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Another Medical Kidnapping

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by leela, Dec 2, 2013.

  1. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    So well said. Yes, the Dark Ages have never left us.

    What will it take to dethrone this vile ugly system, whose power brokers are usually much more "mentally ill" than the rest of us?

    I feel helpless, and see no way out for Justina, or anyone else who dares to take their child to the ER. Taking your chances with remedies from the internet seems a much safer option.
     
    leela and peggy-sue like this.
  2. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    Sadly this is very true. One is reminded to never ever share anything about their or their children's health with 'professionals' of any kind unless absolutely necessary.

    As for those who carried out this witchhunt, I can only say that I hope there is Hell out there waiting for them ..
     
    Valentijn and leela like this.
  3. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    It appears the parents are being persecuted for refusing the new diagnosis and treatment.

    This is dangerously parallel to the trend I see where police handcuff and arrest (often violently)
    people who have not actually broken any specific code, and are then arrested for "resisting arrest" and "disobeying a police officer."
    Both of which one would naturally do when being wrongly treated or accused.

    There is a paradigm here, almost an entrainment to make people ever more compliant out of fear of this unreasonable power structure.
     
  4. Ember

    Ember Senior Member

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    Same old, same old. Simon Wessely seeks protection from patients. Dr. Lee threatens CFSAC members with expulsion. The empire strikes back.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2014
    Little Bluestem and leela like this.
  5. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    arrgh! i just can't hit the "like" button that makes me so mad!!
     
  6. WillowJ

    WillowJ Senior Member

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    If it's any help, people, including children, can appeal to the UN when their rights have been ignored:
    http://www.savethechildren.net/what-we-do/child-rights-governance

    normally that body is a bit useless, but it could be worth trying, since US courts are also being backwards.

    This is a possible avenue for Katrina, too, and the others.
     
    leela, Little Bluestem and Valentijn like this.
  7. Roy S

    Roy S former DC ME/CFS lobbyist

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    This seems quite relevant to the case and has comments from our own Suzy Chapman.
     
    Mental health and what is normal.
    by Allen Frances, M.D.
     
    Why Did DSM 5 Botch Somatic Symptom Disorder?
     
    "This is the third in a series of blogs on the trouble caused by DSM 5's mishandling of the boundary between medical and mental illness.
    The first explored how a new and untested DSM 5 diagnosis - 'Somatic Symptom Disorder (SSD)' - would mislabel millions of people as mentally ill when they are really just medically ill."
     
    http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog.../why-did-dsm-5-botch-somatic-symptom-disorder
     
    Iquitos, Dreambirdie, Nielk and 3 others like this.
  8. Roy S

    Roy S former DC ME/CFS lobbyist

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    This reminds me of One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest

     
    Nielk, Ren and Valentijn like this.
  9. Ren

    Ren Primum Non Nocere

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    Potemkin Village

    Please allow me to preface the following UN info by saying that I understand that the group, CCHR is questioned bc of funding by the Church of Scientology. I am not a Scientologist (sp??). I see that CCHR can be sensational and is not an academic source. If anyone sees info that is incorrect, please of course say.

    That said, this* CCHR link mentions Pelletier and another tragic case. But brings up the UN as well, and I too wondered how it might apply to Karina Hansen. I haven't looked further into or checked this info, but for what it's worth I'll list what caught my eye - should it prove helpful.


    "2013 United Nations special report on Torture and Other Cruel or Degrading Treatment or Punishment...
    The 2013 UN special report clearly identifies human rights violations such as:

    1. “[M]edical treatments of an intrusive and irreversible nature, when lacking a therapeutic purpose may constitute torture or ill-treatment when enforced or administered without the free and informed consent of the person concerned.

    2. “Medical care that causes severe suffering for no justifiable reason can be considered cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment, and if there is State involvement and specific intent, it is torture.

    3. “Forced interventions, often wrongfully justified by theories of incapacity and therapeutic necessity [are] inconsistent with the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.

    4. “[D]eprivation of liberty that is based on the grounds of a disability and that inflicts severe pain or suffering could fall under the scope of the Convention against Torture. In making such an assessment, factors such as fear and anxiety produced by indefinite detention, the infliction of forced medication or electroshock, the use of restraints and seclusion, the segregation from family and community, etc., should be taken into account.”

