 1.5 hours. Doesn't seem like that would be caused by blood sugar. I take 2g TMG which is supposed to prevent postprandial homocysteine elevation).

    I find this possible scenario(?):

    1. improper methylation causes homocysteine. homocysteine theorized to degrade (add OH) retinol. (CBSers found to be deficienct in Vitamin A even after supplementation)
    2. Retinol deficiency causes RBP deficiency.
    3. RBP used to transport ferritin. In insufficient RBP, ferritin levels fall. Ferritin moves to joints (?) and/or serum Fe (seems like both in my case) or ...?
    4. Low ferritin even with normal Hb causes low thyroid (TSH > 1.9)
    5. Low ferritin potentially also causes low cortisol (idk, i did not measure cortisol)
    6. Low ferritin causes gasping for air even if Hb normal? (Possible?)
    7. Low ferritin lowers MCV value and obscures folate deficiency (applies?)

    Any thoughts? I cant easily look at RBP myself since not offered by Labcorp and no dr. appt until end of month. Thanks!
     
  2. SickOfSickness

    SickOfSickness Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,874
    Likes:
    958
    US
    I get double/blurred vision when I get fatigued and don't rest. It happens all the time. I am talking about a fatigue and stress level that is easy to reach, so unless I severely limit activity, it happens every day. I think sometimes I recover and it happens again later.
     
  3. rydra_wong

    rydra_wong Guest

    Messages:
    514
    Likes:
    31
    Thanks. I am not sure what causes it yet. The amino supplement I bought is from Twinlabs and it has several ingredients in it I did not know were in there -- sucralose and some other chemical with methyl in the name. I am sensitive to many chemicals so it couldbe one of those.

    Also I never thought amino acids could raise your blood sugar but I got a free magazine when I bought the supplement and several of the amino supplements claim they raise your insulin level! The ads were not good enough for me to determine exactly what was in these products. If aminos all by themselves can play with your blood sugar then that would cause eye focus issues for me.

    I intend to use the product up (I bought it, I'm cheap) so I switched to 1/4 dose and it was not as bad - no eye focus issues, but it did seem to cause a bit of inflammation. I am not sure why yet. I do try to buy everything chemical free but sometimes chemicals sneak in anyway. Sigh.
     
  4. Gavman

    Gavman Senior Member

    Messages:
    316
    Likes:
    89
    Sydney
    I would be wary of vitamin A, especially in higher doses as it gets stored in the liver. And after anti-acne medication i took that was vitamin a - my body started to reject vitamin a sources and create sensitivities to carrots, parsley, corn etc.
    Lack of B2 has a strong link to eye problems.
     
  5. RosieBee

    RosieBee

    Messages:
    86
    Likes:
    37
    UK
    This is really interesting. I find the problems with focusing fluctuate with the severity of the symptoms. The B2 connection is really interesting as tests show that I am deficient in B2; which may also explain when my eyes feel irritated and burning.
     
  6. SickOfSickness

    SickOfSickness Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,874
    Likes:
    958
    US
    Today I am having a head-swimming effect which makes focusing uncomfortable. I hate not knowing what caused it. Stress? Food? Something in the air? I took vitamin B2 less than an hour ago.
     
  7. rydra_wong

    rydra_wong Guest

    Messages:
    514
    Likes:
    31
    ok, I will keep B2 in mind. I can't just take it -- I have no separate B2. I can only take a B complex for that.

    But yes, I have two different eyes out of focus problems...one caused by blood sugar issues -- if I abuse my blood sugar by eating junk food (and just keep eating it to stave off the crash that follows) then late in the day my eye focus isn't so hot. And that's understandable.

    But I also have some ph out of whack thing occur that sometimes prevents my eyes from focussing. First time it happened it used to come during PMS in my late 40's. So it is genetic because my hormones fixed a lot of my genetic problems until they started to wane. So then I found I had the VDR genetic defect and really needed 7000units Vitamin D a day. That fixed my ph RIGHT UP. So I don't get this too often and it would be all the time now since menopause is PMS forever. But I still get it once in awhile and not sure the cause. However I know it is caused by my ph being off. (I always knew this...I read acid/alkaline by Herman Aihara). Just what upsets my ph other than lack of Vitakin D I am not too sure.

