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Adverse reactions to NT Factor, anyone?

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by CFS_for_19_years, Feb 21, 2014.

  1. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    I recently started taking small doses of the NT Factor powder, which has nothing but the glycophospholipids, no vitamins. I developed fluid in my left ear which my doctor looked at and told me was not an infection. I'm following up with an allergist next week to see what's going on. I haven't had ear problems like this in a long time and it seemed to coincide with the time I started taking NT Factor.

    The directions on the container say that sensitive individuals may need to start at a lower dose than what is recommended in the instructions, so I lowered my dose. I'm still having mild ear symptoms. I'm avoiding dairy, like I normally do.

    A few people have said that they weren't able to tolerate NT Factor and I was wondering if anyone can say with a bit more detail what problems they encountered. It's not really helpful when someone says they "crashed" or started "herxing." If you could kindly share what exact symptoms you had, I would appreciate it. For example, did you develop a headache, sore throat, nausea,...etc.? Were you able to continue once you lowered the dose a bit? Thank yooooooooooooou! :D
    merylg likes this.
  2. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    Interesting, perhaps you were allergic to one of the inactive ingredients? I never heard of an allergy response issue but I imagine if you are sensitive to supplements and what not anything is possible... Do not think people would have SEVERE reactions though only minor things...

    I have a very bad case of Lyme and I have been taking it with no Herxes... Not sure of any other illness which causes herxing though?
  3. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    @CFS_for_19_years

    Actually maybe be careful with the supplement if you are having that reaction just found this info on the net

    Possible link to heart disease[edit]
    A growing body of evidence indicates lecithin is converted by gut bacteria into trimethylamine-N-oxide(TMAO), which is released into circulation, and may with time contribute to atherosclerosisand heart attacks.[21]
  4. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    Thanks for posting this, although I don't think it's affecting me this way at the moment, but this may be something to think about long-term.

    My best guess is that some healing is going on; old dilapidated cellular and mitochondrial membranes are being repaired and intracellular bacteria are being released. My doc said there was a lot of fluid in my ear. I haven't had ear problems in at least ten years. The discomfort can be controlled with 30mg of Sudafed, but I don't tolerate Sudafed well due to dry eyes and mild hypertension, and it really turns up the volume on pulsatile tinnitus, something I can do without.

    I'm going to ask the allergist about Mycoplasma and other intracellular bacteria. I've been tested for Lyme and I was negative (done by a Lyme-literate MD). Since I belong to an HMO, they will only do testing which they feel is helpful. I'll probably get the usual skin-prick testing, but other tests, I don't know.
  5. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    Did you get IgeneX testing? A lot of the times it won't show up even with the really good labs, its not an easy illness to catch on testing unless you are really lucky..

    The easiest way to find out is to see if you have any herx reactions to antibiotics or herbal antibiotics like samento or cats claw... the larger percentage of people with lyme will usually have at least one noticable herx reaction from antibiotics while on a month of use.. I seem to get them everytime though :(

    Actually its the dangerous levels of ammonia that cause herxing, which triggers a rise in symptoms...

    Something to look into..

    http://beatinglymedisease.blogspot.com/2009/11/although-many-people-have-heard-of.html

    and you could always do the poor mans ammonia test to see if you have issues related to this, if there is possible underlying lyme infection...

    "I remembered that Dr. J. said that most doctors can do an ammonia test for the whole body as ammonia is present wherever the lyme spirochetes are, primarily the liver, heart, teeth, and cranium.

    To perform a "direct resonance test" the doctor will need a vial of pure ammonia. A muscle strength challenge should be performed to identify a strong muscle. Once a good strong muscle has been identified, hold the vial of ammonia over various areas of the brain, testing to see if the previously strong muscle goes weak when the ammonia is held over any area.

    Due to the temporary neuromuscular interference caused by the ammonia in the vial with the ammonia present in the brain, the strong muscle will go weak.

    The best effective treatment can be identified by adding the corrective substance such as Pale Spike Lobelia and/or the NeuroAntitox Formulas. Dr. J. also mentions Wobenzym-N as a strong enzyme supplement."
    CFS_for_19_years likes this.
  6. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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    @CFS_for_19_years - NTfactor can contain creatine, which is something that people can react badly to. I tried creatine and my chronic mild edema became a lot less mild. It also contains soy, which can be problematic.
    merylg likes this.
  7. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    Thanks @Martial I reviewed my serology results from 2007 and I can't tell which lab it was sent to as my HMO sent it out to a reference lab. At one point the results were equivocal and I recall being given some doxycycline (?) which I couldn't tolerate. The doctor ordering the tests did not belong to my HMO so he could be a bit more aggressive with ordering tests and having my primary doc OK them.

