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Can You Come for a Visit? My ME/CFS Says No
My daughter and son-in-law just had a baby last week. We are thrilled. But we won't be able to see the baby or hold her any time soon. We won't be able to take over little gifts or help out with housework or babysitting.
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Another Medical Kidnapping

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by leela, Dec 2, 2013.

  1. Nielk

    Nielk

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    That's great news! If Dershowitz takes in the case, I'm confident a that they will win.
     
    Sea and rosie26 like this.
  2. Hell...Hath...No...Fury..

    Hell...Hath...No...Fury.. Senior Member

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    It looks like there'll be more of this going on in future. Just seen this on RT news:

    'For the first time in history, the UK is planning to introduce the so-called Cinderella law, which will jail parents failing to show love to children for up to 10 years in prison, putting it alongside physical or sexual abuse, local media reported.

    The UK government is planning to introduce changes to child neglect laws, which will make emotional cruelty a crime for the first time, according to Daily Telegraph report. The law will protect childrens emotional, social and behavioral well-being.'

    Hope the 'saved children' won't be snatched by shrinks for 'treatment' during the parent's 10 year jail sentence (or enough time to institutionalise the child) I see more medical kidnapping afoot in future. Or maybe i'm just cynical these days :(
     
  3. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/...family-to-take-up-offer-from-alan-dershowitz/


     
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  4. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    taniaaust1, Snowdrop, Iquitos and 5 others like this.
  5. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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  6. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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  7. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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    It's good to see signs of progress. Though the political context which some people are putting it into is pretty nuts, and might be part of the reason it hasn't gotten wider attention. Emphasizing the religious and evil-government aspects undermines credibility and is probably scaring off a lot of media.
     
  8. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    I agree, @Valentijn, and think it's a shame the other news outlets have not been staying on the human and civil rights abuses that are exemplified in this case. There have been articles in Slate and the Boston Globe, but the Fox/Blaze have been the only ones to hammer on it continuously--that's what they do over there, hammer on stuff. I appreciate that *someone* is staying with it, but it is a shame that it's a media bloc that has a reputation for being skewed and myopically anti-govmint.

    If I were the parents, though, I'd be taking whatever help I could get to get the word out. There's no way to go this one alone.
     
    Valentijn likes this.
  9. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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    Yeah, definitely. I wish they'd stop with the religious freedom angle though. Every article and pretty much every interview with the parents mentions Justina not being able to go to church. While church is probably important to the family, it's likely an extremely minor concern in the context of their child being kidnapped.

    But the parents use it as pretty much the only tool they have left, even though it's utterly doomed to failure. One problem is that the focus on church is making them look similar to religious kooks who deny medical care for their children. This is obviously not the case, but people who don't read the articles closely (most people) will see the religious stuff, the disagreement with doctors about medical care, and jump to a certain conclusion.

    The other problem with using the religious aspect is that it's obviously BS to a certain extent. Yes, church is important to them, but they're making a big fuss over a relatively minor issue. Hence it's a somewhat insincere argument for them to make, and the more rational types will pick up on that and it costs them credibility.

    The parents are probably living in a rather conservative and religious community, and are accustomed to certain arguments being persuasive in that community. But they need to face the reality of those arguments being dismissed by government agencies and the rest of the country. Hence the family really needs to stay focused on the legal, scientific, and rational aspects, with limited and reasonable emotional appeals as a driving force behind those aspects.

    The nurse and lawyers are doing an excellent job of that, but the parents are undermining it by engaging in a purely emotional context. It's not fair that they should be forced to behave in such a way over such an obvious and outrageous injustice, but that doesn't make it any less necessary.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
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  10. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    So right on, @Valentijn . You know, it's funny, I'd actually totally skimmed over the religious aspect because it is of so little relevance to me. :alien:
    I mean like almost totally blocked it out. It might be actually useful to leave a comment like what you said above on the free justina page; it's so insightful:

    "[the family is perhaps] accustomed to certain arguments being persuasive in [their local] community. But they need to face the reality of those arguments being dismissed by government agencies and the rest of the country. Hence the family really needs to stay focused on the legal, scientific, and rational aspects, with limited and reasonable emotional appeals as a driving force behind those aspects."

    There is in this situation such a gross violation of civil and human rights which ought to have already been enough to end this a year ago.
     
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  11. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    I totally agree with you.

    But at the same time, I find very very shocking that the girl was not allowed to attend church, or meet a priest (and I am not religious at all!!). What's the rationale for not allowing her to have a religious activity? What is the psychiatric contraindication of that??? For people who believe in God, faith is a strong support, I don't see any reasonable argument that justifies her being preventing from religious help.
     
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  12. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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    While Justine was imprisoned at Boston Children's Hospital, it was a simple consequence of that imprisonment. Letting her go to church would have also allowed the family have less-supervised contact with her. Basically it was fall-out from the kidnapping itself, rather than specific denial of freedom to practice a religion.
     
  13. peggy-sue

    peggy-sue

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    I had to go for a pre-op assessment in hospital recently - there was a huge emphasis on having access to a priest or a minister all throughout the process (not that I wanted it) it was something given the same importance as having a translator if English wasn't the patient's first language!
    And this isn't a madly religious country.
     
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  14. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    I heard about Justina on National Public Radio today. It was a short piece but factually correct.
     
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  15. beaker

    beaker CFS/ME 1986

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    Do churches still offer sanctuary? Maybe the thinking is if she went to church she could escape their clutches by asking for sanctuary and not leave. I don't know what the legal standing of that is anymore. But I'm sure certain churches would still offer it in special circumstances, even if that meant they were in trouble w/ the law.
     
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  16. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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  17. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    She might not be well enough to leave the hospital. She's probably on an IV and meds that can't be stopped abruptly as well.

    They've well and truly got her in their clutches and I only hope the new facility is a step in the right direction.
     
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  18. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    @Ema, unfortunately for everyone, she's not in a hospital, she's in a child welfare facility and is being refused medical treatment.
    That has been the case even when she was in the hospital, in a locked psych ward.
     
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  19. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    Really? I figured they had her drugged up on psych meds when she was in the hospital.
     
  20. leela

    leela Slow But Hopeful

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    Oh yeah, psych meds. :bang-head: I haven't had enough green tea yet today!

    Either way, why restrict visitation so drastically from her regular social network--church, friends, family, dog, internet--
    it's really a form of torture for anyone, let alone a young teenager. The whole situation is completely out of hand.
    I don't care what they believe is wrong "in her head" or "in her family"; the treatment is inhumane no matter what is going on.
    These people have all been brutalised, and continue to be so. I hope this truly is a step towards a positive conclusion, because
    this family has a lot of healing to do. It's going to take some real strength to feel okay after something like this.
     

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