    Rydra

    Any idea why B2 might cause eye focus issues?
     
  8. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

    Messages:
    78
    Likes:
    67
    Low B2 can cause any type of eye issues, blurred vision, cataracts, dry, gritty feeling, inflamed conjunctiva, sensitivity to light, etc. Remember, B2 is needed to activate B6, folic acid, make niacin from tryptophan, keep adequate levels of B12 in the body, through folic acid cause the activation of choline. You can only absorb 25 mg. of B2 per hour. So if you take a multi, all the others will just continue to lower your B2. Best to just take B2 at a low dose several times a day. If you are showing symptoms of B2 deficiency, then all your storage locations are empty. That normally takes 3 months on a diet that contains no B2. So you are VERY Low. Building those stores back up will take at least 3 months and anything I've listed above in a supplement or in foods, will just continue to lower the amout of B2 you are taking.

    Also, B2 is critical to running the energy pathway, so this could be why you are so tired as well.
     
  9. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,327
    Likes:
    664
    UK
    Hi Dog Person

    Would B2 deficiency cause corneal erosions as well as part of dry eye syndrome?
     
  10. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

    Messages:
    78
    Likes:
    67
    Brenda,

    Yes, B2 deficiency could cause both. One of my dog clients had a corenal erosion which caused him to loose his sight in that eye. He was a bischon/poodle mix and had very high levels of unbound iron, which was obvious by the severe bronze discoloration discharge coming from the eyes, saliva around the mouth and sweat of his feet between his pads. The vet said she had never seen anything like it before, because there was a hard, orange sediment that actually came out of the eye.

    What brought on the sudden erosion was that the owner had purchased a product that was supposed to clear that discharge from the dog. It was dissicated liver - liver containes the highest levels of iron, copper and metals of anything you can eat almost. The dog was already unable to bind his minerals so this was too much for his already severe B2 deficiency to keep up with.

    You can see another standard poodle's paw that also showed the bronze discoloration. He was only one year old and should have been all white, but intead his entire body was discolored. Unfortunately, by the time the owner brought him to me, he already had lymphoma cancer, because all the unbound metals were shifting to the lymphatic system in an attempt by the body to remove them. He died very shortly.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,327
    Likes:
    664
    UK
    Aw what a shame - such a cute little doggie. I also have a orange staining of the saliva and an orange tinge to palms and soles. I often wondered what it was.

    I wonder how the erosion was diagnosed in a dog as the only way I knew is by the excrutiating pain on trying to open my eyes in a morning but I have been losing my sight through it. It is under control at the moment with castor oil in my eyes at night and since starting vit E.
     
  12. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

    Messages:
    78
    Likes:
    67
    The orange staining to your palms and hands is due to inappropriate splitting of beta carotene. If beta carotene is not split exactly in half - then it is unusable by the body as vitamin A and will accumulate in the skin - hands and feet most noticible. The other reason is that vitamin A is a fat soluble vitamin. This means that it can not travel in the water based environment of the bloodstream until it is made water soluble in the liver. So again, the problem shows lack of ability of the liver to function correctly due to inadequate nutrients.

    Vitamin A is critical to vision. Without vitamin A, the light sensing cones and rods don't sense light; and you can not see - period. Had a black standard poodle client go blind for this reason. So this may also be contributing to your vision loss.
     
  13. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,327
    Likes:
    664
    UK
    Wow thats amazing thanks. I have been on supplements for years, juicing partially eating raw and using superfoods but still not enough nutrients? That`s shocking.
     
  14. greenshots

    greenshots Senior Member

    Messages:
    399
    Likes:
    139
    California
    Protein made from soy, whey, or other high glutamate (hidden MSG) components will do this. Also, higher loads of protein through the CBS can lead to more ammonia which can definitely lead to visual changes. Almost all protein supplements have a healthy dose of MSG with hydrolyzed forms of protein & these are the absolute worst but even plain soy, whey, or wheat protein has enough MSG to lead to fairly abrupt changes in vision.