    *http://www.cchrint.org/2014/03/18/p...ive-services-abducting-and-drugging-children/
     
  10. Nielk

    Nielk

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    WillowJ, Dreambirdie and Ren like this.
  11. SOC

    SOC Senior Member

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    One sad and appalling feature of this case is that in the US the doctors/hospital/courts could not do this (legally) if Justina was an adult. In order to force institutionalization for psychiatric reasons for more than a couple of days, it would have to be proved that the adult person was an immediate danger to themselves or others -- which basically means immediate danger of violence, not even the potential for or thoughts of violence. That does not include not taking appropriate care of one's health, which is considered a matter of personal choice even when it's an extremely poor choice.

    Children, however, don't get the same respect because their cases don't go through the same legal path. In the case of children, the psychiatric institutionalization is done not according to a personal or public safety or health argument, but as a "child abuse" argument. Suddenly it's not necessary to prove immediate danger to themselves or others, just that the parents are not giving the treatment some psychiatrists believe (not scientifically prove) is correct for the child. It is not even a question of immediate harm to the child, such as might be the case with emergency treatment for injury or severe infection.

    Whatever the true medical situation is with Justina, it seems highly unlikely that the treatment her parents were giving her through Tufts was an immediate danger to Justina. If it was, Tufts should be in serious legal trouble.
     
  12. Iquitos

    Iquitos Senior Member

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    True, they may not be able to do it legally in the US, but they still do it. The law says they can do this if two physicians sign a statement that the person in question is a danger to himself or others. I personally have seen someone forceably taken to the State mental hospital for 6 weeks "observation" because he talked about punching out someone who abused him verbally. In order to get out he had to agree to take psychotropic meds -- after all, they had to justify keeping him there. Although he had/has none of the symptoms, the psych there diagnosed him as "schizophrenic" and prescribed a drug that made him cry all the time. Once he got out and quit taking the drug, that stopped.

    After the hearing, which I attended, I SAW a deputy sheriff hurl him down a flight of stairs while he was handcuffed with his hands behind his back and a cop on each side. The deputy, who was the verbal abuser, claimed he tried to "escape" -- an outright lie. The prisoner suffered a hernia from the fall and had to have surgery to correct it.

    The last I heard the new DSM was trying to get the law changed to only one doctor required to do this. And I have seen cases, mainly in the South, where "judges" (elected good 'ole boys who don't have a legal education) grant these motions. They are often later found to be in error and are reversed, but that's too late for the people they have already harmed.
     
    taniaaust1 likes this.
  13. SOC

    SOC Senior Member

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    There's no question that there's always abuse -- in every system. Still, they had to be able to document he was an immediate threat to himself, someone else, or the public. Depending on the nature of his threats, they may have had that legal documentation.

    And yes, the South does seem to have a greater number of legal abuses due to the good ole boy system still in place in many rural areas, but it happens in other places as well.

    Since you are an independent witness to the abuse of a prisoner, I hope you filed a complaint.
     
  14. Ren

    Ren Primum Non Nocere

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    South-bashing and widespread and accepted stereotyping is part of why many Southerners would gladly leave the union.
     
  15. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    Good point, Ren. And the 'good ole boy' system is just dressed up differently in the Wall Street/1%/corporate lobbyist systems.
     
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  16. Nielk

    Nielk

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  17. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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  18. Iquitos

    Iquitos Senior Member

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    No, they didn't document anything. They simply abused their positions of power to do this without any documentation at all.

    I did not put myself in harms way by filing a complaint. Just as in other cases, those who try to defend the abused often get threatened with the same treatment. I had already experienced abuse by the racist doctor who instigated this scenario. He didn't like it because I, a white person, associated with non-whites. He actually commented on this to other medical personel while I was being admitted to the emergency room. He, and the racist cop, used their positions to try to inforce racial segregation and racism against the prisoner, who also associated with non-whites.

    Being a person who judges others on the content of their character and on their intellectual capacity, instead of the color of their skin -- this was the "threat" these guys were against. If the doctor and the cop were to be judged by the content of their character and/or their intellectual capacity, they would both be definite losers. They didn't want their positions of white male superiority challenged. If this doctor had been, for instance, a black woman, he would never have got into medical school let alone graduated. As it was, he had to repeat one year. He later lost his license due to too many malpractice suits, and went back to ranching where he should have stayed in the first place.

    My only solution was to move to a state where this kind of behavior is not commonly accepted.
     
  19. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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  20. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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