    Thanks @Valentijn I don't see creatine listed as one of the ingredients of plain NT Factor, which is what I'm taking. However, creatine IS in the "Healthy Aging" NT Factor supplement, which is a combination of NT Factor and several other vitamins. This is the product:

    http://www.nutricology.com/NT-Factor-EnergyLipids-Powder-150-grams-p-16730.html

    In 2007 I tested positive for various delayed-type food sensitivities, soy being one of them, but supposedly all the soy protein has been stripped away from this product and I regularly eat foods that have soy in them like protein bars and have no problems with them at all.

    I've stopped the NT Factor for the time being and my ear feels better. I'm not crying over an earache, but I'm just intensely curious as to why these things happen, as it's been many years since I've had ear problems like this. I'm especially interested if a reaction such as this leads to better therapeutic decisions down the road. I'm seeing the allergist Tuesday so I'll see if he has an opinion on this.

    If I do start back on NT Factor, I'm going to use a much smaller dose, like 100mg, not 1g.
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2014
    Little Bluestem, Valentijn and merylg like this.
  8. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    @Martial, I'm going to take a closer look at the ammonia article and this protocol as I doubt "regular" medicine, especially from an HMO, will do much to help me:

    http://www.beatlymenaturally.com/treatment-outline/

    Whether I have Lyme or any other intracellular stuff, I don't know, but I have a lot of these supplements and I'm going to be sure to take them in the right order. I also have confirmed heavy metals (mercury, lead, cadmium) for which I did chelation therapy under the care of an MD in 2007. I've been sick now for 23 years, and at 60 I feel my time is running out to make positive changes as the body takes longer and longer to heal as we age.

    I find the area of herbal antibiotics very interesting to say the least.
  9. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    You can treat lyme, parasites, certain viral illness, or candida with the Cowden protocol... This was especially made for lyme disease but the products are also natural anti bacterial, anti viral, and anti fungals.

    Here is a link... It is also regarded as one of the highest rates of recovery for many people, even those who were unresponsive to traditional antibiotics.. Plus not toxic on the system...

    Based on what you said earlier I think its fair to say you have lyme as well, the fact you were tested positive enough to warrent abx treatment. You will definitely still have it and need to treat it if that is the case!

    http://www.nutramedix.ec/ns/lyme-protocol
    Tiger Lily 813 likes this.
  10. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    The doctor I saw eventually decided I didn't have Lyme, and maybe the doxycycline was for an evocative (urine) test that I never completed. There were some other serologies run for other intracellular organisms at the same time, which came back negative. After paying him lots of $$$ for chelation therapy, he was offering his services to me to investigate Lyme FOR FREE (lab and supplements not included) so if there had been some certainty that I did have it, we would have followed through. I'm definitely not a passive patient. I'm not always right, but I don't take on a passive role.

    I'm a retired Medical Technologist, so scrutinizing these tests doesn't come too hard to me, but I think the science of Lyme and intracellular organisms is still developing. I think it will be up to me to just follow one of these Lyme protocols and see how it goes. Thanks for the link to Nutramedix.

    Onset of CFS Dec. 1990
    Lots of visits to naturopath 1991 to 1994
    Breast implants removed 1994....check
    Heavy metal chelation 2007....check
    Mercury dental amalgams removed 2007.....check
    Lyme protocol....2014....oh well I have nothing better to do and if I'm going to live another 30 years like my parents did I'd best get on with it.
  11. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    Haha okay man! I hope this all works out for you then! You definitely are in the right place that is for sure!

    By chance did you ever use fred's methylation protocol to treat the CFS? That could be your cure right there if you haven't had success or not already.. If lyme is not a factor, the methylation would help if there is lyme but the infection would need to be treated for remission.

    Good luck!
  12. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    @MartiaI, I did Freddd's protocol briefly and it made me worse, so I then went to Ben Lynch's protocol, which has worked out OK, but then I became a lot more interested in pumping supplements into my mitochondria (CoQ10, carnitine, NT Factor, etc.).

    I want to:
    1. Get rid of the cooties, whatever they are, wherever they may be (Lyme, mycoplasma, viruses, etc.)
    2. Repair and rebuild cells and mitochondria.
    3. Follow somebody's methylation protocol that won't make me worse.

    NT Factor helps get nutrients into the cells.