    Angela
     
  15. Gavman

    Gavman Senior Member

    Messages:
    316
    Likes:
    89
    Sydney
    Ryda,

    I'd imagine a good b supplement will mostly help take care of a b2 shortage, Dog Person gave the goods that its good to take with B6 too.
    This list is a good general guide but helps show what Bs we might be lacking - http://www.health-science-spirit.com/deficiency.html
     
  16. greenshots

    greenshots Senior Member

    Messages:
    399
    Likes:
    139
    California
    This is a really great list, thank you!
    Angela


     
  17. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

    Messages:
    78
    Likes:
    67
    Gavman,

    I appologize if I suggested to take B2 and B6. Your body can not convert B6 to it's active form without B2 is what I wanted to get across. If you choose to take B6, taking B2 with it helps it's utilization. I almost never suggest taking B6 to my clients. Most of my clients storage locations of B2 are quite deficient so by taking B6 it only drops their already low B2 lower - which is not a good thing. Since you only need about 1.3 - 1.6 mg. of B6 per day, unless you are a marathon trainer and then you need possibly 10-15 times that amount, you almost always can get that amount from foods. But B2 is different because you should have high levels stored in your body which you ocassionally draw upon because it is needed for use or activation of enzyme reactions that affect every single system in the body!
     
  18. cat65

    cat65

    Messages:
    21
    Likes:
    0
    New York
     
  19. Hell...Hath...No...Fury..

    Hell...Hath...No...Fury.. Senior Member

    Messages:
    420
    Likes:
    541
    England
    I was wondering has anyone ever had their eyes tested only to find 2 completely different results? I don't take separate vitamins anymore as i've been on maximol and revenol for about 7 years and it suits me but i'm due to go for an eye test soon and i'm nervous of the day I pick.... on a good brain day i have perfect eyesight, on a bad brain day the optician said i needed glasses as i could barely read even the larger letters.
    He was totally baffled by this as he hadn't come across it before, so now i'm nervous going for another eye test as the result will either be perfect eyesight or half blind lol depending on energy levels ont the day. I need brain glasses :)
     
  20. Dog Person

    Dog Person *****

    Messages:
    78
    Likes:
    67
    Hello Cat65,

    I never have my clients use a B complex. I go by a person or dogs hair test to know which B vitamins and how much of each I need to suggest. Much depends on what a person eats and drinks, any supplements/medications they take, if they consume alcoholic beverages, if they smoke, how much they exercise and how much mental stress they are under; so a complete history is asked as well. Then a custom supplement program is designed.

    If you have been tested by a doctor as low B2, then you have a confirmed diagnosis and knowledge that you need to replace months worth of lost stores. This can only be accomplished by taking small doses of B2 throughout the day and sometimes it is even needed during the night if a person is suffering from night sweats on the hour, every hour. Low B2 usually causes low levels of RBC's and low hemoglobin, so additional B12 will usually be needed once you start B2. This is because you will quite quickly start making lots more RBC's and they require B12 for hemoglobin production. B2 deficiency leads to low storage levels of B12 in the liver. Your body normally produces 5 million RBC's per second!

    B2 is the only B vitamins that is somewhat water and fat soluble. A B2 taken on an empty stomach may only offer 15% absorption. A B2 taken with alittle food like a small piece of unenriched (no calcium, vitamin A or D) cheese or a swallow of whole milk (no added D - Organic Valley) can increase it's absorption to as much as 60%. I also suggest Annies White Cheddar Bunny crackers because they contain yeast and cheese with alittle fat - all things B2 likes. The wheat flour is also not enriched with iron, niacin, thiamine or folic acid or soy - several things B2 does not like.

    You may observe if you need more B12 because your mouth mucus membranes or tongue can get sore and you can feel even more tired - which probably seems nearly impossible at this point. Initially B2 normally brings much needed energy, but if you also need additional B12 (especially if you do not eat much red meat) - this is when you could feel tired again. You can also feel tingling sensations in your legs or hands. The stool can be peanut butter colored instead of dark brown and the urine can get very light instead of dark lemon colored. This is due to lack of the RBC's breakdown pigment called bilirubin which causes these colors. So try to observe these factors when correcting your B2 deficiency.
     

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page