    I feel that getting rid of viruses and bacteria is #1 priority, as they will suck literally suck all the life out of your cells so they can't make any ATP any more. Adding supplements to infected cells is like a band-aid because you will never get rid of the cause.
  13. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    I agree, you need to support the cells and treat the underlying infection at the same time, Do you know why you got worse on Fred's protocol though? Was is possibly paradoxical folate deficiency or potassium deficiency? I think his protocol is the best you just got to make it through the detoxing and make sure to avoid any methyl traps!

    Anyways I hope you find what works best for you and heal soon man!

    Regards,

    Todd
  14. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    @Martial I don't know why Freddd's protocol didn't work for me. As long as I can find one methylation protocol that doesn't make me feel worse, I'll do it, I just won't make it a priority at the moment. It's something I'll do down the road after I get my cell membranes repaired, so the nutrients like methylfolate and B12 can actually GET IN.

    By the way, I know it's cool to say "man", but I'm a dudette. I've also been a member here for 4 years and I've been lurking for the most part up until a few months ago when I became curious about methylation protocols. I've found this forum to be the best place to find how people respond to different treatments.

    Thanks for your help man, I mean Todd! It's all cool bro!
  15. Martial

    Martial Senior Member

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    hahaha sorry, damn internet makes it hard to tell gender at times, I have california phonetics as well... I think its just my age group playing a role lol.

    I hear you, so with the cell membrane repairs you are using COQ10, and the NT factor?

    I am interested in this because I am not sure what else is meant to repair it!

    by the way I hear PQQ is another great addition for mitochondrial and cell health.

    using both COQ10 and PQQ at the same time doubles the effectiveness!
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2014
  16. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    I love PQQ and find it energizing. I also take shilajit (mineral pitch) which increases CoQ10 levels in the cell. Acetyl-L-carnitine and R-alpha lipoic acid are also helpful. There is a thread here that you might find useful:

    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/reverse-mitochondrial-damage-101.28175
  17. kyzcreig

    kyzcreig

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    That sounds a lot like me @CFS_for_19_years do you have a link to the Ben Lynch protocol you're using? He has a lot of different ones, mostly evolved over the years. Have you done a Ben Lynch phone consultation?

    RE: NT Factor
    I generally react negatively to all phosphatidyl supplements. I'm not sure why. Typically it's my usual symptoms as well as exacerbating whatever else. But I do feel an increase in energy and memory. Interestingly I didn't have any reactions when I did the PK protocol (phosphatidyl IVs). So my guess is it's a problem with the gut, possibly a problem with the ONOO cycle and mast cells. It could have to do with microbes but I doubt it since miscellaneous foods precipitate the same symptoms and rifaximin/diflucan didn't help.

    edit: What brand of shilajit are you using?
  18. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    The fluid in my ear may have been a result of an allergic reaction to milk products - the casein in whey protein drinks. I've just finished my first container of NT Lipids. They haven't improved me or made me any worse, that I can tell.

    I haven't been on Ben Lynch's methylation protocol for a while because I've been doing other things, but here's a link:
    http://mthfr.net/mthfr-c677t-mutation-basic-protocol/2012/02/24/

    If you scroll down to Part II on that page, the first sentence says:
    Methylfolate Recommendations for those homozygous for the C677T MTHFR Mutation

    From there forward you can see the stepwise recommendations. Dr. Lynch has his own line of supplements, but you can certainly use your own.

    What we refer to as "startup" at Phoenix Rising, he calls "detox." I don't know which term is more accurate, but they seem to be the same constellation of symptoms.

    I can't say whether you should be tested for the C677T mutation. I don't have the means to afford the test or to be seen by a nutritionally-oriented doctor, so I'm just going to see how I respond to the supplements and go from there.

    I did not have a phone consultation with Dr. Lynch.

    I've tried two different brands of shilajit with great success. I first tried it as a bulk powder because I was curious about seeing what it looked like before it went into capsules:

    http://healthsupplementwholesalers.com/products/shilajit

    That worked OK and then swansonvitamins had a sale, so I tried their shilajit, which also worked well for me:

    http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-superior-herbs-shilajit-extract-400-mg-60-veg-caps
  19. kyzcreig

    kyzcreig

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  20. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years Senior Member

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    I've bought resveratrol there, among other things. If you don't mind getting your hands a little messy you can pack your own capsules and save some money. Be sure to buy one of their scales if you're going to be making your own capsules. I pack some capsules by hand and pack some using a manual capsule filling machine. I weigh 10 packed capsules and divide by 10 to determine how much is in each capsule. (Don't forget to subtract the weight of the capsule.) Put everything on a flat dinner plate because it does get messy.

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